Appropriate, since Chris Evans had previously played the other character known as the Human Torch. I wonder if that was an intentional nod.
Spoilers Marvel Cinematic Universe spoiler-heavy speculation thread
- Thread starter bbjeg
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Appropriate, since Chris Evans had previously played the other character known as the Human Torch. I wonder if that was an intentional nod.
In his original appearance in the comic, he had to be kept in the tube or else he would... burst into flame.
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That would be fantastic. Kerry Condon is a terrific actress and I would love to see her have a bigger role in the MCU.
He's labeled and everything
Not sure Horton or anyone else thought of the Torch as fully human at first
Always a guest star after one film. Frank Price must be smiling about the level of control one studio had/has over a property.
Just...no.
Sound observation. It no long matters what the MCU defenders spin, when the inside man--the one in charge of the MCU has already expressed his fear of what the MCU demands of its audiences:
"Kevin Feige reportedly told Marvel colleagues that watching every new MCU project had begun to feel more like homework than entertainment."
...and...
"Employees talk regularly about 'Marvel fatigue' and worry they've created a 'no new fans club' — where new viewers have no clue what's going on"
Process of elimination: remove the endless tethers to previously released productions which were considered important enough to tie into new productions, and you end up with Deadpool and Wolverine. This is beyond debate, as any attempted spin (and/or misused references to non-MCU films) fails to sell when the complaints / concerns are coming from those who create and produce the content.
Whether some waited for theatrical releases to be dumped on D+ or not, the core problem were the films, which were not appealing to the masses Marvel Studios once expected.
Quite right, however, Marvel Studios may have screwed with this "fresh and new" angle thanks to the Thunderbolts* post credit scene, which has told anyone watching that the FF movie will have elements to spot which will have a bearing on future MCU films / arcs to come.
Indeed.
Overall, the Netflix Marvel series were more enjoyable than the bulk of the D+ content.
I wanted to see that ever since The First Avenger era of films.
You end up with gutless, soulless fanservice that isn't worth more than 1 watch and relies on decades old movies rather than anything creative or smart?
Nah, they were made for people ashamed of comics. And all of them except DD fell apart in less than 1 season. Netflix never would've had the balls to make something like "Agatha All Along".
Do we really have to go around and around and around this circular exchange again and again and again?
I'll stop when folks admit that they don't care about actual storytelling anymore and just want empty, gutless fanservice with only old characters and no one new, ever, and that they're still ashamed of comic book stuff and need everything to be "Grounded".
Leave it to Netflix, they'd have made the Guardians of the Galaxy be a human biker gang that use their comic names as "Biker Gang Names" and have guys like Ronan be the leader of a Rival Biker Gang.
The real problem here is that the MCU simply was really bad at writing women and nonwhites until 2019 or so, and suddenly bringing in so many women and nonwhites angered the folks who only wanted Forced White Male Leads
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That would be asking for too much. This is the internet after all.
I always forget Jenna Coleman is (briefly) in the first Captain America film.
What would you call it, bringing back old characters out outstayed their welcome?
'Desperate', 'grasping at straws', hell, even 'lazy' is a better description of the behaviour you ascribe them.
'Gutless' is a synonym for 'cowardly', which is also a negative attribute, but it is not the same.
While I agree in principle that creative works shouldn't be compromised just because people have the wrong idea about them, ultimately, Disney is a profit-making company. I'm no big fan of capitalism in general, but I don't think we could expect a studio to keep throwing hundreds of millions of dollars into these theatrical releases (let alone streaming ones) without trying to tweak some things in an effort to chase the old box office totals. Particularly because three out of the last four seem to have been breakeven or outright losers.
Also. as others noted, Feige and other Marvel insiders have decided this is the cause. They very well might be wrong - finding the cause for a "vibe shift" is often pretty difficult. But they're groping around for the reasons for the box office slide, so some sort of retool is inevitable.
People don't make the decision to buy a movie ticket over how effective the storytelling is, however, as they only know that after they attend the movie. Maybe they can get a little hint of this from online reviews before they go. But NWH had way more ticket sales than either of the previous Tom Holland movies, despite still being during the social distancing era. This was undoubtedly because a lot of very casual MCU fans were excited for Green Goblin, Dr. Octopus, and the Spider-Men.
My only point is featuring a character/plot previously in a TV show is not a guaranteed draw for general audiences. They used to happen with some frequency (Star Trek is famously such a franchise) but they've gotten rarer over time - particularly when you discount things like the Mission: Impossible series, which are reboots of the concept.
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Nor is it guaranteed to be harmful to a film's performance, because a large percentage of the moviegoing audience won't even know the difference. There are no guarantees in this business, which is why it's pointless to try to single out some factor as the "reason" films in general do well or poorly. The reality is far too complicated for that. If there were some pat formula for what makes films succeed or fail, Hollywood would've cracked it decades ago and success would be easy. How many times has conventional wisdom said "A film that does X is doomed to fail" only for a daring filmmaker to do X and succeed brilliantly?
Exactly.
Feige and his Marvel Studios associates know their product, and their handling of said product in relation to how the audience is in decline in recent years. Not for a moment should anyone (not meaning you) ever question the concerns of people who the heart and nerve center of this franchise, when their concerns are proven with one film after another.