I'm sorry, perhaps you never saw a bad actor in your life. Finn Jones is a more than adequate actor.
Iron Fist (Marvel/Netflix)
- Thread starter Skywalker
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If you're seeing alarm and indignation in my posts you're trying too hard to find it. And lets face it your whole persona here is built upon outrage at the slightest thing in a TV or film production you find lacking and a combination of doubling down and taking it to 11, with a hint of "I know better than professionals".
"Adequate" is right around where I would rank him.
I think he had flashes of potential that showed he's a really good actor. I would blame the material he had to work with that made him seem flat and underwhelming.
While I don't feel as strongly as @Gaith (and having actually seen the show), I have to agree with the general criticism of the martial arts shown on the show. And acting skills trump martial arts skills doesn't work, when the acting is merely "adequate". Especially when the character is supposed to be among the greatest martial artists in the MCU, if not the greatest.
I enjoyed the show enough to watch it completely in two days, but it is, on every level, mediocre at best.
I enjoyed the show enough to watch it completely in two days, but it is, on every level, mediocre at best.
I can completely understand the problem with the martial arts and the fight scenes. Kai is correct--Danny is a super-hero and should have moves that are far beyond the "average" thug he fights. In fact, I thought he was probably holding back in the early episodes, but we didn't get much more when he was fighting the challenges in episode 6.
That said, I am surprised this is now an issue when it was not a contentious issue with Daredevil. I was surprised watching that show for the first time and seeing DD as not having skills far above the average guy on the street. Both Danny and Matt should be fighters on Batman's level and be able to take down ordinary untrained fighters in large number, quickly and efficiently. When they're challenged it should be because circumstances and/or their opponents warrant it.
I still enjoyed both series though--the toned down fights just seem to be a characteristic of the tone the Netflix shows want to establish for Marvel's street level heroes.
That said, I am surprised this is now an issue when it was not a contentious issue with Daredevil. I was surprised watching that show for the first time and seeing DD as not having skills far above the average guy on the street. Both Danny and Matt should be fighters on Batman's level and be able to take down ordinary untrained fighters in large number, quickly and efficiently. When they're challenged it should be because circumstances and/or their opponents warrant it.
I still enjoyed both series though--the toned down fights just seem to be a characteristic of the tone the Netflix shows want to establish for Marvel's street level heroes.
I disagree that Daredevil should be on the same level as Batman or Iron Fist when it comes to fighting skills, at least in the offensive part. He's got above average martial arts skills, but nowhere near Batman, and Iron Fist, whose whole schtick is martial arts, should be even better than Batman in this regard. Where Daredevil shines is being able to take the beating and continuing on, and that's been shown in the Netflix show.
But even in comparison to DD, Iron Fist is lacking when it comes to the fight scenes. Remember, DD had in both seasons prominent fight scenes where DD took on a large number of adversaries, and they showed the scenes without visible cuts (the infamous hallway fight, and the stairwell fight, respectively). And because their were no visible cuts, DD's fighting skills really came across to the viewer. The heavy editing in the fight scenes of Iron Fist actually made it less clear what was happening.
Besides, the thing to remember is, what is the character's thing, what makes him stand out, what even people who don't read their comics know about the characters. DD's thing is not his martial arts skills, but that he's blind and his other senses are superpowered. Everything else is negotiable, but this has to be in it or it's not really Daredevil.
And Iron Fist's thing is martial arts. I've never read an Iron Fist comic, I actually don't know much about his backstory in the comics, and therefore I can tell you, his whole thing that people like me know about the character is he's the Kung Fu Fighter of all Kung Fu Fighters. Even this superfist power he has, I didn't know about that until I saw the show. It really is all about the Kung Fu, or it all falls apart.
But even in comparison to DD, Iron Fist is lacking when it comes to the fight scenes. Remember, DD had in both seasons prominent fight scenes where DD took on a large number of adversaries, and they showed the scenes without visible cuts (the infamous hallway fight, and the stairwell fight, respectively). And because their were no visible cuts, DD's fighting skills really came across to the viewer. The heavy editing in the fight scenes of Iron Fist actually made it less clear what was happening.
Besides, the thing to remember is, what is the character's thing, what makes him stand out, what even people who don't read their comics know about the characters. DD's thing is not his martial arts skills, but that he's blind and his other senses are superpowered. Everything else is negotiable, but this has to be in it or it's not really Daredevil.
And Iron Fist's thing is martial arts. I've never read an Iron Fist comic, I actually don't know much about his backstory in the comics, and therefore I can tell you, his whole thing that people like me know about the character is he's the Kung Fu Fighter of all Kung Fu Fighters. Even this superfist power he has, I didn't know about that until I saw the show. It really is all about the Kung Fu, or it all falls apart.
This was around the point for me where Ward went from "another-generic-businessman-guy" to "this-character's-scenes-are-more-interesting-than-Iron-Fist's".
Wound up falling off the wagon of doing a review for each episode, but finished today.
Yeah, the lead role could have used a little more gravitas...the writing was telling us how special he was, but he just wasn't selling it. OTOH, whether it was on purpose or not, in the later episodes I found an interesting mirror dynamic going on between him and Bakuto...they were sort of similar types with the whole neo-hippie vibe, but in Bakuto's case it was a facade.
I also thought there was an interesting parallel going on with all of the characters having to face that whatever they'd been led to blindly trust wasn't what it seemed to them...Danny with K'un-Lun (they didn't make this too explicit, but it was the vibe I was getting), Colleen with the Hand, Joy with Harold and Ward. I don't get the complaints that it weakened Colleen that she fell for the Hand...she hadn't just been recruited, she'd been a longtime member of a cult...she'd helped to indoctrinate others into that cult, and when she fell out of it, we saw how thoroughly indoctrinated they were in it. It was something that she was able to eventually see through it at all.
On that note, I felt some developments in the last episode could have used an extra episode or so to breathe...mainly Harold returning to the world and Danny being wanted by the DEA. And Colleen gave a little speech about how grateful she was that Davos had "killed" Bakuto because it would have been such a weight on her, as if she'd had some time to come to grips with that, rather than it being something that had just happened in the last episode.
I did like how Ward came around. Joy just seems like she's being manipulated...she's still relatively naive in the world that she's now dealing with...she didn't have 13 years of dealing with it at Harold's side like Ward did.
Gao...I feel like she's become a little too much the teflon-coated big bad. There's a point, at least for me, where it all gets a little too OTT and a character like that becomes ho-hum because you know that they're always magically a few moves ahead and nothing will ever get the better of them.
Yeah, the lead role could have used a little more gravitas...the writing was telling us how special he was, but he just wasn't selling it. OTOH, whether it was on purpose or not, in the later episodes I found an interesting mirror dynamic going on between him and Bakuto...they were sort of similar types with the whole neo-hippie vibe, but in Bakuto's case it was a facade.
I also thought there was an interesting parallel going on with all of the characters having to face that whatever they'd been led to blindly trust wasn't what it seemed to them...Danny with K'un-Lun (they didn't make this too explicit, but it was the vibe I was getting), Colleen with the Hand, Joy with Harold and Ward. I don't get the complaints that it weakened Colleen that she fell for the Hand...she hadn't just been recruited, she'd been a longtime member of a cult...she'd helped to indoctrinate others into that cult, and when she fell out of it, we saw how thoroughly indoctrinated they were in it. It was something that she was able to eventually see through it at all.
On that note, I felt some developments in the last episode could have used an extra episode or so to breathe...mainly Harold returning to the world and Danny being wanted by the DEA. And Colleen gave a little speech about how grateful she was that Davos had "killed" Bakuto because it would have been such a weight on her, as if she'd had some time to come to grips with that, rather than it being something that had just happened in the last episode.
I did like how Ward came around. Joy just seems like she's being manipulated...she's still relatively naive in the world that she's now dealing with...she didn't have 13 years of dealing with it at Harold's side like Ward did.
Gao...I feel like she's become a little too much the teflon-coated big bad. There's a point, at least for me, where it all gets a little too OTT and a character like that becomes ho-hum because you know that they're always magically a few moves ahead and nothing will ever get the better of them.
Not going to read the thread because I'm not done yet and don't wanna be spoiled, but I'm up to episode 10. Just wanna say that Danny is the LEAST interesting character on the show. He's way too whiny to be a hero. But the rest of the characters are damn good! I'm watching it mainly for them, and I get kind of disappointed when Danny shows up.
Iron Fist has been renewed for season two! I don't care what any of y'all think, this makes me happy! 
http://variety.com/2017/tv/news/iron-fist-renewed-season-2-netflix-1202503174/
http://variety.com/2017/tv/news/iron-fist-renewed-season-2-netflix-1202503174/
I'm more excited by the news that Misty Knight will be in season 2.
Daughter of the Dragon! And Misty is more accurately Danny's love interest than Colleen any way.
Well...hopefully the show will have better writing in season 2.
Scott Buck will NOT be returning as showrunner. Course correction? The person who wrote the Elektra script? At least Sleepy Hollow is a more impressive credit.
http://comicbook.com/marvel/2017/07/22/iron-fist-new-showrunner/
http://comicbook.com/marvel/2017/07/22/iron-fist-new-showrunner/
Now the renewal makes sense. Maybe they'll get better writers and actually try with the fight scenes. To bad they won't just pull an Ed Norton and replace Danny with another actor and just never mention the change.
Best news yet. Now I'm actually interested in seeing the second season.
Movie scripts and the finished films based on them can be completely different entities, so for all we know, the script to Elektra was far better than the finished film. Even if it wasn't, writers can learn from experience; it's been a dozen years since then, plenty of time to grow.
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