Fair point. Thinking about it like that, it does seem more understandable.
Jessica Jones-- Marvel/Netflix
- Thread starter Turtletrekker
- Start date
First off, just because their stated goal was to contain the fight, that doesn't mean they succeeded.
Second, even a 3-block radius would be an enormous amount of destruction. The impact of the 9/11 disaster was probably comparable to that. There's not only the immediate danger from building collapses, there's the health hazard to the populace for days or weeks thereafter from all the dust and the toxic building materials and chemicals and combustion products released into the environment. TV and movies tend to ignore this, but the collapse of even a single skyscraper is an environmental disaster. Three blocks' worth of the city being destroyed would have a massive impact on the rest of the city.
Third, aside from the physical impact, there's the economic impact. A disaster like that could send the city's economy into a deep recession. That's what I've always assumed to be the main impact on Hell's Kitchen -- not the physical damage, but the economic impact reversing the increased prosperity of the neighborhood.
I certainly saw more damage than just one building. And the camera could only point in one direction at a time.
But Transformers and Man of Steel are terrible models for comparison because they exaggerate the destruction to a cartoonishly unreasonable degree. By any realistic standard, three blocks' worth of destruction in the heart of a major city would be a huge disaster and would probably have a very significant death toll. Remember the facts of 9/11. "Only" about a dozen buildings were damaged or destroyed, and there were a couple of hours to evacuate them before the collapses happened, but 2,606 people still died in and around the towers, including hundreds of police officers, fire fighters, and rescue workers in the hours after the attack. It's not remotely hard to believe that a sudden massive attack on a three-block radius with much less time to evacuate would have a comparable or larger death toll -- both the immediate civilian casualties and the accumulating casualties of rescue workers after the fact. Not to mention the long-term death toll from smoke inhalation, exposure to carcinogens, and the like.
So Jessica Jones's claims about the impact of the Battle of New York make perfect sense if you base your comparison on reality instead of Michael Bay movies.
I don't know what you're basing that on. Alias took care to show that Killgrave never actually raped Jessica per se, just made her watch while he raped other women. This show makes it clear that he did rape Jessica. So I'd say you have it exactly backward about which treatment was worse.
^And that is the show's strength -- that it didn't focus pruriently and exploitatively on the acts of violation themselves, but instead concentrated on the consequences and recovery afterward. There are far, far too many works of fiction that depict rape for lurid entertainment value and pretend it's done to give female characters depth. And that tends to alienate female audiences. This past year, works like Mad Max: Fury Road and Jessica Jones have proven that you don't need to show the actual assault in order to show its personal consequences or the way that female characters recover from it and transcend it.
Actually, IIRC in the comics he never actually laid a finger on her and you never saw much of what he did do so it was by no means lurid or exploitative. What he did (as related by Jessica) was make her *want* him to do it, even beg him to while she's forced to watch him have his way with some poor college girl he grabbed off the street.
I brought this up earlier in the thread and I'm still not sure which version is the greater violation.
I've read that according to at least some survivors, the act itself isn't the worst part, it's how the attacker can get inside their head and terrorise them for years afterwards without ever needing to even see them again.
The show seemed to want to take the subject more directly on the nose while the comics came at it from a more circumspect angle.
But then the Purple Man in the comics is at his core much more of a pure sadist, having received his powers as an adult. Where Kilgrave in the show is more a product of his powers having shaped him since childhood.
In that respect, the different approaches make sense, each in their own context.
Yeah, you really just don't get it.
Yes, he does. Sure, the things in the comic were worse. But it's not about the details of the act here, just that they happened. This show is not about giving us unsettling images of women being mistreated. It's about showing what it does to someone, having to go through torture and abuse like Jessica did, and how someone deals with it.
When I saw this tough, superstrong woman having panic attacks and flashbacks, that was more than enough to drive home to me that something truly horrible had happened in her past. I didn't need to see the grisly details.
Wasn't it Alfred Hitchcock who said that the horrors you don't see are much more disturbing than the ones you do see?
Wasn't it Alfred Hitchcock who said that the horrors you don't see are much more disturbing than the ones you do see?
Finished the show. It was ok. I liked DD and Arrow better though. JJ was a slow burn, maybe too slow in parts. My only gripe is all the gore and sex. It felt like Marvel deliberately trying to make this show as graphic as possible, because they could. I don't think the comics ever went this far. I would've have still liked the show without these aspects, but they were there. For the record, I found the scene with the Kingpin decapitating the guy with the car door, equally gratuitous.
I'll watch season 2 for sure though. Now on to Avengers EMH.
I'll watch season 2 for sure though. Now on to Avengers EMH.
Actually, IMHO, the show is tame compared to the comic. The comic is littered with f-bombs.
Is it really? I don't follow a lot of modern comics. I live mostly in the late seventies to early 90's.
The comic that "Jessica Jones" is based on, called "Alias", was a part of Marvel's MAX line, which were intended for a readership of 18 and over.
Hilariously one did wonder if there were people under 18 reading comics, that such a distinction was really necessary.
Sayeth what? I've never heard of Marvel MAX, until now. That sounds so dirty. Haha
Max started in 2001 after the Comics Code Authority, a toothless placater of McCarthist asshole dinosaurs, wouldn't sign off on some of Marvels "edgier" books. Alias, known as the sodomy comic, was allowed to be created because the CCA was no longer there, not the event that triggered Marvel's departure. The Comic's Code Authority ran out of steam in 2010, and the sky did not fall.
What I really loved here, in Jessica Jones....
What Hollywood does a lot, is when women are victims of abuse, they're either portrayed as coming to terms with it in a very short time span, finding their peace of mind becoming strong and functioning members of society, or as weaping and depressed little bundles of helplesness (which is rather insulting).
In real life though, most victims of abuse tend to abuse and use others aswell. Bullies, for example, tend to have been bullied a lot themselves. And when abuse happens to men, Hollywood has no issue of portraying them as 'bad'. With women, however, they hardly ever do that.
Jessica, even though her heart was surely in the right place, used and abused people a lot, including herself. She is not a nice person, not the plucky hero in our story. She can be mean. She blames herself, but can't cope with it, so all her good actions are mostly motivated by guilt. She was to blame for Kilgrave still being around, so she needs to fix it, no matter what, others be damned. It always surprises her when she acts for the good of others (Hope, Malcom, Luke), but she always hesitates before she acts, as if she's wondering wether she has time to help someone who's weak. When she was weak, no one helped her, no one had time for her, so why should she?
That's why we have Trish. Trish is us, as the viewer. She sees in Jessica what is good, what is right. And like Trish, we also wish we could help Jessica, no matter what, even though we sometimes are disgusted by her actions and motivations.
What Hollywood does a lot, is when women are victims of abuse, they're either portrayed as coming to terms with it in a very short time span, finding their peace of mind becoming strong and functioning members of society, or as weaping and depressed little bundles of helplesness (which is rather insulting).
In real life though, most victims of abuse tend to abuse and use others aswell. Bullies, for example, tend to have been bullied a lot themselves. And when abuse happens to men, Hollywood has no issue of portraying them as 'bad'. With women, however, they hardly ever do that.
Jessica, even though her heart was surely in the right place, used and abused people a lot, including herself. She is not a nice person, not the plucky hero in our story. She can be mean. She blames herself, but can't cope with it, so all her good actions are mostly motivated by guilt. She was to blame for Kilgrave still being around, so she needs to fix it, no matter what, others be damned. It always surprises her when she acts for the good of others (Hope, Malcom, Luke), but she always hesitates before she acts, as if she's wondering wether she has time to help someone who's weak. When she was weak, no one helped her, no one had time for her, so why should she?
That's why we have Trish. Trish is us, as the viewer. She sees in Jessica what is good, what is right. And like Trish, we also wish we could help Jessica, no matter what, even though we sometimes are disgusted by her actions and motivations.
There's also some pretty obvious nudity, hidden by silhouette, but still clearly there.
In fairness, while I can't speak for back then, I went to a comic shop on free comic book day and found it pretty all-ages. Maybe not generally, but at least on special occasions. The 18+ rating is frustrating because it isn't on Marvel Unlimited and I have to pay extra money to own a physical copy (not that I mind, but it wasn't my original plan).
The New York Post put up a brief article questioning whether The Defenders (or at least, having Jessica as part of Defenders) is necessary. Not that I buy the argument that Defenders is the reason for a delay of a season two of Jessica Jones - it certainly didn't prevent Marvel and Netflix churning out the second season of Daredevil.
Well, originally, we weren't going to get a second season of Daredevil before Defenders either. It was the epic response to DD S1 that fast-tracked the second season. The second most illegally downloaded show of the year, behind Game of Thrones. That's prestige!
ETA: And the article really does come off as self-entitled whining. "I want more, and I want it now!"
ETA: And the article really does come off as self-entitled whining. "I want more, and I want it now!"
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