Picard in the series has no charisma and authority

[Yistaan]

So I can't have a opinion on star trek unless it's what you agree with?

I'm only responding because you quoted and asked me directly but my suggestion was to @Sci only if he found something that broke the rules and I was hedging my bets that maybe I missed something offensive you said and he seemed really emotional and angry about it so I thought I might have missed something rule breaking. As I said in the same comment, I hadn't made the opportunity to go back and review in detail.

At this point, I feel this is between you two. I'll refrain from interfering further.

 

[Pubert]

Well, the whole thread feels like a diatribe against the nature of aging and why can't our heroes be ensconced forever as they are in our memories, rather than suffer the indignities of aging. It's an interesting sociological experiment.

Others here are saying he's acting old and that's why he sounds that way. That's not true. He lost his voice years ago. That not a diatribe against aging its just a reality.

 

[fireproof78]

That not a diatribe against aging its just a reality.

The diatribe comes against heores having to age rather than remain as we would prefer them to be. It's a fascinating example of humanity preferring fantasy over reality, and mad that reality dares to not replicate fantasy.

From a psychological point of view it is quite understandable, if frustrating, that reality is not so easily accepted.

 

[Mirror Tuvix]

Picard without charisma

OK Caeru, I'm making a note. When you turn 96 I'm going to visit you and give you an assessment of your charisma. Clock's ticking.

 

[Mirror Tuvix]

To be fair, the previous writing teams have been making a lot of characters passive. I know they wanted to 'humble' Picard in past seasons https://www.startrek.com/news/the-humbling-of-admiral-picard for whatever reason.

Season 3 gives Picard his spine back and I'm loving it. 3x02 Spoiler clip:

There's also some major arguments coming this season that allows Patrick to really deliver.

I just wanted to commend you on your excellent username.

 

[Tomalak]

I think it's more that Stewart was a stage actor so I assumed his voice was in stage ready shape. To be fair, I don't know if he still does any theater anymore.

Perhaps the two things are linked, and six decades of stage work may have taken their toll.

 

[Qonundrum]

TNG, sure... the movies? He was completely different back then. Indeed, from what I remember of PIC so far, Picard's closer to the '87 original.

But that's IMHO and YMMV. @Sci had rather the greatest point above in the thread as well...

 

[Pubert]

TNG, sure... the movies? He was completely different back then. Indeed, from what I remember of PIC so far, Picard's closer to the '87 original.

But that's IMHO and YMMV. @Sci had rather the greatest point above in the thread as well...

He's a bit closer but doesn't gave those cool morality speeches he used to give.

 

[gweeps]

He's a bit closer but doesn't gave those cool morality speeches he used to give.

He's been humbled. He's also 94, and died only to have his consciousness put into a synthetic body.

 

[Sci]

He's a bit closer but doesn't gave those cool morality speeches he used to give.

Star Trek: Picard as a narrative does not subscribe to the Father Knows Best-esque depiction of morality that Star Trek: The Next Generation used. Jean-Luc in this series is not a character who always knows what's right and will lecture you about it. He is, instead, someone who will join with you to discern morality together through dialogue rather than through authoritative lecture.

 

[Jayson1]

Except in season 1 it was everyone lecturing him for being a piece of crap.

 

[ED-209]

One of the biggest problems I have with Picard is that we're not watching Jean Luc Picard.

 

[fireproof78]

Star Trek: Picard as a narrative does not subscribe to the Father Knows Best-esque depiction of morality that Star Trek: The Next Generation used. Jean-Luc in this series is not a character who always knows what's right and will lecture you about it. He is, instead, someone who will join with you to discern morality together through dialogue rather than through authoritative lecture.

One is definitely more appealing than the other.

 

[Sci]

Except in season 1 it was everyone lecturing him for being a piece of crap.

Nope. S1 had both Jean-Luc lecturing others and others lecturing him, and both sides being kind-of right and kind-of wrong, until Jean-Luc started having discussions with other people instead of authoritative demands. Then, others reciprocated. Hence the finale -- "That's why we're here: to save each other!" -- where Jean-Luc is bonding with Soji instead of trying to command Soji.

One of the biggest problems I have with Picard is that we're not watching Jean Luc Picard.

Nope. We are watching Jean-Luc Picard.

 

[Tomalak]

I remember when ST: Picard started, someone tried to tell me that it was a legally distinct character because of Secret Hideout's deal, and that everything was an alternate universe. It was at the height of all that 25% different garbage.

Then the show opened up on the Enterprise-D with Data in his old uniform, and we saw Picard's archive etc. He didn't persist with that argument.

 

[Cr0sis21]

What, exactly, is the 25%

Regardless, i hope it's clear now that all of it is supposed to connect. Even the Kelvin films. Hell, we had a cameo of someone from the Kelvin-verse in Discovery.

Its all canon. All of it. One big, beautiful tapestry. And these arguments aren't anything new. We heard the same arguments going all the way back to movie Kirk vs. television kirk. And does anyone remember the bellyaching from people swearing Generations isn't canon because it killed Kirk via falling off a bridge?

This is nothing new.

 

[Noname Given]

What, exactly, is the 25%...

It was a joke made by Doug Drexler when he showed his initial approved design for the updated 1701 on Star Trek Discovery.

"...everything new has to be at least 25% different from what came before..."

And it became something that everyone with an ax to grind on some aspect of Paramount+ Star Trek started to parrot.

 

[Tomalak]

Yeah, I love how Picard made the Hobus supernova integral to the backstory, as it tied the Kelvin films in with the new shows, as well as linking back to TNG with Picard himself.

 

[The Overlord]

Why is Picard portrayed as a man without charisma and authority through out this series? People can grow old and change their view of the world, can become more fragile but charisma and authority are part of being, part of character. That's why we loved Picard in TNG series and movies. Now there is no such thing. Why? It doesn't feel right. When we see Riker he's the same guy as he always was.

Picard Stewart is 82 years old, it's hard to still be charismatic or commanding when your voice has been weakened by age.

 

[DarKush]

I think Picard is still charismatic and commanding, but in spurts. I think a good deal of that comes down to the writing. Throughout this series' run, they've struggled to make Picard really relevant to the stories they wanted to tell. Season three, thus far, has done the best job, and it was great seeing Picard

Spoiler

in command in this week's episode

. I think the second season did the worst job regarding making him relevant, because they spent more time on Adam Soong, genetic experiments, Borgified mercenaries, Agnes's day out, etc., instead of Picard and his ancestor and his role in getting her into space.