Revisiting ST-TNG...
- Thread starter Warped9
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"Second Chances" ***
While investigating a deserted outpost Riker encounters a duplicate of himself.
There's an interesting story in this, the idea of meeting yourself where you've each taken different paths in life. How much of you would remain the same and how much of you would change? Frakes does a decent job of portraying a younger version of himself (mentally speaking). It's somewhat understandable since the duplicate Riker hasn't had the same experiences and responsibilities as the Riker we already know.
That said I found this somewhat slow. It's okay, but I think could have been better. There's also the issue of how did the reflected transporter form a duplicate Riker? Where did the matter come from to rematerialize him? Of course this is the same problem with the duplicate Kirks in TOS' "The Enemy Within."---where does the extra matter come from to form the duplicate?
While investigating a deserted outpost Riker encounters a duplicate of himself.
There's an interesting story in this, the idea of meeting yourself where you've each taken different paths in life. How much of you would remain the same and how much of you would change? Frakes does a decent job of portraying a younger version of himself (mentally speaking). It's somewhat understandable since the duplicate Riker hasn't had the same experiences and responsibilities as the Riker we already know.
That said I found this somewhat slow. It's okay, but I think could have been better. There's also the issue of how did the reflected transporter form a duplicate Riker? Where did the matter come from to rematerialize him? Of course this is the same problem with the duplicate Kirks in TOS' "The Enemy Within."---where does the extra matter come from to form the duplicate?
Vastly more generous than I am. This is one episode I just can't stand. It's too OTT with the "religious" undertones and deus ex machina (isn't in interesting the cloned Kahless shows up just when Worf is visiting the moon?)
And the Klingon stories had run their course by this point on the series. I do think that, however, Kahless or shown, or at least mentioned, in both Voyager and DS9.
Now Second Chances was a great little episode. I'd give it 3.5 stars. I was always a big fan of Riker/Troi--always thought it was one of the few romances that felt genuine and that I rooted for--owing in small part to the natural chemistry shared between Frakes and Sirtis.
And the episode managed to successfully add suspense as to which Riker might survive. I'm glad they didn't kill off Thomas that would have been the safe predictable route.
To me is the start of a nice strong three episode finish to the season with Timescape being another wonderful Brannon high concept mystery episode and Descent being a griping season finale featuring the Borg.
And the episode managed to successfully add suspense as to which Riker might survive. I'm glad they didn't kill off Thomas that would have been the safe predictable route.
To me is the start of a nice strong three episode finish to the season with Timescape being another wonderful Brannon high concept mystery episode and Descent being a griping season finale featuring the Borg.
I like "Second Chances." It still has the same technical problem that a number of Trek episodes run into (including "The Enemy Within," which you cite), but I think it has something more interesting to say than the good/evil dichotomy presented in the TOS episode.
It's a shame TNG wasn't the kind of series that could have killed of William Riker and replaced him with his twin, though. Thomas Riker will appear once more, on Star Trek: Deep Space Nine, but he would have had potential as a regular. Alas, TNG never was willing to shake things up to such a degree (and it's understandable--introducing a new character is one thing, but a new character that looks exactly like the old character--pretty confusing when episodes are aired in every which order in syndication).
It's a shame TNG wasn't the kind of series that could have killed of William Riker and replaced him with his twin, though. Thomas Riker will appear once more, on Star Trek: Deep Space Nine, but he would have had potential as a regular. Alas, TNG never was willing to shake things up to such a degree (and it's understandable--introducing a new character is one thing, but a new character that looks exactly like the old character--pretty confusing when episodes are aired in every which order in syndication).
I got the impression that the Klingon priests (or whatever they were) were waiting for just the right moment to reveal the cloned Kahless and Worf's presence was an opportunity they chose to seize upon.
...plus it was in the script.
I got the impression that the Klingon priests (or whatever they were) were waiting for just the right moment to reveal the cloned Kahless and Worf's presence was an opportunity they chose to seize upon.
...plus it was in the script.
Yeah, someone like Worf who had his feet planted firmly in both Starfleet AND the Empire would be an ideal choice.
Plus, of all the Klingons out there, he was probably one of few left that still had any idea of what real honour was. They could trust him.
I also think Worf looks silly with the ponytail. It's so '90s.
Eh, it's better than the pageboy cut.
Ach, you and your "slow" and "low energy" nonsense. What would you have preferred, if the two Rikers had ripped off their shirts and had a fist fight in a desert full of styrofoam rocks?
Come on, I love TNG, and disagree with the frequency with which he finds that particular issue a problem (and personally feel that TOS uses slower pacing more often than TNG) but in this particular episode I think he has a point. Second Chances really sags in the middle third, with the plot meandering and lacking tension; the pacing just doesn't work.
While I do not agree on all his points (I happen to like season 3-6 of Star Trek TNG) I am also doing a run though TNG and It been fun to see all the responses.
Well, alright, since you're a fan of Mary Poppins and therefore clearly have good taste, I'm inclined to agree with you.
Why can't you accept that what works for you might not work for someone else? For these past two seasons even when I feel they tell a good story in a decent way I still feel much of it comes off bland. At this point I just don't care for how TNG does things. It's BLAND.
For me a story has to engage me emotionally. I have to feel like I really like and really care what's going on. If I don't then it won't matter how well something may be done technically or how many people disagree with me.
In years past I watched several episodes of The West Wing. I could see that it was a very well written and well acted series. It was very good in many ways. But overall it just failed to engage me. And the most obvious evidence of that was that I rarely thought of tuning back in unless I just happened to come across it channel surfing. And even then I hang in only if there wasn't something else I preferred available.
Although I haven't commented a great deal about it (but others have) one difference I do note is the scoring. The music in the later seasons of TNG is garbage. It's just noise without any feeling. And rather than just not enhancing a scene for me it often detracts from a scene even when I'm not paying much attention to it. I also find at this point that there's a stiffness with the characters which I find distracting.
I've already been berated for it, but the simple fact is that TNG isn't a space adventure at this point, not by my measure. And while some may like that I don't. The kind of Star Trek I like is space adventure with other things mixed in periodically. At this point TNG feels too much like mainstream drama that just happens to be in a science fiction setting and for me that's not enough.
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"Timescape" ***
The Enterprise is caught in a temporal anomaly and Picard and company look for a way to free it.
A rather technobabble heavy episode, but it had its interesting moments. In some respects it reminded me of TOS' "Wink Of An Eye" with Picard and company moving around a ship and crew seemingly frozen in place. The distinction, of course, is that here the situation is accidental as opposed to TOS' story where the situation was deliberately engineered.
The basic issue of this story is how will they solve the problem presented to them, but it feels somewhat flat because the problem at hand is simply a technical one rather than of issue or conflict. I never got any sense of tangible drama or tension from it as if the characters were just going through the motions without any real sense of jeopardy. The idea was there, but the execution just failed to engage me.
The Enterprise is caught in a temporal anomaly and Picard and company look for a way to free it.
A rather technobabble heavy episode, but it had its interesting moments. In some respects it reminded me of TOS' "Wink Of An Eye" with Picard and company moving around a ship and crew seemingly frozen in place. The distinction, of course, is that here the situation is accidental as opposed to TOS' story where the situation was deliberately engineered.
The basic issue of this story is how will they solve the problem presented to them, but it feels somewhat flat because the problem at hand is simply a technical one rather than of issue or conflict. I never got any sense of tangible drama or tension from it as if the characters were just going through the motions without any real sense of jeopardy. The idea was there, but the execution just failed to engage me.
I must concur with the overall 'blandness' of storytelling present in later TNG. There were still a few stand-outs. The scavenger hunt in The Chase and Picard's fascination with Galen's gift to him were nice but the ending fell very flat for me (further undermined a short time later by how Picard treated the Kurlan naiskos after the Ent-D was scuttled)
Timescape was somewhat of a breath of fresh air. Technical, yes, but a good, spooky mystery nonetheless, and one wherein the Romulans were once more portrayed as not wholly 'EVIL'. Nice to play with the audience's expectations of simplistic villainy and a worthy take on a more complex tale.
Timescape was somewhat of a breath of fresh air. Technical, yes, but a good, spooky mystery nonetheless, and one wherein the Romulans were once more portrayed as not wholly 'EVIL'. Nice to play with the audience's expectations of simplistic villainy and a worthy take on a more complex tale.
I love Timescape--3.5 stars.
By this stage in the series I'd always look forward to an episode with Brannon's name attached to it. I love his pension for little details and original ideas making for wonderful high concept mysteries. He loses his touch admittedly towards the end of VOY and ENT but he was great on TNG with some of the show's best episodes.
This was such a clever episode--I loved the teaser with Riker being injured by Spot and tossing a phaser to Bev, the fun conversations in the runabout until the mystery begins. Brannon effectively set up the episode with that chilling shot of the Ent-D frozen in time. He did an excellent job in slowly revealing the weird clues with such nice touches as the rotting fruit, Picard's long nails, the runabout using up 47 days worth of fuel, Picard's smiley face, putting the audience in Troi's shoes in losing time which was effectively jarring. I appreciated the continuity touch of mentioning the Devidians from last season's finale and giving Troi a more prominent role via her experience aboard the Romulan ship from "Face of the Enemy" another nice continuity shout-out.
Brannon also did a good job explaining the temporal logistics of it all in very relateable terms. The complications placed in their path made a lot of sense and weren't contrived i.e. the idea that the field around them wasn't perfectly sealed leading to temporal narcosis, the neat twist that time wasn't fozen but moving exceedingly slow but still moving forward. The plan to save the ship made a lot of sense and was satisfying--reversing everything and it offered up some really cool visuals of everything being rewound(I loved Data courteously stopping what he was doing to move out of the way of an officer walking backwards passed him)
I liked seeing more of the Romulan warbird and it was cool seeing the Ent-D explode and then reassemble. The final ending was pitch perfect to tie into the episode and so perfectly Data. I also thought the actors did a good job playing frozen. Plus I have to include the really well done promo for Descent that aired right after the episode originally--they don't make promos like that anymore--it made you want to see the episode but didn't give everything away the way they do now.
By this stage in the series I'd always look forward to an episode with Brannon's name attached to it. I love his pension for little details and original ideas making for wonderful high concept mysteries. He loses his touch admittedly towards the end of VOY and ENT but he was great on TNG with some of the show's best episodes.
This was such a clever episode--I loved the teaser with Riker being injured by Spot and tossing a phaser to Bev, the fun conversations in the runabout until the mystery begins. Brannon effectively set up the episode with that chilling shot of the Ent-D frozen in time. He did an excellent job in slowly revealing the weird clues with such nice touches as the rotting fruit, Picard's long nails, the runabout using up 47 days worth of fuel, Picard's smiley face, putting the audience in Troi's shoes in losing time which was effectively jarring. I appreciated the continuity touch of mentioning the Devidians from last season's finale and giving Troi a more prominent role via her experience aboard the Romulan ship from "Face of the Enemy" another nice continuity shout-out.
Brannon also did a good job explaining the temporal logistics of it all in very relateable terms. The complications placed in their path made a lot of sense and weren't contrived i.e. the idea that the field around them wasn't perfectly sealed leading to temporal narcosis, the neat twist that time wasn't fozen but moving exceedingly slow but still moving forward. The plan to save the ship made a lot of sense and was satisfying--reversing everything and it offered up some really cool visuals of everything being rewound(I loved Data courteously stopping what he was doing to move out of the way of an officer walking backwards passed him)
I liked seeing more of the Romulan warbird and it was cool seeing the Ent-D explode and then reassemble. The final ending was pitch perfect to tie into the episode and so perfectly Data. I also thought the actors did a good job playing frozen. Plus I have to include the really well done promo for Descent that aired right after the episode originally--they don't make promos like that anymore--it made you want to see the episode but didn't give everything away the way they do now.
By late season six and season seven the writers and actors where running out of good ideas, and it was the right time to covert over to movies, even if the moves ended up with one very good movie, two subpar, and one horrid movie. But I thought Timescape was one of the better episodes.
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