Hey, no need to get personal now.
Looks like DS9 will not get Blu Ray
- Thread starter IronMaiden
- Start date
Also, the upscalled sequences of TNG HD still look like crap even if, objectively, they look better than the DVD's.
And they fulfilled most, if not all, of those requisites.
Also, Relayer1 why do you think they didn't use the 1st Generation copies.
'Objectively, they look better than the DVD's' is probably enough. Not what I'd want, but ANY improvement would be a 'win'. Just hving uncompressed versions would help.
I have no proof 1st Gen originals weren't used, but I believe 1st Gen copies used to be archived copies and not used / expended in the manufacturing process. Of course, with digital copies, that's no longer such an issue.
Agreed, if they try to put out some upscaled rubbish then they can go forth and multiply.
Neither am I.
I don't buy stuff when it's fresh out. I just picked up alk ten seasons of SG1 plus the films for under £40 on DVD. I'd be looking to spend between £50 and £80 on a complete DS9 Bluray set, less if possible.
I've not got them on VHS or DVD so I'm not rebuying anything. I realise most of you wouldn't want to pay out for a small upgrade, but to me it only has to be a roughly similar price to the DVD's and slightly improved quality to sway me from the DVD to the Bluray option.
The problem being you are likely the exception not the rule. Most people who are fans probably own it or have had access to it in one form or another for the last 15 or so years. So the people they have to hook with this project are people who have already bought it once. But if you produce a product with inferior quality and slap it onto a Blu-ray, most will reject it out of hand.
I can verify that, if anecdotally.
I started upgrading my DVD collection, and repurchased TNG seasons 1& 2 and all the movies on BR. Was it a better quality video? Sure! But it did not justify me continuing to buy additional TNG seasons that I already have on DVD.
Just my opinion, but BR is only worth it if you are seeing films, or newer TV shows. Something shot in 4X3 videotape in the 80s or 90s? For me, not worth the money. I'm happy with my DVDs.
If it got the full restoration TNG got, I imagine I would buy some of it. But I'm obviously in the minority, as I bought TNG and it didn't sell very well.
TNG not selling very well on disc or to content distributors, is obviously the 800-pound gorilla in the room. No one can come up with a convincing reason for CBS to spend more money on DS9 for what will likely be a lesser return than what they got on TNG. TOS at least had the new CGI effects as a selling point. Neither TNG nor DS9 have that in their corner.
I love TNG on Blu-ray, a stunning example of what can be accomplished if enough time, money and craftsmanship are committed to a project. But it obviously was only of interest to the hardest of hardcore fans. Not enough to make the project a financial windfall for CBS.
Yeah, don't get me wrong, I would definitely recommend getting the BR version to someone who hasn't already purchased the DVDs. And to be sure TNG Seasons 1&2 IMHO benefit the most from BR, compared to Seasons 3+.
But if someone asked me if it were worth upgrading to BR from an existing DVD collection, I have to say no, unless you can get them used, and sell your DVDs. Just my opinion, and some will disagree with that.
See, my first gut instinct is NO *swears in Klingon* FIGHT ME
but the simple fact is that if you're not overly concerned about image quality, the jump isn't huge, especially regarding season 3 on, like you said. Too many people out there just can't tell the difference; that's why there's stretch-o-vision (wrong aspect ratios), soap opera mode (motion interpolation), DNR ahoy on so many catalog Blu-rays, and so forth and so on.
Then again, I scored a lucky break and got my DVD sets secondhand with nowhere near the expense some people might have had to put out for it, so making the upgrade wasn't as huge of a deal for me, especially with the chatter out there about "buy the Blu-rays, show your support for Trek in HD, etc".
Getting utterly spoiled to Blu-ray quality is a part of it too, of course.
Anyway, this thread:
I agree. I think people are spoiled on BR to an extent, because oftentimes its not a fair comparison. Movies and TV shows shot in HD (in some cases old films too, going way back) and 4K were MADE to be in BR or better. I think its created an unrealistic expectation for some shows shot in video tape, like DS9. Can they be made to look better? Sure! But they will never look as good as film, especially FX made within the last 5 years. At the end of the day, DS9 has been released on VHS, laser disc, and DVD, with DVD being the best of the lot, and really I think the DVDs look fine. If a BR version isn't released, while unfortunate, at least the DVDs exist.
Well let's keep it clear. TNG and DS9 and a large number of the TV shows we may think of as not-so-hot on DVD were actually shot on film; they were simply mastered on video.
Anything shot on film is going to hold up on Blu-ray IF it's treated properly, but bringing it from a video master (which is going to be locked to 480p resolution) is just not going to fly in HD. Thus the TNG-R process, which was, for anybody unclear, essentially the entire post-production process for the show having to be done again, 20+ years later, minus the actual effects filming and music recording. Everything else including the visual effects compositing and the audio mixing (to update for 7.1 surround) had to be done again for the most part just as it was before the show aired in the first place.
That costs money, in addition to the film scanning process itself. The money is why it appears extremely unlikely that DS9 and VOY will get the Blu-ray treatment, without some serious reshuffling or reprioritizing going on.
Anything shot on film is going to hold up on Blu-ray IF it's treated properly, but bringing it from a video master (which is going to be locked to 480p resolution) is just not going to fly in HD. Thus the TNG-R process, which was, for anybody unclear, essentially the entire post-production process for the show having to be done again, 20+ years later, minus the actual effects filming and music recording. Everything else including the visual effects compositing and the audio mixing (to update for 7.1 surround) had to be done again for the most part just as it was before the show aired in the first place.
That costs money, in addition to the film scanning process itself. The money is why it appears extremely unlikely that DS9 and VOY will get the Blu-ray treatment, without some serious reshuffling or reprioritizing going on.
It's a shame to hear that Next Generation didn't sell very well on Blu ray. I was really hoping DS9 would come to Blu ray at some point, I've really enjoyed these releases and DS9 is my favourite series.
I only just upgraded - got the whole series box set for £80 (about $120) as I didn't see it getting any cheaper. And even that was an indulgence, rather than essential purchase.
The DVDs aren't really worth anything though.
Whilst I love the care taken over remaking the original FX for TNG, optional new CGI as well would have got me buying sooner, and spending more.
I'm glad I upgraded to Blu. I don't know about the U.S. DVD sets, but the Australian TNG DVD's were awful. Though, I might have done the wrong thing for CBS's profit margins by holding out for the complete series bluray box set.
Not really surprised about DS9 though. It's something I want, but never really expected to get. At least it's not going to be like the HD Buffy, where they cheaply half ass it and make everything freaking yellow and pink.
And the cropping. Oh god, the cropping.
Not really surprised about DS9 though. It's something I want, but never really expected to get. At least it's not going to be like the HD Buffy, where they cheaply half ass it and make everything freaking yellow and pink.
And the cropping. Oh god, the cropping.
I wonder if the increased expense would've been offset by increased sales?
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