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Looks like Stargate is officially done

SGU didn't work because the writing just wasn't there, period. They tried the gritty feel of BSG, but the SGU charcters just weren't interesting enough to hold our interest.

I think a TNG-style SF show may well work again if it's well-written, as TNG was in its prime. And after almost a decade of dark, gritty SF shows, it might be high time for a more light hearted space opera once again.

Sean

Exactly right.

Think about it.
Stargate in general has never been about smart writing it was good writing with standardized beatable villains, it was about the fun, the adventure, the character's experiences and their good intentions.

While TNG wasn't just about beatable characters, it had truly difficult villains as well. Both SG and TNG had villains we loved to hate. Anubis, Apophsis , Baal, and Q, Lore, Duras but these villains weren't just beatable they were there to make our Heroes better. Like a test.

why didn't they do this? why not stick to what you're good at? i know, i know, they should test their boundaries as writers, but they could have done these gritty eps once a season to test the waters. like have a few members of the crew deserted on a planet.


The problem isn't that they changed style.
It's that they didn't stay true to that style. The problem is they mixed the two styles. The Gritty SGU isn't the proper platform for scientific discoveries and wonders on the other side of the universe, it's not a setting where you entertain philosophical meanderings as you go where no one has gone before. You can't make gritty and real and not have people die. On SGU they keep coming back and that cheapens the style.

The truth is the time for SGU is past...
During the first part of SG-1 was the time for a coarse and realistic military drama where people are dying daily and desperate survival moments. The missed that opportunty when they canceled Atlantis too. With Atlantis I could tell they wanted a more military drama. They brought in more ships, more military presence, Weir gets overridden almost daily, the replaced her with Sam Carter. They brought in that crappy IOA stuff heavy duty.

EVERYTHING at the END of Atlantis pretty much mimicked SGU, even the whole...Baby scenario event with Teyla. They should have done SGU out of Atlantis and kept the two going together.

(Why can't the wormhole drive get Destiny back?):guffaw:
 
Because no one involved wanted to make more of the same. The writers wanted to do something more worthwhile, and the MGM and Syfy wanted to attract younger viewers to the franchise as the demos Atlantis was pulling in were old as hell. SGU hit the right demo's, just no where near the right numbers.

really? i always thought SGU was aiming for ages 30+ because of the dark theme and complete lack of action and humor. i saw SGA/SG1 as attracting young people because it focused on action and humor.
 
Because no one involved wanted to make more of the same. The writers wanted to do something more worthwhile, and the MGM and Syfy wanted to attract younger viewers to the franchise as the demos Atlantis was pulling in were old as hell. SGU hit the right demo's, just no where near the right numbers.

really? i always thought SGU was aiming for ages 30+ because of the dark theme and complete lack of action and humor. i saw SGA/SG1 as attracting young people because it focused on action and humor.

What was the target group of nuBSG and Lost?
 
SGU didn't work because the writing just wasn't there, period. They tried the gritty feel of BSG, but the SGU charcters just weren't interesting enough to hold our interest.

I think a TNG-style SF show may well work again if it's well-written, as TNG was in its prime. And after almost a decade of dark, gritty SF shows, it might be high time for a more light hearted space opera once again.

Sean

Exactly right.

Think about it.
Stargate in general has never been about smart writing it was good writing with standardized beatable villains, it was about the fun, the adventure, the character's experiences and their good intentions.

While TNG wasn't just about beatable characters, it had truly difficult villains as well. Both SG and TNG had villains we loved to hate. Anubis, Apophsis , Baal, and Q, Lore, Duras but these villains weren't just beatable they were there to make our Heroes better. Like a test.

Wasn't Atlantis just a TNG-style SG show? How was that doing in the ratings? Falling every year, I'd thought.
 
Honestly, Destiny's mission isn't even all that interesting...

Definitely don't agree with that assesment, as for me, that was the most interesting aspect of how they moved the series along in Season 2. I could care less about how they got the people home as had the series had its run and told the story they envisioned, either they don't get home, or it's two minutes of managing to dial home from Destiny and seeing them all walk though to the other side and fade to black.
 
Honestly, Destiny's mission isn't even all that interesting...

Definitely don't agree with that assesment, as for me, that was the most interesting aspect of how they moved the series along in Season 2. I could care less about how they got the people home as had the series had its run and told the story they envisioned, either they don't get home, or it's two minutes of managing to dial home from Destiny and seeing them all walk though to the other side and fade to black.


I have to agree with him. Playing out the mission of the Destiny isn't interesting enough, It's worth of only a certain amount of episodes not years of interest. That I think is the critical flaw.
SGU didn't work because the writing just wasn't there, period. They tried the gritty feel of BSG, but the SGU charcters just weren't interesting enough to hold our interest.

I think a TNG-style SF show may well work again if it's well-written, as TNG was in its prime. And after almost a decade of dark, gritty SF shows, it might be high time for a more light hearted space opera once again.

Sean

Exactly right.

Think about it.
Stargate in general has never been about smart writing it was good writing with standardized beatable villains, it was about the fun, the adventure, the character's experiences and their good intentions.

While TNG wasn't just about beatable characters, it had truly difficult villains as well. Both SG and TNG had villains we loved to hate. Anubis, Apophsis , Baal, and Q, Lore, Duras but these villains weren't just beatable they were there to make our Heroes better. Like a test.

Wasn't Atlantis just a TNG-style SG show? How was that doing in the ratings? Falling every year, I'd thought.

TNG was the best of sci fi as ratings go. It's equvialent to SG-1 which also had pretty steady ratings but it being on Saturdays for 7 years out of the way primetime juggernaunts and out of the intenet era can account for that as well as it's pretty solid stories and good effects. Now that's not good enough. Look at Doctor Who...they're on Saturdays too.
 
I think a TNG-style SF show may well work again if it's well-written, as TNG was in its prime.
Absolutely. I think there's an untapped demand for a solid space opera series. But it's not a big market, so we can forget about seeing it on broadcast, and since skiffy seems incapable of producing anything worth watching nowadays, that leaves basic cable like AMC or TNT, or premium cable like HBO.

AMC scored a hit with The Walking Dead and HBO has a modest success in Game of Thrones. Both of those shows premises that are no less outre than a space opera series, even one featuring funny forehead aliens. Use that approach - solid storytelling, compelling characters - and place the story on a spaceship. It can work just as well as either of those shows have.
TNG was the best of sci fi as ratings go. It's equvialent to SG-1 which also had pretty steady ratings but it being on Saturdays for 7 years out of the way primetime juggernaunts and out of the intenet era can account for that as well as it's pretty solid stories and good effects. Now that's not good enough. Look at Doctor Who...they're on Saturdays too.
Not in America. Saturdays are where shows go to die. But there's no reason why a space opera series needs to be treated like a poor relation. Why can't it be prime time Sunday night material?

Stargate in general has never been about smart writing it was good writing with standardized beatable villains, it was about the fun, the adventure, the character's experiences and their good intentions.
Stargate depended on the casting to keep afloat. RDA was very popular, and Joe Flanigan had some of that compelling quality as well. What really sunk SGU is that they didn't find an actor like that and shove him front & center. The producers were apparently unaware of why people were really watching their shows. It sure wasn't for the great writing! :rommie:

I think the Stargate concept is just too viable to let languish forever.
They should really go back to the basics and reboot the spit out of it: people discover a portal to other worlds, which is part of a system created by powerful aliens who style themselves as gods and pose an ongoing threat to Earth.

Then start over from there. It doesn't have to be run by the US military, it doesn't have to be based in Cheyenne Mountain, it doesn't have to be secret from the world, the powerful aliens don't all need to be evil and insane, they don't need to be mind-controlling parasites (although I still think that's a workable angle), the Jaffa don't need to be in the picture (although human slaves taken offworld long ago is still a good idea), and there certainly don't need to be elements like the Ori that have nothing to do with the core idea.

Maybe keep the Goa'uld only as specifically Egyptian pretenders, possibly you could throw the Maya and Aztecs in - anyone with pyramids, that can be the governing factor. It got pretty loopy the way they started delving into Greek, Roman, Norse and Arthurian mythology as though humans were incapable of coming up with mythology on their own.
 
We can't single the reason as to why SG (or any other show for that matter) gets cancelled. To name a few

TV or rather how we watch TV has changed a lot since SG-1 first aired. What with DVR's that allow us to watch when we like rather than watching it live.

TV ratings at times ver the last few years have been flat or showing a downward trend.

Networks air shows on the wrong night/time.

Poor advertising of shows

Sci-Fi shows are generally more expensive to make.

The General Public at times can have an aversion to TV Sci-Fi (yet will happily watch it at the cinema).

Personally I liked all the SG shows, the highlight of SGU has to be any scene Robert Carlyle is on. He steals the show.

If you don't like a particular one, but stop blaming it for the cancelation of your favourite one. It failed for the same reasons not enough people watching.
 
Honestly, Destiny's mission isn't even all that interesting...

Definitely don't agree with that assesment, as for me, that was the most interesting aspect of how they moved the series along in Season 2. I could care less about how they got the people home as had the series had its run and told the story they envisioned, either they don't get home, or it's two minutes of managing to dial home from Destiny and seeing them all walk though to the other side and fade to black.


I have to agree with him. Playing out the mission of the Destiny isn't interesting enough, It's worth of only a certain amount of episodes not years of interest. That I think is the critical flaw.
Exactly right.

Think about it.
Stargate in general has never been about smart writing it was good writing with standardized beatable villains, it was about the fun, the adventure, the character's experiences and their good intentions.

While TNG wasn't just about beatable characters, it had truly difficult villains as well. Both SG and TNG had villains we loved to hate. Anubis, Apophsis , Baal, and Q, Lore, Duras but these villains weren't just beatable they were there to make our Heroes better. Like a test.

Wasn't Atlantis just a TNG-style SG show? How was that doing in the ratings? Falling every year, I'd thought.

TNG was the best of sci fi as ratings go. It's equvialent to SG-1 which also had pretty steady ratings but it being on Saturdays for 7 years out of the way primetime juggernaunts and out of the intenet era can account for that as well as it's pretty solid stories and good effects. Now that's not good enough. Look at Doctor Who...they're on Saturdays too.

yah TNG was epic on TV plus it was a great show.
 
Ya, know, I never understood why Saturday night is the "Night to go to die".

When I was younger, and went clubs all the time, Friday Night was the night to go out, and Saturday Night was the night to have people over (And seems to be everyone's habit, unless they went out both nights, definitely seems more likely people would be home Sat night, then Fri night?). Is it because people will be more likely to pop in a DVD then to watch Broadcast TV when they're home on Saturday Nights?
 
Ya, know, I never understood why Saturday night is the "Night to go to die".
People go out on Fri and Sat night both. Sure, they could set their DVRs, but that means there's some erosion of ad viewing (oddly, not as much as you'd expect, but still).

I think people just have gotten out of the habit of even thinking there's something to DVR on Saturday. On Friday, maybe. But once a habit is broken, it's hard to re-establish. It would be more cost-effective to put effort into establishing Friday as the night to DVR genre TV. Saturday would be a whole new mountain to climb.
 
Ya, know, I never understood why Saturday night is the "Night to go to die".
People go out on Fri and Sat night both. Sure, they could set their DVRs, but that means there's some erosion of ad viewing (oddly, not as much as you'd expect, but still).

I think people just have gotten out of the habit of even thinking there's something to DVR on Saturday. On Friday, maybe. But once a habit is broken, it's hard to re-establish. It would be more cost-effective to put effort into establishing Friday as the night to DVR genre TV. Saturday would be a whole new mountain to climb.
No, that's not what I meant, people seem to think that Friday Night SyFy is the spot to be, and it seems to me, Friday is more of a "Go Out" night than Saturday, so Friday would seem to be even worse a night than Saturday
 
Semi-related; I've read comments on YouTube where people imply the show was canned because of racism against Canada. :guffaw:
 
Ya, know, I never understood why Saturday night is the "Night to go to die".

When I was younger, and went clubs all the time, Friday Night was the night to go out, and Saturday Night was the night to have people over (And seems to be everyone's habit, unless they went out both nights, definitely seems more likely people would be home Sat night, then Fri night?). Is it because people will be more likely to pop in a DVD then to watch Broadcast TV when they're home on Saturday Nights?

most people on here probably don't go out friday nights, let alone saturday nights
 
The episode was the first peak above 1 million in several weeks at 1.097 million viewers.
And improvement of 27 percent. Clearly the Sam Carter fan club has some clout.
 
The episode was the first peak above 1 million in several weeks at 1.097 million viewers.
And improvement of 27 percent. Clearly the Sam Carter fan club has some clout.

Sanctuary was the lead-out, not the lead-in, and Sanctuary pulled even worse numbers than SGU.

Stargate Universe (SYFY, 9pm)
- 1.092 million viewers
- 0.7/1 HH
- 0.4/1 A18-49

Sanctuary (SYFY)
- 0.868 million viewers
- 0.6/1 HH
- 0.2/1 A18-49

That's around a 600k loss for Sanctuary after the day change. Just more evidence of Syfy's scheduling genius :rofl:
 
Naa, Sanctuary has already been renewed. I think they're trying to help some show that is failing badly by giving it the wrestling lead-in (I forget the name), but the fact that they seem to be risking Sanctuary to do it is baffling. They don't seem to realise how damaging these schedules changes are.
 
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