James Cameron's Avatar Sequels Possible Titles Revealed

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by JD, Nov 2, 2018.

  1. Ethros

    Ethros Vice Admiral Admiral

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    This is what makes me laugh. I'll guarantee you half the people who criticise this when it comes out will have watched it on a tiny laptop or phone screen with mono sound. Probably on a bad stream. "urgh that sucked.."

    But why do so many people have such a problem with Avatar? Like if you didn't like it and it wasn't for you that's fine. But 13 years on why does it still have so many haters, who still have to tell EVERYONE whenever it's mentioned, annouce to the world how they didn't like it and use that boring old "Dances with Smurfs" thing. Yeah the aliens are blue... and? Is that even meant be a critiscim?
    I always think of that Mean Girls quote/meme "Why are you so obsessed with me?"

    I know that happens in a lot of fandom, but Avatar especially seems to get the brunt. Is it because it made so much money? In real life too I notice it, esp among men. As if it's cool to say it sucked. "It may be the biggest movie ever but I know better than everyone and I say it sucked!"

    Like Pirates of the Carribean, Fast & Furious, Mission Impossible, Harry Potter are all big franchises that make big bucks I'm not into or interested in. Maybe seen one of each and don't care about seeing more. I don't have to shout to the world about how I disliked them when a new one is released. I'm just not interested.

    I'm just so bored on focus-on-negativity fandom now, I actually don't want to look at too much discussion and promo for this movie, as I know is it will be so full of toxic negativity throughout.

    Anyway... loved the trailer. That theme at 0:13- is beautiful. Watched it on my 65" TV on the YouTube app, and if it looks that good on there how amazing is it gonna look on 3D Imax.
    I'll be there release day, regardless what the moaners want to say.
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2022
  2. Reverend

    Reverend Vice Admiral Admiral

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    The negative backlash for the first movie was kind of hilarious. It was like watching people be mad at a puppy because it's cute. Like they're jealous of all the attention or something.

    Yeah, the story was basic. It wasn't trying to be deep, complex, or morally grey. "Environmental destruction and colonial abuse of native populations in the name of greed = bad!" is a nice simple premise. That's a good thing for a spectacle movie, because you want to audience to actually follow what's going on before they can be immersed into that world, or invested in the characters. Moreover; just like Star Wars, it's primary audience is clearly meant to be children. You know, the ones that NEED simple archetypal stories in their formative years? There are certainly worse things than helping to raise a generation of environmentalists with an innate distrust of large corporate entities, and militaristic authoritarianism.

    Also; you know what happens when you mix a convoluted plot, complex morals, mated with stunning visuals and elaborate action sequences? You get a well intentioned but confused, noisy mess like 'Valerian And The City Of A Thousand Planets', and when was the last time anyone gave a shite about that movie?

    Is Avatar the best movie ever? Fuck no! Is it a solid, well made and fun popcorn movie that does not treat it's audience with cynical contempt? *coughs*michaelbay*coughs* Fuck yes!
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2022
  3. crookeddy

    crookeddy Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Yeah, I think the overhype of Avatar but some who loved it made it "cool" to hate on it - and that stuck.
     
  4. Forbin

    Forbin Admiral Admiral

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    I'd say it DOES treat us with cynical contempt, since the point of it seems to be bludgeoning us over the head with the cliche trope that we humans are evil and greedy and immoral and destructive and murderous (like, duh) (and of course the paramilitary commander is the most cliche, gung-ho asshole possible). Aaaand of course it uses the tired old Noble Savage trope to facilitate the message. And worst of all, it uses the "Mighty Whitey" trope as a resolution - only a sympathetic white guy 'gone native' has the power to save the Noble Savages - which has been considered an elitist and insulting story element for ages. It's like a high school freshman wrote it.
     
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  5. Reverend

    Reverend Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Well, congratulations for having a slightly firmer grasp on human nature and historical precedent than the 11 year old target audience! Bravo!
    Also you may want to check the dictionary. I don't think "cynical" means what you think it means.
     
    Last edited: May 11, 2022
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  6. Ethros

    Ethros Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I think on the main selling points and why it was so popular was how beautiful it looks. That's what his new trailer is banking on too. And I think insecure, toxic masculinity, young men are terrified of saying or commenting on that. So they have to just say "urgh it's shit" and go back to their Scarface, Goodfellas, Wolf of Wall Street etc type of movies they're only allowed to like
     
  7. M'rk son of Mogh

    M'rk son of Mogh Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    *13 years later, turns on the news*

    Seems the movie was still too subtle. Things have somehow gotten worse.
     
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  8. Reverend

    Reverend Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Evan after a decade and more, I still find it endlessly amusing. I mean seriously, of all the hills to die on, why do some people pick the "I hate the blue cat people do Dances with Wolves in Fern Gully movie" one? What is it about a lot of people liking a pretty, easily digestible thing with a primary colours plot and moral stance that drives them into such a bitter frothing rage?

    It's kind of response I'm much more used to seeing from the "how dare females/non-straight white people be in a thing I pretend to like" crowd.
     
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  9. Reverend

    Reverend Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Is "maybe don't murder people and nick all their stuff for fun and profit" seriously what passes for "liberal" these days?

    Next thing it'll be "the abolition of slavery, the compulsory serving of asparagus at breakfast, and free corsets for the under-fives!"
     
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  10. Starkers

    Starkers Admiral Admiral

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    I really should watch Avatar again. I only saw it once at the cinema and I thought it was decent enough, but it didn't really grab me if I'm honest. I found the 3D less immersive and more distracting and if I do "hate" Avatar for anything it's heralding in an era of shitty 3D (and yes, I know that's unfair because Cameron never intended people to make shitty 3D films but this is what lit the touch paper all the same).

    I remember being really impressed with the final battle (and in fact at the time thought it was the closest we might ever get to a Rogue Trooper movie, and might still be because I don't know what's happening with Doug Jones' Rogue film).

    Not sure if I'll go see this at the cinema or not. It looks incredibly beautiful for sure, but at the moment it also looks like a bunch of cut scenes from a video game so I'll reserve judgement until a see a trailer that gives some indication of story.

    It also irks that a Director whose films I adore and who in less than fifteen years gave us Terminator, Aliens, The Abyss, T2, True Lies and Titanic has, in 25 years since Titanic, made only three films, only one of which we've even seen yet (and yes I'm self aware enough to realise that Cameron has earned the right to make the kind of films he wants to, that he sure as hell isn't beholden to me or my needs, and that has has made several documentaries).

    I just wonder what might have been. I don't know if anyone else listens to the Scriptnotes podcast but to this day John August and Craig Mazin laud Cameron's Aliens script as one of the best ever written.
     
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  11. Forbin

    Forbin Admiral Admiral

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    I said out, dammit!
    Dude, what the hell? Where did I insult you?
     
  12. Kaiju

    Kaiju Admiral Admiral

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    The trailer got close to 150 million views in its first 24 hours online, surpassing The Rise of Skywalker.
     
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  13. Ethros

    Ethros Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Let's hope it also does in terms of writing & story


    "Somehow Quaritch returned"
     
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  14. Thestral

    Thestral Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Speaking just for myself I wouldn't say I hated it by any means (I also love a good simple story well-told, and my Fern Gully comparisons were more a warm befuddlement) but the constant raving about it was just a little much in terms of it being so revolutionary. It was really, really good but... maybe I just didn't/don't appreciate the technical aspects enough?

    I also didn't really feel any real connection to the characters. I understand there's a lot of wordlbuilding that went into it? But somehow I didn't come away from the movie all that interested in learning more about the world.

    That said... I'm totally gonna watch the sequel because when has a James Cameron movie not been excellent?
     
    Last edited: May 12, 2022
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  15. saddestmoon

    saddestmoon Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    [enters chat]

    Well I’m looking forward to it, despite it ‘been a long long time / getting from here to there…’ and I still have ‘faith of the heart’


    [exits chat]
     
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  16. Reverend

    Reverend Vice Admiral Admiral

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    From my memory, most of the praise (from the cinematically literate) was almost entirely of the technical persuasion. Which seemed valid enough for me. It was a quantum leap forward in performance capture in both detail and scale, the art design was gorgeous, and the execution of the digital environments was far beyond anything even attempted before. And that's without taking into account the fact that this was the first (and so far only) time 3D cinema no only actually *worked*, but actively enhanced the experience in a way that watching it at home on the small screen just can't replicate.

    Yeah, the characters were two dimensional and the plot was paint by numbers; but that was intentional. It wasn't trying to be anything other than a simple morality play. And why cute cat people? Obviously to get the digital characters to read as both appealing and relatable, while avoiding the uncanny valley.

    I'm far from the biggest fan of this movie, and I have no issue with any legitimate criticisms (I have plenty myself), or people that just honestly and truly weren't into it.
    I just find the bitter, raw hatred some seem to have for it baffling given how inoffensive the whole thing is. It's like watching people shout abuse at a rainbow.
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2022
  17. Starscream2112

    Starscream2112 Commander Red Shirt

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    So I wonder if 3d tvs will be a thing again once this is released?
     
  18. Starkers

    Starkers Admiral Admiral

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    I saw the trailer again in IMAX this afternoon. Can't say it doesn't look visually impressive!
     
  19. Ethros

    Ethros Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Yeah I loved it but I'd never claim the plot or story was revolutionary. I mean this trailer literally gives away the entire plot and most of the movie-


    I've watched it a few times at home since then obviously, but it never really feels the same as it did at the theater, that massive screen and the 3D. Remember that first shot with the water droplet/s. Never has quite the same effect at home.

    Maybe this sounds silly, but I do think if you never saw it like that you didn't properly see it, if you know what I mean. Even back then the best most people had was probably watching it on a 28" TV on 480p DVD. Or even worse a laptop. A lot of the people I worked with back around 2010 who slated it had watched it like that anyway
     
    Last edited: May 13, 2022
  20. thribs

    thribs Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I wish. I want a new tv but I want one with 3D.