Nero's Defeat & How The Film Begins (SPOILERS)

[All Seeing Eye]

No, you haven't. The reality of the images in the trailer refute your claim.

I'll just take your word for that shall I. As far as i'm concerned the reality of the images in the trailer refute your claim

Yeah, clearly the Narada is being drawn into that vortex. I mean, why else would we see more of her at the end of that short sequence than at the beginning?

You don't see more of her! it's angle trickery!

 

[SalvorHardin]

 

[ST-One]

Indeed.

 

[Delthan]

Black Holes ARE holes in space. Neros weapon drills to the centre of planets and creates black holes and the planet implodes into it. The trailer shows us that his weapon is made to back fire or set off early and his ship gets sucked into one.

Here. Have a Wikipedia article.

Black holes are not wormholes, and they do not transport you from Point A in the space\time continuum to Point B. They are merely hyperdense balls of matter that have a gravitational field so powerful that ultimately nothing can escape them, not even light. So there's no way the Narada could be "emerging" from a black hole, unless they fucked up some really, really basic science.

What the hell are you talking about, when the hell did I say the black hole sucking Neros ship in was a wormhole or was even transporting it anywhere? Would you like to quote me?
I know what a wormhole is and what a blackhole is. Talk about coming into a thread and getting your wires crossed.
For something to be called a Hole it doesn't have to have an exit aswell as an entry point, an animal can dig a hole in the ground to live in but there's only one way in and out, it's still called a Hole. If you get shot in the chest the bullet leaves a bullet hole in your chest, even though there's only one way into the chest it's still a bullet hole. A blachhole is still an actual hole in space.

I cannot believe honestly that you do not understand what the definitions of a hole is.

You seem to have fallen into an etymological trap here. A black hole is not actually a 'hole'. It's an area of extremely high gravity, one so high that light cannot escape, making them seem black. The way you describe it, you think its the absence of something that was previously there - dirt in the case of your animal hole, flesh in the case of your bullet hole. But a black hole contains all the matter it has absorbed.

In any case, a black hole should 'appear' spherical, not a flat disc, and anything being pulled in would get ripped apart and condense to an infintely small point, not just... disappear. Unless their really throwing away physics in this film, your logic is flawed

 

[Australis]

TS, you realise that if you're wrong, they will come after you. Adopting a dogmatic stance where you could very well be wrong only strengthens people's memories.

I thought it was the angle and the movement as well, but studying the trailer closely, at home and at the theatre, the ship is emerging. It also makes more sense that they would tell the treailer in roughly chronological order with a flashback, not show the ending in reverse.

I'd say let it go, but, well...

 

[All Seeing Eye]

You seem to have fallen into an etymological trap here. A black hole is not actually a 'hole'. It's an area of extremely high gravity, one so high that light cannot escape, making them seem black. The way you describe it, you think its the absence of something that was previously there - dirt in the case of your animal hole, flesh in the case of your bullet hole. But a black hole contains all the matter it has absorbed.

Actually a black hole is the bending of the fabric of space, it's literally a hole in space time and ends with a singularity. Thanks for playing.
You can take a pole and slam it into the ground, no soil comes out but instead is pushed aside and a hole is created, same kind of things happens with blackholes except they're more 4 dimensional rather than 3. You can't actually look at a black hole and see the hole itself because it's actually denting of the fabric of space by the singularity.

anything being pulled in would get ripped apart and condense to an infintely small point, not just... disappear. Unless their really throwing away physics in this film, your logic is flawed

We're seeing it from a different angle, the ship is being ripped apart by gravitational forces and sucked in toward the singularity, we don't see that part because we're not seeing it head on. In the film we'll no doubt see other angles.

 

[Michael]

This thread will end in tears.

 

[All Seeing Eye]

This thread will end in tears.

Why will it? do enlighten me.

 

[The Doctor]

I really don't know why everyone is falling for the bait.

TS takes a ridiculous position he knows is either wrong or frustrating and then sits back and watches us pull our hair out. Responding to him only fuels his game.

 

[All Seeing Eye]

Oh for goodness sake.

If you disagree with me then that's fine, as i've already said, we'll see in about 2 months who is right and who is wrong. I'm not forcing you to post in this thread.

 

[Kpnuts]

Sorry but Tachyon Shield is obviously on a massive wind up, he can't be serious here. There's just no way he actually believes that the Narada is sucked into a black hole. Twice. A ship that by definition travels through time through massive time vortices.

If you are foolish enough to be serious, then I'll say it again:

The big sun in the background indicates that this scene is during the battle with the Kelvin at the very start of the movie. Which is more likely:

a) the ship exits a time vortex and attacks the Kelvin
b) the ship is destroyed in the first scene of the movie, and Paramount has reversed the shot to make it look like it's coming out to try and confuse us.

The fact that Spock talks about them receiving a distress call at the same time as the big menacing ship comes into view is the final nail in the coffin to your ridiculous belief.

Well Tachyon?

 

[Michael]

This thread will end in tears.

Why will it? do enlighten me.

It's supposed to be a metaphor. I think that some things have been said in this thread which will earn the respective posters a warning. 'What goes in TNZ stays in TNZ' and all that. I could be wrong though. After all, I'm not a mod. (And, looking at this thread, I wouldn't want to be. )

Did I make myself clear?

 

[All Seeing Eye]

There's just no way he actually believes that the Narada is sucked into a black hole. Twice.

It's sucked in once. All trailer footage is of the same moment.

 

[USS Triumphant]

This thread will end in tears.

I know that I've laughed so hard that I've cried a little.

 

[Kpnuts]

Reply to this Tachyon:

The big sun in the background indicates that this scene is during the battle with the Kelvin at the very start of the movie. Which is more likely:

a) the ship exits a time vortex and attacks the Kelvin
b) the ship is destroyed in the first scene of the movie, and Paramount has reversed the shot to make it look like it's coming out to try and confuse us.

The fact that Spock talks about them receiving a distress call at the same time as the big menacing ship comes into view is the final nail in the coffin to your ridiculous belief.

Well Tachyon?

 

[All Seeing Eye]

Reply to this Tachyon:

The big sun in the background indicates that this scene is during the battle with the Kelvin at the very start of the movie. Which is more likely:

a) the ship exits a time vortex and attacks the Kelvin
b) the ship is destroyed in the first scene of the movie, and Paramount has reversed the shot to make it look like it's coming out to try and confuse us.

The fact that Spock talks about them receiving a distress call at the same time as the big menacing ship comes into view is the final nail in the coffin to your ridiculous belief.

Well Tachyon?

You are just speculating, nothing more. I'm sure the ship does exit from time travel and does attack the Kelvin but there's no reason to believe the image we see of what I believe is a blackhole is occuring at that point in the movie. Perhaps it's taking place in another star system, all star systems have suns and because we don't know how the film progresses for all we know they end up back at the same star system as where the Kelvin was destroyed at the beginning of the film.
Spock saying they recieved a distress call at the same time as we see the Nerada (sp?) does not mean there's any connection. Everyboody should surely be aware by now that trailers don't run in order or link visuals with the correct voiceing. For starters we hear Spocks fathers speech to Spock throughout most of the trailer when the speech obviously only takes place at one moment of the film.

 

[John Picard]

Oh for goodness sake.

If you disagree with me then that's fine, as i've already said, we'll see in about 2 months that I am wrong. I'm not forcing you to post in this thread.

Glad that was cleared up.

 

[Kpnuts]

Ok I can no longer take you seriously, you have to be joking, just to wind people up. There's no way you could be that stupid.

A time travelling ship exits a time vortex to attack a ship in the opening scene of the film (which we know is what happens)

or

A time travelling ship that exits time vortices gets sucked into a black hole in the first scene of the film and Paramount decided not only to show it to us, but show the scene in reverse.

So you think, the're MORE of the Narada in first pic, and less in the second pic, to symbolise it getting sucked in?

No way, you have to be on a wind up

 

[All Seeing Eye]

The first pic is very dark and the light from the sun in the second pic illuminates more of the 'tentacles' which makes it appear to get bigger.

A time travelling ship that exits time vortices gets sucked into a black hole in the first scene of the film

Why are you so adamant those pics are scenes from the beginning of the film and not the end? you're assuming too much.

 

[Kpnuts]

The first pic is very dark and the light from the sun in the second pic illuminates more of the 'tentacles' which makes it appear to get bigger.

No the first pic is showing about 1 third of what the second pic is showing. If you can't see that you need to have your eyes checked. The ship is leaving the vortex. Everyone can see that except you.

Why are you so adamant those pics are scenes from the beginning of the film and not the end? you're assuming too much.

Because there's a big sun in the background and the only other shots of that we've seen are during fights with the Kelvin. How do you think the Narada goes back in time and approaches the Kelvin by the way?