Spoilers Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread

[Anwar]

As for Wolverine, I agree he isn't *necessary*. Really very few individuals could possibly ever be considered necessary. Arguably Scott is the most necessary X-man imaginable and we've already had a decent X-Men movie without him.

See, I'm mad about what the FoX-Men movies did to Cyclops...though I understand why.

At the time the first FoX-Men movies were written and made, Cyclops hadn't been a relevant or important character in about 15 years in the comics. From the Mid-80s and ALL of the 90s, no one knew what to do with him. He had no major storylines on his own or major character arcs, everything big he was in was tied to the 90s Fad characters like Cable and his roles were tied to them rather than himself. He was basically just relegated to "Hardass Leader guy who clashes with Wolverine a lot" and nothing else.

It wasn't until the early to mid 2000s when new writers came on like Grant Morrison and Joss Whedon that he started getting prominence again, with his own storylines and character arcs. This was also when most of the 90s Fad characters' wore out their welcome and they were sidelined, and Wolverine was tossed onto the Avengers and out of the X-Books. And by then the first FoX-Men Trilogy was done so it was too late to do anything.

Meaning if Cyclops gets adapted now, they'll have 20 years of much better storylines involving him to use.

 

[M'rk son of Mogh]

You mean Cyclops leaving his wife and newborn child for Jean wouldn't be great for the character in a movie storyline?

 

[kirk55555]

the 90s Fad characters like Cable

To be completely fair, Cable has honestly grown so much since he was just the generic template for 90% of Rob Liefeld's created characters that he's a legitimate X-Men staple, a real fan favorite and not really a "fad" character. That is definitely despite being created in the early 90s by Rob Liefeld, his original version of the character would have eventually been forgotten but the writers that came after Liefeld really helped make Cable special, just like with Deadpool.

 

[Grendelsbayne]

See, I'm mad about what the FoX-Men movies did to Cyclops...though I understand why.

At the time the first FoX-Men movies were written and made, Cyclops hadn't been a relevant or important character in about 15 years in the comics. From the Mid-80s and ALL of the 90s, no one knew what to do with him. He had no major storylines on his own or major character arcs, everything big he was in was tied to the 90s Fad characters like Cable and his roles were tied to them rather than himself. He was basically just relegated to "Hardass Leader guy who clashes with Wolverine a lot" and nothing else.

It wasn't until the early to mid 2000s when new writers came on like Grant Morrison and Joss Whedon that he started getting prominence again, with his own storylines and character arcs. This was also when most of the 90s Fad characters' wore out their welcome and they were sidelined, and Wolverine was tossed onto the Avengers and out of the X-Books. And by then the first FoX-Men Trilogy was done so it was too late to do anything.

Meaning if Cyclops gets adapted now, they'll have 20 years of much better storylines involving him to use.

No question the fox movies handled him poorly. (And Storm and, well, pretty much everyone not named Erik, Charles or Logan. Well, I'll give them credit for Stryker and Trask and for Cummings' version of Kurt.)

Just saying, whatever their flaws were, they did make some good movies despite it which really worked as adaptations of the themes and world of the X-Men if not necessarily all the characters. And the fact that they did that without properly using all these super-important characters pretty clearly proves that nobody is really necessary for these films. They're gonna use whoever they're gonna use and if they do a good job then it'll work. Just hoping they're up to the task.

 

[Turtletrekker]

You mean Cyclops leaving his wife and newborn child for Jean wouldn't be great for the character in a movie storyline?

Bob Layton had authorial control over Cyclops for five issues and damaged him forever.

 

[Anwar]

You mean Cyclops leaving his wife and newborn child for Jean wouldn't be great for the character in a movie storyline?

The funny thing is, Wolverine and Gambit did similar things or worse (Logan killing his children, Gambit running from his wife and never telling Rogue about her until she showed up) but those never get brought up.

To be completely fair, Cable has honestly grown so much since he was just the generic template for 90% of Rob Liefeld's created characters that he's a legitimate X-Men staple, a real fan favorite and not really a "fad" character. That is definitely despite being created in the early 90s by Rob Liefeld, his original version of the character would have eventually been forgotten but the writers that came after Liefeld really helped make Cable special, just like with Deadpool.

Yeah but his popularity ended in the early 2000s and he's never been able to hold a book for long since then. The whole 90s aesthetic faded and it took close to a decade for him to be reinvented as Deadpool's straight man and likable again.

Bob Layton had authorial control over Cyclops for five issues and damaged him forever.

The bigger damage was done to him by Chris Claremont. The whole idea of Cyclops and Madelyne Pryor was inherently insane and character damaging. Him leaving her wasn't the bad writing, him MARRYING HER to start with was.

 

[M'rk son of Mogh]

The funny thing is, Wolverine and Gambit did similar things or worse (Logan killing his children, Gambit running from his wife and never telling Rogue about her until she showed up) but those never get brought up.

What's to bring up?
That's expected of their shady "bad boy" outsider images. Gambit and Wolverine are more anti-hero than hero and its not debated.

Cyclops is the squeaky clean boring leader. And he still did worse than especially Gambit in this case. It's all about expectations.

 

[Anwar]

What's to bring up?
That's expected of their shady "bad boy" outsider images. Gambit and Wolverine are more anti-hero than hero and its not debated.

But they're almost praised for doing these things. Being a "Bad Boy" can only go so far. Heck, they even forgave Gambit for the Mutant Massacre thing.

Cyclops is the squeaky clean boring leader. And he still did worse than especially Gambit in this case. It's all about expectations.

Gambit ran out on his wife and went after Rogue without a second thought. Cyclops did not immediately try to rekindle a romance with Jean until after he thought Madelyne was dead, and it's implied he only really married Madelyne because of mind control in the first place.

It's telling that most of the fans immediately let go of the Madelyne thing as soon as later writers bothered giving Cyclops more to actually do in the comics starting with Morrison and Whedon. As opposed to 90s writers, who did nothing with him for an entire decade.

Meanwhile, Gambit hasn't been relevant in the comics in around 30 years and all he's used for anymore is being the husband that Rogue is waving her finger at while she's reduced to being his killjoy

 

[kirk55555]

Yeah but his popularity ended in the early 2000s and he's never been able to hold a book for long since then. The whole 90s aesthetic faded and it took close to a decade for him to be reinvented as Deadpool's straight man and likable again.

I mean, the Cable & Deadpool comic series lasted for 50 issues between 2004 and 2008, and his more modern solo runs tend to go about 25ish issues, which isn't too bad by modern standards for a character that isn't a Wolverine/Spider-Man level character. He's not A-list maybe, but he's higher up then, say, Gambit.

 

[The Knappos]

I hate Cable

 

[Christopher]

I hate Cable

Have you tried satellite or streaming?

 

[Mage]

Have you tried satellite or streaming?

Nice.

 

[Rich Watson]

US Copyright Office filings for upcoming Disney+ series suggest you shouldn't hold your breath waiting for them.

Agatha: No Subtitle After All - September 2024
Daredevil - January 2025
Ironheart - September 2025 Or to put it another way, THREE YEARS after shooting finished.

 

[Christopher]

"In the first episode of the series we are reintroduced to the world of Daredevil." Another hint suggesting this is not a reboot.

 

[Set Harth]

Agatha: No Subtitle After All

 

[Turtletrekker]

Director Matt Shakman gives an update on Fantastic Four, including the fact that the leads have all been cast but they haven't been announced due to the actor strike.

https://collider.com/fantastic-four...vI8mi7GA181V8KleSeoiU9RrEUC9mkuYFTgdo9v1h5CgY

 

[Relayer1]

I hate Cable

Never could understand why he was so popular. Terminally dull and unengaging character.

Served well enough as a foil to movie Deadpool I suppose.

 

[Christopher]

Director Matt Shakman gives an update on Fantastic Four, including the fact that the leads have all been cast but they haven't been announced due to the actor strike.

So... were they cast before the strike, or during? I know WGA writers weren't allowed to pitch projects or make deals during the strike; are the SAG-AFTRA rules different?

 

[Turtletrekker]

I imagine that they were cast before the strike, but Marvel was waiting for the proper time to make the announcement.

 

[Rich Watson]

I imagine that they were cast before the strike, but Marvel was waiting for the proper time to make the announcement.

I wonder what all the so-called leakers on Reddit and Twitter will have to say for themselves if it's nobody they confidently announced in the past?