JAMES CAWLEY SPEAKS!

Discussion in 'Fan Productions' started by HerbFlynn, Apr 5, 2017.

  1. 9gs

    9gs Commander Red Shirt

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    True. Ray talked about the owner of the building in an interview and how that person was very nice and understanding. He also talked about the rental costs saying it was significantly less than what STC was paying.
     
  2. YJAGG

    YJAGG Captain Captain

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    Some STC & NV episodes were better than Discovery ...
     
  3. Serveaux

    Serveaux The Wind Premium Member

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    Well...no. And I loath STD.
     
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  4. Serveaux

    Serveaux The Wind Premium Member

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    True, but you do have to know what to do with the money and how to do it.

    I am not, by any means, a fan of STC or the folks behind it.
     
  5. plynch

    plynch Commodore Commodore

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    Those of you who are professionals, what do you see in STC that is subpar that we -- who think it is, or is close to pro standards -- are missing?

    I really like and admire their eps. Though use of the original music throughout bugs me from a copyright standpoint.
     
  6. Potemkin_Prod

    Potemkin_Prod Commodore Commodore

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    Kinda off topic, imo.
     
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  7. Maurice

    Maurice Vice Admiral Premium Member

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    I think anyone who knowns enough people who've worked around Mr. Cawley, especially in the early days, have heard that he always wanted to figure out a way to make money off his interest in Star Trek, and so it's unsurprising that he'd be upset if someone else was for-free allowing people wander sets which are—for all practical purposes—virtually the same as his, thus potentially costing him a few customers. But honestly it's a tad hypocritical on his part, since how many fans did he let tour his sets over the years prior to getting his deal? If the Georgia sets were opened often it would be a concern, but as of now this appears to be a one-time thing that no one was charged for.

    As to the "minimum standard" thing, well, it is rather off-topic, but in short fanfilm scripts are typically poorly constructed narratively speaking, and far too interested in fan-service and connecting-the-dots. This includes STC. To go into specifics would be really off topic tho, but I believe some of us have articulated issues with their scripts in some of the episode threads in this forum.
     
  8. Mytran

    Mytran Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Didn't STC start recording their own music after the first few episodes?
     
  9. plynch

    plynch Commodore Commodore

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    OK, I'll move on, though discussions are by nature discursive, hence the word, "discussion."

    ANYWHO, there is a bit of extra music thrown in, composed by Vic IIRC, but the bulk of the soundtrack is original series. Unless they hired an orch to re-record it all. Which I doubt.
    But I'm not all the way through. I've been rationing these out, and maybe later ones go all original?

    My problem is, they can't just insert footage from the original ep, why do they think they can insert sound recordings of music from the original? Are they sourcing them from the La-La set? Just wondering, and yes off-topic, my bad.
     
  10. Phoenix219

    Phoenix219 Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    They did have an orchestra.
     
  11. Mytran

    Mytran Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I think I remember Vic saying in a podcast interview that they started recording original music around episode 3 or 4 (which was the custom at the time, for many fan productions)
     
  12. Firebird

    Firebird Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    Andy Farber did scores for episodes 4, 5, 6, and 11, with some minor "library" cues for episode 7, IIRC. Vic did smaller cues here and there throughout, and did re-edits and remixes to adjust TOS cues to fit the pacing of scenes in STC.
     
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  13. Maurice

    Maurice Vice Admiral Premium Member

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    I don't mind detours within a subject. I only get irritated when the main thread gets lost and only the detours remain. :)
     
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  14. seigezunt

    seigezunt Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I really try to avoid getting in the weeds vis a vis all the years-old rivalries and beefs in the fan film community. Filling my head with other people's vendettas has resulted in my missing out on some good experiences, so I've tried to just focus on what affects my own experience as a fan.

    I'm okay on many of the fan films, but they are fan films, and I'm sorry, but I just find the supposition that they are better than what the pros are doing ... I find it comical. Nothing on the amazing attention to detail and love put into the look of the films, but they don't hold the same entertainment value for me.

    All that said, I've been to Ticonderoga three times, twice for the convention, and I thank God that this place exists. The Northeast doesn't really offer as much as other parts of the country in terms of content for Trekkies (I'm not a fan of Creation cons) and Cawley has built a mecca for this old TOS fan, and their little con is the highlight of my year. My observations of James is that he's been pretty high-road most of the time about the other productions, diplomatic about individuals who have not returned the favor. I cut him an admittedly enormous amount of slack because he's accomplished something that's bringing joy into the world. For as pricey as some events are at the museum, there is always a tier for fans like me who don't have a lot of cash, and there are opportunities for experiences that I thought had died with the old fan-run conventions of the 70s and 80s.

    I'm not concerned about him venting about this. If the other event had been closer, I still would have checked it out, and I would still continue spending my money in New York.
     
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  15. Potemkin_Prod

    Potemkin_Prod Commodore Commodore

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    There's plenty of room for all fan films, all fan studios.

    We have the Potemkin Pictures Open Studio, an open house event at our studios every other year. No admission required. We give tours of the sets, answer questions from our fellow fans, and let them take pictures of themselves on the sets. Everyone has a great time, and we actually find and interview fans and other interested parties (i.e. actors) who are interested in becoming involved with our productions.

    The same was true for the annual Farragut Fest / Farragut Open House (held in Farragut Studios, the same studios they transferred to Star Trek Continues, the same studios as Stage 9, in fact). I think they charged some nominal admission fee the last year, but fans were everywhere in their 10,000 sqft facility. Potemkin Pictures had representatives attend the event each year (heck, I did it twice myself). We shared our movies with their audiences and ran a panel for them. It's great fun to meet all sorts of fans and fan film producers.

    The Starbase Oklahoma group also had several open house events where they gave tours of their sets, answered questions from fans, solicited help in the form of donations, and, like Potemkin, reached out to fans who were interested in becoming involved with their productions.

    While I didn't personally attend Stage 9's event this year, it sounds like it was great fun. They didn't charge admission. Fans got to watch the Dreadnought Dominion group film a production; they got to tour the sets, meet other fans, and basically rejoice in our mutual love for Star Trek.

    Axanar opened their sets to the public as a part of their Axacon convention. They were there, answering questions, showing off their sets, and interacting with their fans.

    Glen Wolfe and Dan Reynolds WARP Studio D debuted their studios this weekend by filming "Galaxy Hopper" (one of the new releases from Federation Files). I'm sure at some point they'll invite fans to come to their studios, just as the other studios have been doing since before Mr. Cawley purchased a license for his Star Trek Original Series Set Tour.

    I can't see the Museum tour being anything like these events, and I'm sorry that Mr. Cawley seems threatened by them.
     
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  16. Jedi_Master

    Jedi_Master Admiral Admiral

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    Surely you can understand why a person who owns a business that depends on PAYING customers would be frustrated by folks offering a lesser quality product for FREE.

    Point of order, and one that seems strange that you would skip over - the Axanar "set tour" was NOT FREE.
     
  17. FormerLurker

    FormerLurker Commodore Commodore

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    He'd likely be even more pissed if the FREE product was of SUPERIOR quality (they're probably about the same, actually).
     
  18. Potemkin_Prod

    Potemkin_Prod Commodore Commodore

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    Not at all. Isn't that, in fact, what FAN FILMS are? Of course, he's forgotten those sets were built not for his for-profit museum tour, but for fan films. He got financial support to build them. He got monies to produce fan films, including some which he has decided not to produce. Others have done the same and reaped quite a bit of hostility over it. Why are you willing to give Mr. Cawley a pass on it?

    I would think everyone KNEW that Axacon was not free since there's this thread here that mocks him for charging so much.

    Mr. Cawley himself has repeatedly asserted that his sets are vastly superior to those of Farragut/STC/Stage 9. Obviously if his sets are so superior, I'm sure the fans will flock to see his studio tour.
     
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  19. Jedi_Master

    Jedi_Master Admiral Admiral

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    One could seek refuge from the summer sun with the shade thrown by this post. It seems that the fan film world continues to eat its own.

    Are you asserting @Potemkin_Prod that Mr. Cawley built the sets, acquired/leased the building that houses them, paid the CBS license, and maintains all of the above solely from fan donations? Surely you have been around in the fan film world long enough to know how much of his own time and money James put into Ticonderoga, and the fan film world in general.

    Please keep in mind that the "others" (which is actually just one person) who have done the "same" (actually something completely different) squandered the funds they acquired, did not actually make anything in the boondoggle of the "studio" they funded with donations, collected a healthy salary in the interim, and happily spent donated funds on personal expenses. I recognize the fact that your production group has happily joined the Fan Film Forum crew, but I would think that your posts would be more accurately constructed, and would acknowledge the vast differences between Jonathan's favorite friend and James Cawley.
     
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  20. Maurice

    Maurice Vice Admiral Premium Member

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    I think this is getting needlessly confrontational. Cawley did actually make a bunch of fanfilms, raised money, and failed to deliver on some of them, and some backers feel he took their money to help him start a business. Other fanfilm projects have raised money and flat out failed to deliver. Axanar just took this kind of thing to a whole new level of outright fraud.