Is Star Trek 2009 overhyped by desesperate Trek fans?

[Jon1701]

One of the things that constantly amazes me is the assumption that Trek fans can all agree.

On anything.

There is not a movie, nor single episode of any show that we can all agree was fantastic. If you shout loud enough, you'll have plenty of takers agreeing that Balance of Terror was shit, or that Best of Both Worlds was hackneyed.

Here's a newsflash folks, people aren't always going to agree with you...

 

[Gepard]

Here's a newsflash folks, people aren't always going to agree with you...

I disagree!

 

[Cdr MacDuff]

I think we can all agree that it is definitely designed as a blockbuster action 'popcorn flick.' Fair enough. And I think that there's room for that in the Trek universe. Trek has certainly done its share of high octane action over the years, and it has most definitely had its fair share of stories that were brainless.

However, I will be very disappointed if this becomes the template on which all future Trek is built and we can never deviate from that formula. Trek has always been a mixture of story types and I hope to see that continue. In short, I'm willing to accept that a 'Star Trek' can be a viable part of the franchise, but I'd like it to also be accepted that a 'The Motion Picture' can too.

Thats also my take on it. While I"m happy about the commercial success of the new movie. Which was a good movie. I at the same time don't want it to become the template for all future Trek movie. I say keep the action, production value and humor, but give us a little more substance. More drama, mystery/exploration and/or social commentary. Lets say that I want the next movie to be a "Batman Begins" not a "Batman and Robin".
I wish fans will continue to discuss the movie with its positive and negative. When we discuss the negative of the movie, some people shouldn't consider it as a complete bash on the whole movie. I thought the movie was enjoyable, it had action and humor, but it did lack some substance. The best part was seeing the reunification of the rebooted Trek characters, which was well handled. It was fun to see how Kirk, Spock, Uhura and Co all met each other in this alternate timeline. But the next movie won't have the novelty of presenting us with the reunification of the old characters. I fear a 2 dimensional villain with dubious motives and a 2 dimensional planet killer plot will be too thin to make a good movie this time around.

 

[Kpnuts]

I hate the new film. It's not Star Trek. It is rubbish. I am right. You are wrong.

It says Star Trek in the title, it's now canon, the huge majority love the film, therefore it's a huge sucess, (and as you're so fond of putting it...) suck it.

 

[Jon1701]

Here's a newsflash folks, people aren't always going to agree with you...

I disagree!

What do you mean you don't agree with me?

You don't share my opinion?

 

[TheGodBen]

Of course it's easier to say it had no substance. That doesn't require any thinking about what happened on the screen! The people who disliked the film often complain that it didn't make them think, and I say it's because they were making such an effort not to think that nothing any movie could have done would make them think.

What a silly thought process.

I'm currently rewatching Voyager and reviewing each episode in the Voyager forum because I'm an extreme masochist, so my brain has become trained on thinking about what I'm watching so that I can talk about it later on. I went to see Star Trek in the same mindset, I was constantly analysing what was going on while watching the movie.

As far as I am concerned a bad story is one which requires you to turn off your brain at the start so that you can enjoy the "fun" adventure. I can't turn off my brain on a whim, if I could I wouldn't suffer from a mild form of insomnia.

A good story is one which manages to turn your brain off without you realising it has happened. I'm in the minority here because the movie failed to do this for me, this seems to be what happened for the majority. I would also argue that is is what happened to me during many of the previous Trek movies, for some reason they managed to engross me in a way that this new movie failed to.

A great form of entertainment doesn't need to turn your brain off, it manages to be both fun and challenging. I doubt many people would make the claim that Star Trek was a challenging movie.

 

[stonester1]

It doesn't have to be "challenging" to have intellectual merit. It doesn't have to be "challenging" to be good.

In fact, it can be smart as hell and still not be a good movie.

Star Trek succeeds because it is entertaining as all get out and STILL manages some smarts. But people enjoy it en masse because it isn't pretentious about it.

 

[VulcanJedi]

I may be playing the devil's advocate here. But I got the feeling that a lot of Trek fans, including me, at some point, are overhyping the movie in desperation.

A lot of us, thought or at least worried, that Star Trek as a TV/Movie franchise was now death for a couple of years. Enterprise didn't have the same commercial success than preceding series, while the recent movies didn't either. Star Trek have been around almost every year since 1987, its incredible in television history. It felt realistic to expect tptb (executives) to put Star Trek to rest for a couple of years. Maybe even something like 10, 15 or 20 years.

Now here come the big surprise. They announce a new Star Trek movie, headed by a director on the rise (JJ Abrams). Already at that point its beyond our wildest dreams. Its not about the quality of the product anymore, its about the survival of our beloved franchise. We don't mind if Star Trek have become only a brainless action blockbuster movie anymore. Average Trek is better than no Trek. Sure the movie have many faults, but we dont care. Star Trek is alive and its a commercial success!

Is it the right signal to send? Thats is Average Trek is better than no Trek.

I must admit that somehow I feel the same way. The franchise needed a commercial success at that point. But I got another signal to send. Now that the introduction of the rebooted characters is over. I wish the next Trek movie will have a stronger storyline.

I've talked to several people in the last couple weeks who loved the movie. One person was trying to make the Vulcan hand sign--the next day. This is NOT a Trek fan.

People, non trek fans, actually like the movie. Yes, it's exciting.

 

[Phily B]

I still haven't seen a decent argument as to why it isn't Star Trek - there are plenty of episodes of the TV show that are less Star Trek than this.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

I hate the new film. It's not Star Trek. It is rubbish. I am right. You are wrong.

You are "right" only when you say that you hate the film. When you say it's rubbish or (egads!) "not Star Trek" you are expressing nothing more interesting than an opinion.

We can all play this game as well or better than you, you know. Here: this movie is clearly Star Trek, and it is great. I am always right, and you have no grounds on which to dispute me.

"Root beer" is absolute? WTF?

 

[theFirebottle]

Another groundbreaking concept a communication officer who can actually communicate. Oh wait its been done before SATO.

Yeah, except ENT was next to unwatchable for me. I don't know whether it was bad or good, I simply couldn't watch it.

 

[TheGodBen]

It doesn't have to be "challenging" to have intellectual merit.

Yes, it does. By challenging I don't mean that it should be a struggle, I just mean that doesn't try to stop you from thinking too much and encourages you to think instead. A movie which doesn't want you to think all that much can be good, but it doesn't have intellectual merit.

It doesn't have to be "challenging" to be good.

I never made that claim, I actually said precisely the opposite. Please reread my post.

In fact, it can be smart as hell and still not be a good movie.

But of course, the movie still has to be entertaining, but what one person finds entertaining does not translate for all. For the most part I did not consider this movie entertaining, but that is just personal taste on my part.

 

[God Magnus]

I wouldn't say so. When the film was announced all the way up to the release of the first few pictures, people were going bananas over stuff like continuity, fabric used on uniforms, nacelles and so on. There seemed to be little talk of "OMG I hope this does well!" until the trailers began to hit. Even then, it seems to me most fans were waiting with baited breath.

What seemed to create hype was the sudden flood of positive reviews from non fans. When you have newspapers like the New York Times liking a genre movie, fans take notice - and with the high rate of positive reviews from other similar venues, the hype machine went into overdrive. I think fans just rode that wave, but I wouldn't say they created it in the mass media.

 

[Scotty]

Is Star Trek 2009 overhyped by desesperate Trek fans?

In my opinion, one can't overhype this movie enough! One of the best movies of the year thusfar.

 

[theFirebottle]

The implication that "willing suspension of disbelief" equates to "turning off your brain" is a surprising attitude to see from fans of science fiction, especially space opera.

 

[bismarck_1892]

The implication that "willing suspension of disbelief" equates to "turning off your brain" is a surprising attitude to see from fans of science fiction, especially space opera.

I think that the problems is that it was infact a "space opera" In all honesty may not have been a very good one of those either.

 

[indranee]

what other "space opera" are you comparing it with?

 

[TheGodBen]

The implication that "willing suspension of disbelief" equates to "turning off your brain" is a surprising attitude to see from fans of science fiction, especially space opera.

Willing suspension of disbelief has nothing to do with turning off your brain. I'm willing to accept the nonsense of warp drive and the fact that nearly all aliens are humanoids because that is a fundamental conceit of the Star Trek universe. However, having a character do a really stupid thing for no reason other than to drive the plot along is not a conceit of the universe, that's just stupidity.

I have no problem with the impossible physical characteristics of red matter or the fact that you can get from Earth to Vulcan in 6 minutes, I have a problem with Pine assigning Kirk as first officer and Kirk leaving his pod in order to wander about in an frozen wasteland.

 

[Balrog]

Here's a newsflash folks, people aren't always going to agree with you...

I disagree!

But if you disagree, that means we must agree. But you disagree, which means we must agree. Illogical. Illogical. Norman, coordinate...

 

[theFirebottle]

Willing suspension of disbelief has nothing to do with turning off your brain. I'm willing to accept the nonsense of warp drive and the fact that nearly all aliens are humanoids because that is a fundamental conceit of the Star Trek universe. However, having a character do a really stupid thing for no reason other than to drive the plot along is not a conceit of the universe, that's just stupidity.

I have no problem with the impossible physical characteristics of red matter or the fact that you can get from Earth to Vulcan in 6 minutes, I have a problem with Pine assigning Kirk as first officer and Kirk leaving his pod in order to wander about in an frozen wasteland.

It's fine if you didn't believe these things even though they happened to be in-character and easily explainable from context. Kirk's never been one to sit tight and wait for rescue when ordered to. And presumably Pike's been keeping an eye on Kirk for his three Academy years and knows what the guy is capable of -- hell, he probably spent three years regretting that dare because of how much trouble Kirk is. Your suspension of disbelief is broken, you should probably get it looked at.

Every time I see someone write "turn off my/your brain" they seem to go on to harp on points of unrealism (you know, the stuff that demands suspension of disbelief) about the film like those above, which don't even really demand all that much suspension.