If you die, does your Nexus "echo" die too?

[Mr. Laser Beam]

As I understand it, the only reason Guinan left an echo behind is because she was "pulled...ripped away" by the Enterprise's transporter beam. So it's not like everybody who enters the Nexus leaves an echo, only Guinan and others like her.

So Picard and Kirk did not leave echos, because they left the Nexus voluntarily.

 

[Discofan]

... like Jodie Foster seeing a representation of her father in the movie "Contact" but was in actuality an ALF.

Really?

https://giphy.com/gifs/yEtv1wWZpmG2s

 

[Discofan]

As I understand it, the only reason Guinan left an echo behind is because she was "pulled...ripped away" by the Enterprise's transporter beam. So it's not like everybody who enters the Nexus leaves an echo, only Guinan and others like her.

So Picard and Kirk did not leave echos, because they left the Nexus voluntarily.

Plus Guinan has an odd relationship with time and reality (Kinda like Stamets) In "Yesterday's Enterprise" she was the only one to know that there was something different vis a vis the "normal" timeline. Maybe she has tardigrade DNA or something...

 

[Christopher]

Plus Guinan has an odd relationship with time and reality (Kinda like Stamets) In "Yesterday's Enterprise" she was the only one to know that there was something different vis a vis the "normal" timeline. Maybe she has tardigrade DNA or something...

The idea was that Guinan's special sense of time was because she'd left a part of herself in the Nexus. Since it was outside of time, it served as sort of an anchor that remained unchanged when the timeline was rewritten around her, and that's what let her sense the anomaly. But the lines explaining that didn't make the final cut.

 

[Discofan]

The idea was that Guinan's special sense of time was because she'd left a part of herself in the Nexus. Since it was outside of time, it served as sort of an anchor that remained unchanged when the timeline was rewritten around her, and that's what let her sense the anomaly. But the lines explaining that didn't make the final cut.

I seriously doubt that. "Yesterday's Enterprise" was aired a few years before "Generations" was produced. If Scotty didn't know that Kirk was dead then it's unlikely that Guinan's "powers" had anything to do with the Nexus given that it was a lot earlier.

 

[Christopher]

I seriously doubt that. "Yesterday's Enterprise" was aired a few years before "Generations" was produced.

Perhaps I should've been clearer: I was saying that Generations used the Nexus as a retroactive explanation for Guinan's arbitrarily convenient time sense in "Yesterday's Enterprise." Per Memory Alpha:

In an early version of the Star Trek: Generations script, Guinan explains that her experience with the Nexus and the Enterprise-B are responsible for her "sixth sense" that lets her perceive people and events outside of linear time.

 

[Discofan]

Perhaps I should've been clearer: I was saying that Generations used the Nexus as a retroactive explanation for Guinan's arbitrarily convenient time sense in "Yesterday's Enterprise." Per Memory Alpha:

I see. Thanks for the clarification.

 

[ED-209]

I prefer to think that the ‘echo’ was just nonsense made up by the Nexus to keep Picard there. You heard me. Picard is still in the Nexus.

That would explain the personality transplant he had after Generations.

 

[Dukhat]

That would explain the personality transplant he had after Generations.

You mean from "Picard, gentleman explorer" to "Picard, reckless jeep-driving action hero," yes, I would agree.

 

[ED-209]

He was the same in FC and Insurrection to be fair, though not as bad in FC.

 

[Discofan]

I hear the Picard show will take place inside the Nexus...

(j/k)

 

[Kor]

As I understand it, the only reason Guinan left an echo behind is because she was "pulled...ripped away" by the Enterprise's transporter beam. So it's not like everybody who enters the Nexus leaves an echo, only Guinan and others like her.

So Picard and Kirk did not leave echos, because they left the Nexus voluntarily.

That was my impression as well.

I see. Thanks for the clarification.

I believe the novel "Engines of Destiny" gives more exposition on this concept as well.

Kor

 

[Discofan]

Seriously, the Nexus (concept) belongs in fairytales, not in sci. fi. I mean if you believe in something like that then why not believing in whishing wel!s, magic spells, or whatnot?

 

[Christopher]

Seriously, the Nexus (concept) belongs in fairytales, not in sci. fi. I mean if you believe in something like that then why not believing in whishing wel!s, magic spells, or whatnot?

Not entirely. Physics tells us that time is relative, that there's no absolute standard for how fast time flows. Observers in different parts of the universe would disagree on how much time elapsed between two events; who's to say that the flow of time in a different universe would be anything like ours?

 

[Discofan]

Not entirely. Physics tells us that time is relative, that there's no absolute standard for how fast time flows. Observers in different parts of the universe would disagree on how much time elapsed between two events; who's to say that the flow of time in a different universe would be anything like ours?

That's the least of the Nexus' problems. Seriously, a place where all your wishes are granted, where you can live forever!! Who would believe in that? Some things in ST stretch things quite a lot but this really takes the cake.

 

[Christopher]

That's the least of the Nexus' problems. Seriously, a place where all your wishes are granted, where you can live forever!! Who would believe in that? Some things in ST stretch things quite a lot but this really takes the cake.

The idea of the Nexus is that it immerses you in your own thoughts, and you can relive any cherished memory or experience a fantasy. It's basically an ongoing euphoric hallucination. I imagine you could induce a similar effect with sensory deprivation and stimulation of the brain's pleasure center. So I don't see what's so implausible about it. The light and gravity from supernovae propagating instantaneously is more implausible to me.

Really, the Nexus recycles a lot of the same ideas as the Bajoran wormhole -- a timeless realm that you experience through images drawn from your own memories. The main difference is that it doesn't seem to have indigenous inhabitants trying to communicate.

 

[Discofan]

The idea of the Nexus is that it immerses you in your own thoughts, and you can relive any cherished memory or experience a fantasy. It's basically an ongoing euphoric hallucination. I imagine you could induce a similar effect with sensory deprivation and stimulation of the brain's pleasure center. So I don't see what's so implausible about it. The light and gravity from supernovae propagating instantaneously is more implausible to me.

Really, the Nexus recycles a lot of the same ideas as the Bajoran wormhole -- a timeless realm that you experience through images drawn from your own memories. The main difference is that it doesn't seem to have indigenous inhabitants trying to communicate.

A sensory deprivation tank doesn't make you immortal, nor does it allow you to interact with other (real) people in your "hallucination".

 

[Christopher]

A sensory deprivation tank doesn't make you immortal

It's timeless. As in, time does not pass. All times are the same time. So "immortal" isn't a concept that even applies.

nor does it allow you to interact with other (real) people in your "hallucination".

There are only about a thousand other things in Star Trek that allow people to communicate mind to mind. Why is this one the dealbreaker for you?

The point is not that the Nexus could really exist; obviously we're talking about a fictional universe. The point is that everything about the Nexus has some pretty obvious analogies in other Trek concepts, especially the Bajoran wormhole. Realms where time doesn't pass, environments that are experienced through hallucination or mental imagery, phenomena that connect minds, it's all pretty familiar Trek stuff. So I don't get why you have more of a problem with the Nexus than with all the other similar ideas. If anything, the main problem is that it's too much of a rehash of stuff they'd done before.

 

[Discofan]

It's timeless. As in, time does not pass. All times are the same time. So "immortal" isn't a concept that even applies.

If time really didn't pass then Picard would be a statue. "Things happen" means that time passes. "Immortal" means that you don't die, ever. The people in the Nexus live forever. That's what is said by everyone, including the very clever Soran (sp?).

There are only about a thousand other things in Star Trek that allow people to communicate mind to mind. Why is this one the dealbreaker for you?

I am just saying that the Nexus is not a sci. fi. concept. It's a fairytale concept.

 

[The Wormhole]

Scotty (in Relics) seem to think that Kirk was in a position to come and save him.

This was covered on Family Guy. It's because the signal degradation messed with Scotty's memories.

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