Is Generations REALLY That Bad???
- Thread starter AdmiralScreed
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It's given a lot of shit because of the way Kirk is killed off. Many other explanations are given, like plot holes and such, but really it comes down to the ending. The plot holes aren't particularly more glaring in GEN than in a lot of other ones.
I agree. A lot would be excused, if Kirk's sacrifice was executed better. I always assumed he would make it up to the D (just so we could finally see him there) and make the sacrifice on the D that he did on the B (or instead of doing it on the B).
We get Spock's funeral in 2, but nothing much for Kirk. Would he want to be buried under a pile of rocks on some lame planet in the middle of nowhere? I always imagined Spock coming and taking him back in time, and having him buried in 1930's New York next to Edith Keeler. The movie ends with Nimoy, dressed in period attire standing over their graves in the rain 'I have been and always will be, your friend'.
That would have been a much bigger ending to the film, for sure. Having Spock do that for his friend would have touched many out there. If only the writers had come up with something closer to that than what they wanted for the original cast instead.
A childless career man loses his only brother and nephew in a terrible fire - and he's not permitted to show a little emotion... to his counsellor?
Kirk died fighting for a people that would never know his name because it was right. It's very difficult for me to think of a better way for him to die. Being buried on Veridian III was a nice, quiet way to end out his time, I thought.
Frankly, I dunno why people whine about it so much. GEN does have some issues, but I don't think any of Kirk's scenes are a part of them.
And just what movie were you watching?...Soran was an over the edge villain that after so many years of attempting to get back into the Nexus, and failed every one, that he was just about to succeed in this attempt.
Picard was kept out by a forcefield, and no matter what he tried up till trying go to underneath it, NO "diplomatic" approach was going to work!!!!!
Give me an effin' break about he didn't even try!
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I remember loving it at the time (probably because of the excitement of finally seeing TNG on the big screen), but I find it almost painful to sit through now.
Whether it's Picard crying, Data acting like an idiot, the random uniform changes, Kirk making scrambled eggs for Picard, the pointless destruction of the Ent-D at the hands of the bumbling Duras sisters, the sappy Christmas scene, or Kirk getting killed by a falling bridge, it's just one cringeworthy and embarassing moment after another.
Frankly a whole movie devoted to the opening sequence with the Ent-B would have been FAR more compelling.
Whether it's Picard crying, Data acting like an idiot, the random uniform changes, Kirk making scrambled eggs for Picard, the pointless destruction of the Ent-D at the hands of the bumbling Duras sisters, the sappy Christmas scene, or Kirk getting killed by a falling bridge, it's just one cringeworthy and embarassing moment after another.
Frankly a whole movie devoted to the opening sequence with the Ent-B would have been FAR more compelling.
A whole movie devoted to Captain Sulu and the USS Excelsior would have been better, at least for me. 
I disagree completely. The death of Kirk is probably the only redeeming thing about the film. His hand-wringing over whether he wanted a family or not is the worst of Kirk. Stewart is very blunt in his choices to mourn his brother's death. The movie is suprisingly dark cinematically when it doesn't need to be. The light moments are overplayed from "Tuesday" to "Mr. Tricorder."
Giving Data emotions is a big deal in the history of the show. That is the only thing between him and a true exploration of humanity. How they did this--pushing Crusher into water?!--is ridiculous. I would've rather that he did it for an acting performance or because he wanted to deepen his relationship with Geordi. Anything else besides "Oh, Data, you screwed up again!"
What is the point of Worf's promotion? Picard's reaction to Rene and Robert's death. They treat it like an episode, a bad one. We see his reaction to the news, a bad move. Then we see Deanna's reaction. Then we see Deanna's approach of him and his curt attitude. Why do we need to see it again on the bridge? And for good measure, we see him do it again when Riker briefs him on what was found on the station. Show him doing something else. The movie is blunt and treats me like I'm stupid.
"That's the mission where James Kirk was killed." I just saw it, I don't need to be told again. I don't need to see the little girl lose her teddy bear as the Enterprise is evacuated. This is cheap, pull-at-the-heartstrings Trek.
Show him off his game, not disinterested in being Captain. This doesn't explore the downside of a career in Starfleet as much as it explores how much these people hate their lives.
This isn't a good movie at exploring death or the dark side of Space. Whenever they wanted to go dark, they say "Borg." DS9's start, Picard's Hugh moments, even Captain Maxwell talking to Riker. The Borg incident is talked about a lot in this time period, and it's always about death and destruction.
I would rather see who Soran is rather than have him confide in Picard like's he's a 1960s Batman villian.
Plain and simple: a bad movie with Trek's name stamped on it.
This is my favorite STAR TREK movie. I saw it the theatre in golden ring mall. This movie was so fun because i had only seen a few TOS movies, TFF and TWOK, and TFFS, so this one was top the pops for me. And it still is. There is something special about those charcters on TNG on that ship, with those uniforms that was nice and familar. The way they act there was the same as they acted in the series, in all the other movies they act strange, in strange uniforms, in strange surroundings.
But all the being said GENERATIONS has the most hype and its the best TNG movie! Horray it was fun
But all the being said GENERATIONS has the most hype and its the best TNG movie! Horray it was fun
No, it's not that bad. There are certainly some moments that really stand out, but Generations has this weird vibe running through it. It really feels like a film where Paramount wasn't completely sold on TNG really being able to sell tickets so they tacked on members of TOS, and it really doesn't quite work. Also I really wasn't a big fan of Soran as it felt like the producers were trying to find themselves a Khan clone.
But there are some spectacular moments in the film when the TNG cast gets to shine. I loved the Picard/Guinan Christmas scene... definitely had a Trek vibe to it. The crash of the Enterprise was amazing. Plus there are little moments throughout the film that really work.
Certainly not my favorite... but certainly not the worst (hello Insurrection!)
Yancy
But there are some spectacular moments in the film when the TNG cast gets to shine. I loved the Picard/Guinan Christmas scene... definitely had a Trek vibe to it. The crash of the Enterprise was amazing. Plus there are little moments throughout the film that really work.
Certainly not my favorite... but certainly not the worst (hello Insurrection!)
Yancy
He just made up with his brother a few years back and was actually close to them is how I took it.
So you have never cried when your brother or sister died? Let alone along with your nephew or niece? NOT wishing bad ill on you but unless you have, you just don't get the point of the whole scene.
He just had the emotion chip short circuit in what goes for his brain!! And according to Descent Pt. II, it was damaged anyway...
Actually I thought THAT was one of the better parts of the movie!
He wasn't making them for Picard...He was actually just getting into the Nexus himself and realizing the things he thought could become reality.
I had no problem with either of these.
I'm not saying there wasn't some justification for some of those things, but to see these characters introduced the way they were-- clowning around and being cheesy and over-emotional at every turn, or being out-witted by the Duras sisters-- was just frankly kind of embarassing.
It was the furthest thing from the dignified, professional image of TNG I was used to seeing, or that I would have HOPED to have seen in their first movie. Thankfully First Contact was able to restore a great deal of that in the next movie, and had these characters finally acting like adults again.
It was the furthest thing from the dignified, professional image of TNG I was used to seeing, or that I would have HOPED to have seen in their first movie. Thankfully First Contact was able to restore a great deal of that in the next movie, and had these characters finally acting like adults again.
I don't think the TNG crew letting the Duras sisters get the upper hand initially is any different than Khan doing so with the Reliant in TWOK.
And Data's experiences with the emotion chip and Picard's grief both tie in with the movie's overall themes, they're not just there to be there.
I liked Kirk's death scene fine.
They didn't just "get the upper hand," they were able to destroy the Enterprise-D. Something even the Borg weren't able to do.
And worse yet, they did it by essentially planting a hidden camera on Geordi-- a camera that no one on the Enterprise thought to check for, even though he had just been captured by the Klingons.
It's just... ugh. One more incredibly cheesy and ridiculous moment in a movie chalk full of them. You might as well have a couple kids sneak onto the ship in a Geordi suit and get the codes that way.
They didn't just "get the upper hand," they were able to destroy the Enterprise-D. Something even the Borg weren't able to do.
And worse yet, they did it by essentially planting a hidden camera on Geordi-- a camera that no one on the Enterprise thought to check for, even though he had just been captured by the Klingons.
It's just... ugh. One more incredibly cheesy and ridiculous moment in a movie chalk full of them. You might as well have a couple kids sneak onto the ship in a Geordi suit and get the codes that way.
I can see your point, but I just rationalize it as the device was very hard to detect-Soran was a genius, maybe it was something he came up with.
But moreoveror, this is exactly the nitpicky kind of stuff people come up with about "Generations"-these holes are not significantly different than plot-induced stupidity in many of the other movies-why didn't the Klingons notice or scan for Kirk's transporter patch when he was taken prisoner in TUC?
It's just that these things suddenly become deal-breakers when it comes to this movie.
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