With the show taking place on the hastily refitted and patched together Maquis raider rather than the brand new state-of-the-art Starfleet vessel.
Michelle Forbes in Voyager
- Thread starter Bry_Sinclair
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The feeling I get is that TPTB, or at least some of them, were mostly concerned with presenting Janeway as in the right, not matter who she went up against. Ro always had a problem with authority, so she would have come in conflict with Janeway and, the way the existing version of VOY was written, would have had to continously learn again and again that Janeway is always right on her show.
So either Ro would have always been in the wrong or she would have learned to be Mommy Kate's faithful daughter.
Though it's interesting to think what would have happened once Seven had shown up.. would Ro have faded in the background like Chekotay did?
BTW I don't hate Janeway completely, she has her good episodes and Kate Mulgrew is a good actress, but I feel she was super-inconsistently written because every person in charge had a different idea of what she should be like.
Didn't they intentionally make the human characters more bland because they wanted to make the aliens look crazier?
No, they can commandeer the Starfleet vessel. But all the Starfleeters have to join the Maquis as provisional freedom fighters. Everyone gets subtle brownish-colored outfits. Then they spend all of Voyager freeing the Delta Quadrant from oppressive Imperialists.
Humans are just downright dull when compared to aliens. Humans will always have the same typical values with all their cultures washed out to become just 'generic Earthicans' (just finished a rewatch of Futurama), whilst alien characters will always have a different perspective--even if these can become somewhat mono-cultural, they at least provide a new way of looking at things.
DS9 has such a rich canvas as you have Bajoran nationals who're more focused on rebuilding their world than exploring the galaxy, a former Cardassian spy whose loyalties are never really clear, a Ferengi who is looking out for himself, and so on. The Maquis might've been an interesting new take on humanity in the 24th century (based on Sisko's line from the two-parter about what life will be like in the DMZ), but as soon as the uniforms went on they were neutered and became just more of the same--Torres at least had the self-loathing and anger issues to make her stand out.
Had they wanted to make the aliens really crazier then they should've brought in the Jim Henson Company (look at their epic work from FarScape!).
Humans don't have to be inherently dull in scifi shows, if there's good writing. Berman era Trek intentionally made them more standard to make the aliens stand out more.
There's more to characterization than what values they represent, it's also their personality, style, and way they look at solving problems. There's no reason Chakotay or Kim couldn't have as distinctive a personality as the alien characters while still having human values.
There's more to characterization than what values they represent, it's also their personality, style, and way they look at solving problems. There's no reason Chakotay or Kim couldn't have as distinctive a personality as the alien characters while still having human values.
The Expanse is all human and they're brilliant characters.
Agreed that Ro would have probably taken Paris's or Torres's roles and not have had a big/bigger impact on the show than they did, too much having to idolize and follow in line behind Janeway.
I think, starting after season 4, Seven of Nine and the Doctor were the only characters allowed to be shown as in the right in arguments with Janeway, which may have contributed to them being better and more focused-on characters in the cast, even with them then it was rare but with others it was extremely rare.
I think, starting after season 4, Seven of Nine and the Doctor were the only characters allowed to be shown as in the right in arguments with Janeway, which may have contributed to them being better and more focused-on characters in the cast, even with them then it was rare but with others it was extremely rare.
Heaps of fictional works have mostly human or completely human sets of characters and manage to have compelling and interesting characters. Plus even 90s trek manages to have interesting human characters, such as Sisko, O'Biren, Picard...
Voyager has really no excuse.
Voyager has really no excuse.
I still get pissed off when in "Year of Hell" The Doctor tells Janeway she needs to chill out for a bit and she basically tells him to screw off. She may have been right in the moment, but a captain who doesn't respect their officers doesn't deserve their respect either.
Then there's her actions in "Equinox" and arguably (ad infinitum) "Tuvix", but this has all been discussed before...
TL;DR yeah, it would be nice if the other characters got to make valid arguments more often. Bringing Ro onto Voyager just to have her fall in line along with everyone else would have been a waste of a good character, though possibly credible if they had some powerful episodes where Ro made mistakes.
Then there's her actions in "Equinox" and arguably (ad infinitum) "Tuvix", but this has all been discussed before...
TL;DR yeah, it would be nice if the other characters got to make valid arguments more often. Bringing Ro onto Voyager just to have her fall in line along with everyone else would have been a waste of a good character, though possibly credible if they had some powerful episodes where Ro made mistakes.
But can she cook something other than hasperat souffle?
I think I would have liked having Ro on VOY, if they had been able to keep her interesting. As far as her bring a traitor, was she more of one than any other Maquis? (taking away the fact she personally disappointed The Picard™)
Well, when she changed loyalties she sabotaged a mission in the process and provided the Maquis with supplies (not weapons I think?), IIRC. That's a bit more traitorous than simply resigning your commission.
I like the DS9 relaunch in part for giving her another chance.
I like the DS9 relaunch in part for giving her another chance.
Seska with the Jason was too panto and made very little sense tactically for her character. She should have been a cunning smart prisoner who is kinda good council despite being a bit evil a bit like a less silly mirror Georgiou or BSGs Baltar.
You could always then kill her off in one of the many Voyager take overs when it gets boring
And Seven, who on the one hand, had little respect for protocol or the chain of command, and on the other hand, has lots of respect for Tuvok, and for logic, would have been torn. Or interesting to watch. I don't agree that Ro and Seven were interchangeable. Both were more complex.
He is only a hologram, a few lines of code added or deleted would turn him into an obedient drone.
What if Ro was leaning back into Starfleet's graces and the Captain and the 1st officer was killed during the passage into the Delta Quadrant? With her experience as a Starfleet officer, and hoping to leave the Maquis, she could galvanize Voyager through these unfortunate circumstances. Michelle Forbes was a rising talent back then and could've been offered a starring role, in this what if thread, I thought this could've been a fruitful scenario.
I've long mulled the idea of Ro being in the Chakotay role, nothing against Robert Beltran or the Chakotay character. I just think Ro would've been a nice tie-in to TNG, a fan favorite character to bring over to the new series. I think they might have allowed her to butt heads with Janeway more and longer than they did with Chakotay. I also have thought Shelby would've/should've been Voyager's captain too. The fireworks between Shelby and Ro could've been epic, though that might have been too TNG for others.
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