They didn't need to show 'dangers' every episode. TNG got by with many interesting anomaly of the week episodes, political episodes, diplomatic episodes. One of TNG's best episodes is a courtroom drama. ENT relied way too heavily on 90% of all species being hostile and everything needing violence/danger. DS9, a series built around a war, had plenty of episodes that didn't revolve around violent themes.
ENT showcasing more violence is actually pretty appropriate since part of its whole reason for being was showing the early days of humanity exploring the galaxy. These were the days before the Federation, when the majority of the known galaxy was a very divided and dangerous place to explore. It took the Federation to finally bring peace and the rule of law to the region.
I assume you are being serious [and not ironic] but I must disagree. You make the pre-Federation Alpha/Beta quadrants sound like the Wild West. "A very divided and dangerous place to explore" is just supposition [although with the ammount of violence depicted in ENT I can see why you would think that way]. The Federation is supposedly made up of 150 worlds, this implies that a large ammount of species came together with mutual respect for the same ideals [over the proceeding 200 years]. In ENT it seems like Humanity, Vulcans, Andorians and Tellarites are the only species who could actually be a part of this Federation because pretty much every other group depicted are violent/evil etc. Funnily enough, this is an accusation that is thrown at Voyager also. I'm not against violence in Trek, and plenty of it in ENT was exciting, but I think ENT could have done a far better job of instilling the wonder of exploring the final frontier, the nebulas, the anomalies, space creatures etc instead of every new moon/planet harbouring another group of bad guys.
Which as I said, I can see why you feel that way but it can't actually be that way as supposedly 150 worlds join the Federation, which should imply plenty of species are not fascist monsters as most in ENT are depicted as. ENT just wanted to have violent stories most weeks [so ship in the Borg, Ferengi, create the Xindi] but it largely overlooked the positive relations Earth/Vulcan etc must have had with other species. Though again to reiterate, my original point was that ENT lacks in stories that don't contain some kind of violent element.
One hundred and fifty worlds join the Federation over the course of two hundred years. It's not like it happened overnight. Humans were violent and dangerous before they eventually learned to channel their aggression toward more beneficial endeavors. Obviously not every world that joined the Federation must have been violent and only became civilized because of the Federation, but the very obvious implication in ENT was that the galactic region which the proto-Federation worlds inhabited was dangerous and the Federation played a huge role in fixing that. And if you think Star Trek was about the wonder of exploring the final frontier, the nebulas, the anomalies, etc., then I'm not sure which show you were watching. The nebulas, anomalies, space creatures, etc., were always just a means to tell an entertaining story. Star Trek was always an adventure program first and foremost.
Diplomatic fetch quests, long conversations about how to apply the prime directive, and holodeck adventures -obviously. A ridiculous generalisation. Positive relations = no story. Broken Bow - exploration, diplomacy, politics, anomaly Fight or Flight - exploration, ethical dilemma Strange New World - exploration, anomaly Unexpected - alien encounter, diplomacy, ethical dilemma Terra Nova - exploration, cultural speculation, diplomacy, ethical dilemma Andorian Incident - diplomacy & politics Breaking the Ice - exploration, diplomacy Civilisation - exploration, ethical dilemma Fortunate Son - political & ethical dilemma Cold Front - exploration, anomaly Silent Enemy - exploration, diplomacy Dear Doctor - exploration, ethical dilemma Sleeping Dogs - ethical & political dilemma Shadows of P'Jem - politics, diplomacy Shuttlepod One - ethical dilemma Fusion - ethical dilemma Rogue Planet - exploration, anomaly, ethical dilemma Acquisition - straight forward adventure Oasis - exploration, anomaly, ethical dilemma Detained - politics & diplomacy Vox Sola - anomaly, ethical dilemma Fallen Hero - politics & diplomacy Desert Crossing - exploration, politics & diplomacy, ethical dilemma Two days two nights - exploration Shockwave part 1 - exploration, politics, ethical dilemma And that's just the first season.
Storytelling is about drama. Drama = conflict. In an action show about trailblazing space explorers, conflict would logically often take the form of danger and risk of death. And defending against that danger with weapons. But look, a show like "Similitude" was 95% character study and psychodrama brimming with conflict as it explored a terrible dilemma, but it began with a violent explosion that gravely injured a main character and got the drama rolling.
I just finished a rewatch of ENT (well, most of it--I skipped a bunch of season 2). After all this time, the only characters I still even found remotely interesting were Trip and T'Pol (specifically, 3rd & 4th season T'Pol, when they made her actually look like a Vulcan and not some weird elf thing with front bumps). The Xindi season got really boring, the 4th season was better--but not much. The whole 4th season felt rushed. My gosh, was Spiner playing a Soong or a Soong-type android? I thought I was watching Lore.
"A ridiculous generalisation" is just a meaningless statement.What I said is entirely true: over 200 years 150 worlds join the Federation. If we go by ENT's depiction of the quadrants, it's difficult to see where these species could possibly have come from due to the overabundance of hostiles. Your final statement is a generalisation. Positive relations can still lead to a story, violence isn't the only route through which a story can be told. I also find your episode list weird...many of those episodes involve violent themes. When your go-to method of building an episode is 'evil aliens threaten the ship/character' that becomes a trope very quickly. Just to highlight my point: I will overlook the episodes you have skipped but I will highlight that I think you and I are discussing different things. You have just given a list of the themes each episode touches on ["politics and diplomacy"] which isn't the point I am making. The point was that ENT is consistently reliant on violence to get there. Many episodes just dissolve into "evil alien attacks us", its something VOY was slaughtered for and ENT got similar criticism.
The optimism of STAR TREK has been downplayed, considerably, however. I really hate Starfleet's Section 31 and I will always be resentful of Ira Steven Behr's introduction of this element into the STAR TREK franchise. Although there are Real Life comparisons to be made, such as The USA's Patriot Act, or NSA, the fact was that it was only introduced out of resentment towards "Gene's Vision." Ira and others in the Rick Berman years hated its restrictions and sought every opportunity to "darken" it, as much as possible ... to make their job easy, or easier. And it was never allowed to just "die." They kept bringing it up, in Enterprise, every chance Times do change, however ... It's so easy for us to forget, or to be unaware, of how chaotic and difficult the Sixties were. Vietnam, race riots, political assassinations and dramatic societal changes were all in full force. It wasn't occasional, it was unremitting. So out of that world comes an entertainment outlet on television reminding audiences that there's still cause for hope. That tonality is what made TOS and TNG so unique in sci-fi. Unfortunately, it ended up becoming unique within the franchise, as well. TNG did have opportunity to make snide jokes at itself for being presented as utopian ... like the episode "Conspiracy," or the character of Lt. Barclay. But the hopefulness remained, for the most part. It would be nice to see that become reinstated. The way the world is now, it sure could use it.
It was certainly part of your point, as you were implying that ENT showed dangerous situations at the expense of anomaly/political/diplomatic themes, so I showed that those themes were regularly addressed. And are you really saying TNG dealt with such things without threats or dangers? Danger often underlay TNG eps, even if it was more often addressed verbally that actually shown. One TNG ep often held up as exemplary Trek, Measure of a Man, is certainly based on a threat of violence, as the plot hinges on the threat of Data being killed. OTOH it would be false to say there are no or very few TNG or TOS episodes involving threats of violence, but you are going into this determined to hate anything that isn't "your" Star Trek. I don't want to stereotype all TNG fans, because 2takesfrakes is a friend of the show, but sometimes it seems there are fans for whom TNG at its worst (bureaucratic &/or trivial) represents what all Trek should be aiming for. Also, you are deliberately ignoring the whole premise of ENT, which is that space pre-Federation was more dangerous than later eras. It was the wild west. Very few interstellar treaties, no laws regarding space travel, i.e. piracy, colonisation, etc, and no body to enforce these laws if they did exist. In a society without laws, the strong prey on the weak, and every stranger is regarded as a potential enemy. This is what ENT shows. If the situation was different, if there was no conflict and no danger, thus no need for treaties and laws as a counter to anarchy and violence, then there would be no point in the Federation, thus rendering every series later in the timeline redundant.
eyeresist…aim your ire, and your fire, at the post, not the poster. Presumptuous and personal statements like the one above are not very civil. Then don't. Better yet, don't stereotype any of them.
1. No I didn't. I merely stated that ENT relied too heavily on overt violence. Phase pistols, phase cannons, torpedos and violence play a large role in many episodes. 2. No. I'm saying the other Trek's did a better job of having more episodes that completely ignored violent themes or [at least] were not so overt with them. Something like 'The Inner Light' or 'The Measure of a Man' was beyond the abilities of ENT's writers. 3. This whole silly rant is very clarifying: I think you are arguing with yourself here. I love ENT [have it on Blu-ray and DVD etc] so you are just creating...things...to rant about. That "determined to hate" part is bizarre. [I suspect you aren't really reading my posts and I'm wasting my time here. I explicitly stated S3&4 were excellent.] 4. Which is a monotone thing to show. The show didn't need to be that way. Relying on random hostile aliens and portraying space as the wild west is simple and easy writing. I would have had a greater appreciation if there was more actual exploration, more races who were friendly. This whole "pre-Federation everything was wild" is just painfully simplistic, boringly formulaic and not very realistic. There SHOULD have been treaties, there should have been relations established long before the humans ventured into space. It all has a colonial-era, "we will tame the savages" vibe to it that wasn't necessary. To reiterate once again, VOY was panned for having a similar 'enemy of the week' vibe to it.
But you said and You were definitely suggesting a dichotomy: one thing at the expense of the other. And I'm saying you can have both. Action and physical danger in Trek are bad, right? But you despise seasons 1 and 2. I'm saying they actually have many good things, you are saying they don't, or if they do they are utterly cancelled out by the presence of violent themes. Again I reiterate: if during the time of ENT everything was la-la-la and holding hands, what exactly was the point of the Federation? The colonialist accusation doesn't hold up to any scrutiny. It was the later-set series that were about imposing Federation ideals on unreformed aliens. ENT was simply about trying to form positive diplomatic relations. All that said, there were a number of relatively friendly alien encounters: socialising with aliens in Broken Bow, The Seventh, Two days two nights; having essentially friendly encounters with new aliens in Fight or Flight, Unexpected, Civilization, Cold Front, Dear Doctor, Rogue Planet, Oasis, Detained (meeting the good Suliban), Vox Sola, Carbon Creek. A night in sickbay, Marauders, Dawn, Cease Fire (our heroes stop a war), Canamar (apart from the whole false imprisonment thing), Judgment (meeting a good Klingon), Cogenitor (until Trip screws it up). Now let's look at the "excellent" seasons 3 and 4: 3 was almost entirely about war and conflict - evil Xindi threatening genocide and stabbing each other in the back, plus our heroes turning to piracy and torture. In season 4 we saw: Storm Front 1 & 2, which our heroes fight aliens who have allied with Nazis; Home, in which Phlox is physically threatened by humans who hate aliens; the Augments arc, which is full of shooting, punching and threats of death, the Vulcan arc, which includes all that plus kicks off with a deadly bomb explosion and includes a prolonged scene of an Andorian torturing a Vulcan, Observer Effect, in which "enlightened" aliens impassively watch the Enterprise succumb to a deadly infection; the Andorian arc, in which the Romulans are killing people in an effort to start a war, while Andorians, Tellarites and humans are at each other's throat for most of the arc (including a duel to the death between Archer and Shran); the Klingon arc, in which Phlox is kidnapped by Klingons, followed by near-constant fighting between humans and Klingons; Bound, in which devious aliens seize control of Enterprise; In A Mirror Darkly, obviously full of violence and conflict; the Terra Prime arc, in which alien-hating humans seize a weapon of mass destruction; TATV, in which alien criminals invade the ship. Why do you focus only on the action and conflict in seasons 1 and 2, but ignore it in seasons 3 and 4?
I'd suggest fist fights and phasers made up as big a part of The Original Series as it did Enterprise.
1. You are still missing the point. ENT didn't have both in it's first two seasons. It relied on cheap action and bad-guys-of-the-week to get by. ENT relied frequently on violence/hostiles/conflict to get its themes across.I have already highlighted this to you in a previous post. ENT is very formulaic in its first two seasons. 2. I'm just going to stop there as this is becoming very silly. I think you are intent on creating an issue here, and fighting a cause, that is intrinsically in your mind. I can't have a rational discussion with someone who is putting words in my mouth and seeing phantoms in each paragraph. I assume ENT is your favourite Trek and you are thus defensive of it [due to the criticism it gets] but reacting so defensively when people say anything bad about ENT that you don't agree with really, really isn't constructive. Because seasons 3 & 4 are vastly better written and the violent themes in those episodes works much, much better and doesn't feel shoehorned in for the sake of cheap drama. It is part of the reason S3&4 get far more praise than the first two: they are far better written.
Season 3 was well-written. Season 4 was well-structured. The writing wasn't as strong, otherwise. It needed flavour, if you like. More seasoning ...
And now you're getting personal too. *sigh* GoodStuff, eyeresist, I need you both to focus on the discussion rather than each other, and agree to disagree. Because you sure as hell disagree. If you cannot do this, please take a break from each other.