Is SNW getting too goofy?

[Midquest]

One thing I love about SNW's lightness and lunacy: it has the effect of opening up a world that really has been fairly narrowly defined since the 1990s. The original show had the benefit of no precedent, and so we got castles and haunted houses and United Earth ships and things that don't quite fit the now rather entrenched rules. But irreverence and playfulness tug at the status quo. And now we have a little more weirdness again, but with a beautiful throughline of consistent character growth.

The other thing I find so fascinating is how the show exposes our expectations about what Star Trek is. I've seen so, so many complaints that the characters in SNW use way too much modern language, when as noted above, that's just what TOS did. Same thing with complaints about the inconsistent stardates--yet that's also true with TOS.

 

[Mudd]

One thing I love about SNW's lightness and lunacy: it has the effect of opening up a world that really has been fairly narrowly defined since the 1990s. The original show had the benefit of no precedent, and so we got castles and haunted houses and United Earth ships and things that don't quite fit the now rather entrenched rules. But irreverence and playfulness tug at the status quo. And now we have a little more weirdness again, but with a beautiful throughline of consistent character growth.

The other thing I find so fascinating is how the show exposes our expectations about what Star Trek is. I've seen so, so many complaints that the characters in SNW use way too much modern language, when as noted above, that's just what TOS did. Same thing with complaints about the inconsistent stardates--yet that's also true with TOS.

Absolutely Right.™

Star Trek and Star Wars share obvious similarities but they also have conceptual differences. Trek should always be the "Yes, and..." franchise. Both SNW and LD reflect that and are viable ways forward for Star Trek.

 

[BK613]

There are some that think that Star Trek should be approached with a Shakespearean seriousness, all the while forgetting that Shakespeare also wrote comedies.

 

[fireproof78]

What fools these mortals be.

 

[Ssosmcin]

I don't think SNW is any more goofy than the back half of Season 2 of the original series. All those fan favorites like "A Piece of the Action" and "I, Mudd" and "The Trouble With Tribbles" would fit right in on this show. Hell, "Shore Leave" in the first season was pretty wacky and fans ate it up. If the entire series was like that, sure, I'd stop watching. But unless they have plans to turn SNW into a full on comedy/fantasy, more serious episodes will be back. Now, I will say, the three Trek comedies I mentioned fall at the very bottom of my re-watch list, but Star Trek, when done well, can balance a variety of tones and have something for everyone.

The only time Star Trek really sucks is when it's boring.

 

[Mudd]

TOS comedies were fun for the sake of the novelty of them. I don't think any of them hold up over time as really very funny.

"A Piece of The Action" was, I think, the only episode of TOS that my dad watched all the way through and enjoyed.

Mom came through the living room while he was sitting there with me and she said, "You don't like this show. What's so funny?"

He replied, "You have to know the characters."

 

[Sci]

Classical music is timeless in that, like Shakespeare, we’re still studying it and appreciating it hundreds of years of years after it was written.

Sure, but that doesn't mean it's not rooted in a particular time and place. And it also doesn't mean its impact will be eternal, even if it lasts for centuries. There are a lot more people doing Shakespeare productions than doing productions of the Wakefield Mystery Plays or Seneca's Thyestes. The cultural impact of every work of art fades as the audience's temporal proximity to its point of origin decreases, and every work will eventually be forgotten.

As for jazz, it’s a flexible and diverse musical form that lends itself to endless improvisation and requires only a small ensemble; it’s quite plausible it would be popular on a starship with a diverse crew from many cultures. I can easily envision a completely alien jazz band using instruments from their home world. It fits.

It's not implausible -- but it's not implausible it would become a fairly obscure genre by the 23rd or 24th Centuries, either. How many U.S. Navy officers stationed aboard aircraft carriers perform Trecento Madrigals in their off hours?

None of that is to say that they shouldn't have had Riker be into 20th Century jazz or shouldn't have Picard love 19th Century Romantic music -- just that I think Star Trek over-relies upon the conceit that its real-life contemporary audience's attitudes towards older art forms will still carry over three or four centuries into the future. I really liked the bit in Star Trek Beyond where Scotty refers to the Beastie Boys as classical music -- it acknowledged that the reputation of real-life art will change over time.

There are some that think that Star Trek should be approached with a Shakespearean seriousness, all the while forgetting that Shakespeare also wrote comedies.

Mic drop.

 

[Unique]

Sure, but that doesn't mean it's not rooted in a particular time and place. And it also doesn't mean its impact will be eternal, even if it lasts for centuries. There are a lot more people doing Shakespeare productions than doing productions of the Wakefield Mystery Plays or Seneca's Thyestes. The cultural impact of every work of art fades as the audience's temporal proximity to its point of origin decreases, and every work will eventually be forgotten.



It's not implausible -- but it's not implausible it would become a fairly obscure genre by the 23rd or 24th Centuries, either. How many U.S. Navy officers stationed aboard aircraft carriers perform Trecento Madrigals in their off hours?

None of that is to say that they shouldn't have had Riker be into 20th Century jazz or shouldn't have Picard love 19th Century Romantic music -- just that I think Star Trek over-relies upon the conceit that its real-life contemporary audience's attitudes towards older art forms will still carry over three or four centuries into the future. I really liked the bit in Star Trek Beyond where Scotty refers to the Beastie Boys as classical music -- it acknowledged that the reputation of real-life art will change over time.



Mic drop.

No one said any of these musical forms aren’t rooted in a time or place. That would be nonsensical, because everything is rooted in a time and place.
I tire of this quibbling; have a lovely day.

 

[NCC-73515]

The musical will happen because

Spoiler

they're trying to speed up subspace comms and try to send music, which apparently causes the wave from the trailer that turns everyone into dancers and singers

 

[Enterprise is Great]

Well, episode 8 shows it’s not getting goofy too much

 

[Eddie Roth]

In my even more informed opinion,* your statements, sir, are entirely mistaken in every regard.

*Come on, I mean, who can really say? This kind of self-credentialing is a pompous and empty exercise, isn't it?

Yeah, okay, because we just can't let someone's dissenting opinion stand, right? Which is kind of to my earlier point (which by the way is what I labeled, perhaps mislabeled, "informed opinion" - let's call it balanced opinion then): people online, Twitter worst of all, but certainly also here, tend to draw some kind of enjoyment from enforcing what they see as a consensus opinion. And it's repeated and repeated and repeated until the framing is such that those who feel differently are put in a position where THEY need to defend their view. It would be so much more conducive to an actual exchange between fans if everyone's case could first of all be heard and not immediately be mocked or belittled, which is what you specifically @Serveaux did to the OP with the following words:

"Nope. SNW is note-perfect.

It's reaching the point where people who think that Star Trek is Serious Business will want to find a different fandom, which is probably in all our best interests."

Why the raw nerve?

 

[Rainard Fox]

Well, episode 8 shows it’s not getting goofy too much

Came to say the same.

 

[fireproof78]

Perhaps the production team knew this would have a heavy episode and placed the goofy ones deliberately.

 

[Campe]

Is SNW getting too goofy?

Before Episode 8, no.
After Episode 8, aw, hell no.

 

[tomalak301]

After episode 8, I think this thread has been answered.

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

Spoiler: Melissa Navia's natural hair colour & style is better than the goofy military cut that Erika Ortegas is wearing

Why can't they just let Erika Ortegas wear Melissa Navia's natural hair style?

It's so much better than the goofy military like crew cut on the sides with the wide mohawk.

Imagine seeing Erika Ortegas with that beautiful smiling face & blonde short hair in every episode.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Spoiler: Melissa Navia's natural hair colour & style is better than the goofy military cut that Erika Ortegas is wearing

Why can't they just let Erika Ortegas wear Melissa Navia's natural hair style?

It's so much better than the goofy military like crew cut on the sides with the wide mohawk.

Imagine seeing Erika Ortegas with that beautiful smiling face & blonde short hair in every episode.

Uh,no. It suits the character.

 

[Kamen Rider Blade]

Uh,no. It suits the character.

=(

 

[Ssosmcin]

Uh,no. It suits the character.

How so? What difference would it really make? It's hair. Hair that was different last season.

 

[fireproof78]

Imagine seeing Erika Ortegas with that beautiful smiling face & blonde short hair in every episode.

Has no bearing one way or the other in terms of character. The haircut suits the character well enough so I will take it.