Marvel All New, All Different - Ongoing Discussion (Spoilers)

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by Admiral_Young, May 30, 2010.

  1. JD

    JD Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    It looks a lot better in those covers.
     
  2. Savage Dragon

    Savage Dragon Your Savage Overlord Moderator

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    I don't follow Champions and the last time I saw her her armour looked more like Iron Man's. I can't say that the images you have posted change my opinion in any way. It's just awful.
     
  3. Turtletrekker

    Turtletrekker Admiral Admiral

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    Wow. They weren't kidding when they said that the Fantastic Four would be reunited in the second issue, were they? They've had enough members over the years to make 5 teams of 4! :eek::lol:
     
  4. Wereghost

    Wereghost Part-time poltergeist Rear Admiral

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    I must say I enjoyed Fantastic Four #2 immensely, even if it was utterly ludicrous. Nice to see Reed, Sue and the kids again. And hasn’t Valeria grown!
     
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  5. Turtletrekker

    Turtletrekker Admiral Admiral

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    Regarding the roll call on the last page of FF#2 (Avengers Assemble? Flock of Fantastics? Fantastic Flock?), there are two characters that I didn't recognize. Who is the normal looking woman in street clothes on the left next to Sharon Ventura and Luke Cage? Who is that between T'Challa and Crystal? It looks like it could be either Triton or Iceman, but when were either of them FF? And when was Namorita (Namora?) in the FF?
     
    Last edited: Sep 13, 2018
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  6. Wereghost

    Wereghost Part-time poltergeist Rear Admiral

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    ^ I reckon Jen Walters and Iceman, but I’m not sure as to when the latter or Namorita was in the FF.
     
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  7. kirk55555

    kirk55555 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Well in the current comics (because a few writers are fucking morons and totally don't understand the character at all, but really wanted to write Bruce Banner when he was dead so they just turned Jen into Bruce with lady parts) "She-Hulk" is more like how Hulk used to be, its not a form Jennifer Walters willingly takes. So, imagine old school Bruce Banner/Hulk relationship, except "She-Hulk" is less stupid then older Hulk.

    So, I assume if she was in that shot (I still need to read the issue), her being in human form makes sense, in the context of how fucked over the character is right now. She becomes "She-Hulk in name only" in the current shitty Avengers book, but again its more older Bruce Banner stories style, she doesn't like to do it (which literally goes against the entire character, its like if Hal Jordan loathed using his damn ring). But, I could rant about the "Missiles causing PTSD causing Jen to become bruce with lady parts" shit for pages.

    TL,DR: Jen Walters hates being She-Hulk because a hack presumably wanted to write Bruce Banner/Hulk with PTSD, but he was dead at the time so now Jen hates She-Hulk and would probably stay in human form as much as possible because she got hit with a few missles in Civil War II.
     
  8. Turtletrekker

    Turtletrekker Admiral Admiral

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    She Hulk is on the cover of the next issue, so that makes sense.
     
  9. Turtletrekker

    Turtletrekker Admiral Admiral

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  10. kirk55555

    kirk55555 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    They already took away her kid and her marriage for a long time (although I guess she got her kid back from wherever she pointlessly hid her from Luke), and Jessica basically lost years of character development because bendis decided he wanted to write more of Alias Jessica Jones, not the actual character that had grown from that book. At this point its gone past infuriating, swung a left past sad and is getting into disturbing what they're doing with a formerly pretty good character.
    I'm pretty sure it is literally impossible for Purple Man to have...impregnated her, based on when she got pregnant in connection to where he was. Plus, you know, Dani cage is half African American and Purple man is Caucasian (pre-purple powers he was a soviet agent), so the baby literally cannot be his, unless they retcon her entire racial makeup (maybe she's just been really tan this whole time :rolleyes:).

    Oh, Marvel. Can't let DC beat you at anything, including ruining any character with a family.
     
    Last edited: Sep 28, 2018
  11. Alidar Jarok

    Alidar Jarok Everything in moderation but moderation Moderator

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    Did you read the relaunched Jessica Jones book because I completely disagree with the suggestion that it threw away her character growth. She was a much more proactive character and essentially willing to work as a superhero (albeit one who was undercover). Alias was a book about someone done with that life who accidentally kept colliding with it. Jessica Jones was a book where she actively sought to work with Carol Danvers to catch a bad guy. The rest was just an act.

    Now I don't think Dani is Killgrave's daughter. At a minimum, she wouldn't have been impregnated during the initial time she was kidnapped. If it happened later, it's possible, but that depends on when he got taken to the Raft. Or, I suppose, it's possible it happened during the brief moment he broke out. That would actually make the most sense. I don't want that to happen to Dani, but it does create an interesting story for both Jessica and for Luke if they decide to stick together anyway. Still, we'll have to see what they end up doing rather than assuming what they'll do.
     
  12. kirk55555

    kirk55555 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I liked Alias well enough I suppose, but I became a Jessica Jones fan because of the Pulse, her appearances in Bendis's New avengers, and stuff like that. She's much more interesting when she's not a depressed, single drunk (she's the only female superhero where having a baby was an improvement, unlike Tigra and Jessica drew where it destroyed them as interesting characters). So, her fucking over Luke, stealing their baby and hiding her was irredeemable. It only happened because Bendis has become a hack and wanted to write more of Alias Jessica because thats what the mediocre Netflix show is based on. That Jessica is a idiot and a wreck, so bendis did that to the real Jessica Jones, erasing every bit of character development since she got pregnant (except even shitty Netflix Jessica probably wouldn't steal and hide her baby if the Dad was Luke Cage).

    So, yeah, fuck Bendis, and this version Jessica Jones. The real version before Bendis erased years of history would never have stolen and hidden her own baby from fucking Luke Cage, period. There is no situation where that would happen. The second Dani showed back up, if the current comic was realistic, Luke would have sued for sole custody and probably got it (kidnapping and hiding a baby tends to not go down well with judges, and Luke would probably have had She-Hulk as his lawyer helping). So, I don't know what situation made them retcon Bendis's shit retcons, but much like Carol danvers becoming the villain from Minority Report or Hank Pym beating his wife, some writer fuck ups permanently taint a character. Jessica Jones in the comics is a monster who wouldn't even be allowed to see her kid if the comic was written even remotely well, so who gives a fuck at this point. Jessica is dead, and Luke is presumably just dealing with some mirror universe evil twin created by bendis because Netflix exists.

    As for Dani, like I pointed out she is definitely half African-American in every appearance, and Purple Man was a white guy before he got his powers, and Jessica is totally caucasian as well, so literally the only way they could make Dani not Luke's daughter is to retcon her into being unnaturally tan or something hilariously stupid like that.
     
  13. JD

    JD Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Just to make a slight correction, I believe Hank Pym hitting Janet Van Dyne was a artist fuck up, not a writer fuck not a writer fuck up. If I remeber what I've read correctly, according to the script he was just supposed to push her back, but the artist went overboard and turned it into a big dramatic slap.
     
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  14. Turtletrekker

    Turtletrekker Admiral Admiral

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    Correct.
     
  15. JD

    JD Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    That's it, thanks. So he was actually supposed even less aggressive than I thought.
     
  16. kirk55555

    kirk55555 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I actually knew that, I was specifically thinking about that as a typed it and was using it specifically as an example of an artist specific fuck up, but I screwed up in the typing for some reason :alienblush:
     
  17. Alidar Jarok

    Alidar Jarok Everything in moderation but moderation Moderator

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    For some reason, quotes were getting screwed up.

    kirk55555:
    Did you not finish that story? It was all an act.

    JD:
    Eh, the artist took the fall for the "mistake" instead of letting the future Editor in Chief of Marvel get the blame, but Hank Pym has significant problems even if that page was drawn differently. Even given the benefit of the doubt that he wasn't intended to be intentionally physically abusive, the story clearly intended to show him as emotionally abusive. And that's leaving aside the fact that he has the exact same plan as Syndrome from The Incredibles who at least has the honesty to be called the villain of the story. So Hank Pym is deserving of a lot of blame from that story.

    That being said, I think it's absurd that several other characters have hit their spouses without any long-term consequence while Hank Pym has been redeemed at least a dozen times without ever being able to shake this incident. To me, the reason that is is because people keep bringing it up. Most of the time, they bring it up just to redeem him, but that just starts the cycle over again. I like that Pym is a flawed character; one who is struggling with mental illness (I think his bipolar diagnosis has been canonically established at this point), but that doesn't mean they have to revisit this story as if it's his only story.
     
  18. Turtletrekker

    Turtletrekker Admiral Admiral

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    Avengers 10/700--
    Yay! Agent Coulson has returned from Tahiti!
     
    Last edited: Nov 15, 2018
  19. Guy Gardener

    Guy Gardener Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    This is very serious.

    We have seen a few times where in the future that Kamala Khan is the President of the United States.

    That's fine.

    She's a charismatic woman who saves the world once a week.

    It's entirely possible that Khan could pull at least 35 states, unless racism fizzles out some time before 2044, and then it's a grandslam.

    HOWEVER: I just found out that her powers are related to time travel.

    She gets bigger and smaller by drawing mass, or losing mass from and to the future and the past... But she's also got some functioning capability to time travel "normally" under unusual circumstances.

    Time Traveler becomes President?

    Kamala Khan is going to steal the election of 2044, and if her powers are controlled by her emotional state, rather than conscious will, she may not even realize that she is repeating her losses until they become wins, or that future versions of her self are nudging her up a brighter timeline.
     
  20. Unicron

    Unicron Boss Monster Mod Moderator

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    Yeah, I have no familiarity with the character, but that cover is not a good anatomical perspective. :rommie: