To be fair, I'm pretty sure this particular Janeway was from a time before Voyager even left spacedock, so maybe the number changed.
How many people on Voyager?
- Thread starter Tracy Trek
- Start date
To be fair, I'm pretty sure this particular Janeway was from a time before Voyager even left spacedock, so maybe the number changed.
Why would she quote as part of the original complement those personnel from Utopia Planitia at all? They were onboard solely to help complete ship preparations at that point for a very time limited basis and I don't see where their number would even necessarily be known by Janeway let alone be officially considered as part of the crew. Also, the first time we see Janeway in her time segment, the ship is in pursuit of the Val Jean, presumably shortly before the encounter with the displacement wave.
I was thinking more that she was quoting the original number before she lost all sorts of crewmembers when the Caretaker grabbed them. In just her first day, she lost a lot of people.
I tried to post a link to a website called Voyager Lower Decks (for minor crew members), but it didn't work. I mentioned it in a previous post. It doesn't take you directly to the website, but rather it takes you to a page with a list of suggestions.
www.looney-archivist/lowerdecks/
www.looney-archivist/lowerdecks/
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hi all,
best explanation ever:
http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/inconsistencies/voyager-crew.htm
This section was fresh updated and is very accurat, just scroll down.
Every crew count from Voyager gets explained
best explanation ever:
http://www.ex-astris-scientia.org/inconsistencies/voyager-crew.htm
This section was fresh updated and is very accurat, just scroll down.
Every crew count from Voyager gets explained
Interesting site.
I will use it when I upgrade the Crew List on the Kes Website where also the characters from the books are included.
I will take care of that in June.
This list under the link contains the following, provided with pictures and more detailness. Ex-astris-scientia is really a great Star Trek site:
Season 1
There are lot of hints, that you have to take care, to reach the final count of the crew:
Season 1
- Caretaker: The crew starts with 141 people, 13 crewmembers dead + 36 added = 164 crew ("more than a dozen died" (Nightingale) / "One quarter of the crew is maquis"(Repression) / Maquis= 32, Tuvok+Paris+Kes+Neelix=4)
- State of Flux: Seska leaves / later dead = 163 crew
- Faces: Durst dead = 162
- The 37s: Janeway claims there are 152 men and women on the ship. this is simply wrong, she mixed it with 162
- Alliances: 3 crewman (Bendera + 2) die of Kazon = 159 crew
- Meld: Darwin dead = 158 crew
- Investigation: Michael Jonas dead = 157
- Deadlock: Add Naomi = 158 crew
- Innocence: Bennet dead = 157 crew
- Basics part 1: 2 unidentified crew dead, as Kazon enter Bridge + guard in front of exploding door = 155 crew
- Basics Part 2: Hogan + Suder + 1 unidentified dead = 152 crew
- The Swarm: 1 unidentified crewman dies = 151 crew
- Warlord: Kes kills Crewman Martin = 150 crew left
- Unity: Mary Kaplan dead = makes 149 crew
- Distant Origin: the Voth scan Voyager, detect 148 lifeforms out from 149 crew (Doctor is a hologram, they cannot detect him)
- Displaced: The same number here, 148 lifeforms in habitat (without Doctor)
- Latent image (from season 5): Ahni Jetal dies at Stardate 50979 (means end of Season 3) = 148 crew
- Skorpion + The Gift: Seven of Nine added / Kes leaves, but still alive = still 148 crew
- Scientific Method: 1 crewman dies = 147 crew
- Ashes to Ashes (from season 6): Lyndsay Ballard get killed from the Hirogen at Stardate 51563 = 146 crew
- Killing Game: 1 dead = 145 crew
- Living Witness: Regarding the Doctor, 3 crewman get killed. Besides this episode plays many centuries in the future and the Doctor is just a backup-module, I can not count the three dead. In my counting they got revived by the real Doctor, so no difference at all = still 145 crew
- One: 1 crewman dies = 144 crew
- Timeless: Here Chakotay or Harry mention a complete crew of 150 people, they just rounded it up
- Gravity: Logically Tuvok mentions a crew of 152, this is simply wrong and a mistake. Poor authors of this episode
- Dark Frontier: The Borg scan 143 lifeforms on Voyager, they cannot detect the Doctor = still correct 144 crew
- Someone to Watch Over Me: Neelix tells the ambassador the crew are 146 people, he uses a 1 year old crew manifest from Season 4.
- Equinox: Jurot + 2 crewman are dead = 141 crew / Betazoid Jurot is one of the casualties, because she won't be available anymore in "Dragon's Teeth" / 5 crewman of the ship Equinox are added = 146 crew
- Between Equinox II / Imperfection: As mentioned in "Imperfection", Crewman Lang dies somehow between Equinox II and Imperfection, not seen in an official episode. He did not die with one of the 3 dead in Equinox, because he is still seen after the three others are already dead / New crew = 145 people
- Collective: Add the 4 Borg-Children = 149 crew
- Imperfection: Azan, Mezoti and Rebi leaves again the Voyager, Icheb stays = 146 crew
- Author Author: Neelix has 146 numbers for calling Earth in his hands
- Friendship One: Joe Carey dies = 145 crew
- Homestead: Neelix leaves / not dead: 144 crew
- Endgame: Miral Paris is born = 145 crew
There are lot of hints, that you have to take care, to reach the final count of the crew:
- More than a dozen died as Voyager got pulled in Delta Quadrant (“Nightingale”). So at least 13 people died.
- One quarter of the crew is Maquis (“Repression”). So from 140-150 people there should be at least 32 Maquis. From origin 141 crew 13 crewman did die in “Caretaker”. That makes 128 starfleet at the end of “Caretaker”, and a quarter of this is 32 Maquis. Count former Maquis Tom Paris and Spy Tuvok to it, then you even have 34. So this calculation also fits.
- From the beginning till end you have to fit the crew count the different people mention. Janeway in “The 37s” with a crewcount of 152, what doesn’t fit, because she mix it with 162 / “Distant Origin” + “Displaced” with 148 crew (149 crew with Doctor) / 143 crew scanned from the Borg (144 with Doctor) / the 146 crew count Neelix mentions in “Author Author”
When I did my Crew List on the Kes Website, I found 218 names on the list.
If we omit the Maquis members (31 total including 11 characters mentioned in books) and characters who came on board after Voyager's arrival to the Delta Quadrant, such as Kes, Neelix, Naomi Wildman and later additions such as Seven Of Nine, The Equinox crew and such, we'll discover that Voyager, when it arrived in the Delta Quadrant, had 184 Starfleet crew members, not 141 which is the official number. These numbers include Tom Paris and Tuvok but not The Doctor since he wasn't regarded as a Starfleet crewman when the ship arrived in the Delta Quadrant.
However, if we omit the characters mentioned in the Voyager books, (65 characters total) then we can bring down the Starfleet personnel to 119 which is more acceptable. If we omit the crewmembers whose names were visible on lists in alternate universe or dream sequence episodes like "Non Sequitur" and "Projections" (32 crewmembers) we are down to 87 names.
If we omit the crewmembers whose names were visible on lists in alternate universe or dream sequence episodes like "Non Sequitur" and "Projections" (32 crewmembers) but add the crewmembers mentioned in books, we will have total 186 crewmembers. If we omit the Maquis (31 total including 11 characters mentioned in books) plus Kes, Neelix and Naomi Wildman, we will be down to 152 Starfleet crewmembers when Voyager arrived in the Delta Quadrant.
Unfortunately, my Crew List is a bit dated now. Recently I found a site at Memory Beta which mentions all characters from the books, including characters from the books published after seasons 1-3 which lazy me didn't knew about since I own only few books from the later seasons and didn't bother to buy.
When I get time to do it (as soon as possible I hope but most likely in a week or two). I will add those characters plus the characters from the Elite Force game.
Then we have a problem because even if I omit the characters mentioned on computer screens in episodes like "Projections" and "Non Sequitur, there will be more than 152 original characters on the ship. I I keep those names, then there will be more than 184 original Starfleet crewmembers which it was in the beginning and more than 218 totally.
Now that has made me wonder about some tghings and here is a theory:
I think that the whole mission to the Badlands had a hidden agenda. It was about more than finding one lost Maquis ship.
Among the original crew members, which were more than the official 141, there was a special commando force which was supposed to attack and take over at least one of the planets in the Badlands where the Maquis did have bases. This commando force included about 70 people and they would be led by Liutenant Cavit. That purpose was a military secret. Most of the crewmembers on board didn't know anything about this mission. Only the members of the force plus their CO Cavit, Janeway and Tuvok were aware of the upcoming action.
When Voyager was transported to the Delta Quadrant, Cavit and some of the commando force members were killed. When it was clear that Voyager was stranded in the Delta Quadrant and that it could be a long journey home, Janeway and Tuvok decided to dissolve the whole commando force. The former members were informed one after one by Tuvok because Janeway didn't want to upset or annoy the new Maquis members of the crew by letting everyone on the ship know what had been planned from the beginning. Chakotay was informed later on but told to keep it a secret and not mention anything to the former Maquis.
If we omit the Maquis members (31 total including 11 characters mentioned in books) and characters who came on board after Voyager's arrival to the Delta Quadrant, such as Kes, Neelix, Naomi Wildman and later additions such as Seven Of Nine, The Equinox crew and such, we'll discover that Voyager, when it arrived in the Delta Quadrant, had 184 Starfleet crew members, not 141 which is the official number. These numbers include Tom Paris and Tuvok but not The Doctor since he wasn't regarded as a Starfleet crewman when the ship arrived in the Delta Quadrant.
However, if we omit the characters mentioned in the Voyager books, (65 characters total) then we can bring down the Starfleet personnel to 119 which is more acceptable. If we omit the crewmembers whose names were visible on lists in alternate universe or dream sequence episodes like "Non Sequitur" and "Projections" (32 crewmembers) we are down to 87 names.
If we omit the crewmembers whose names were visible on lists in alternate universe or dream sequence episodes like "Non Sequitur" and "Projections" (32 crewmembers) but add the crewmembers mentioned in books, we will have total 186 crewmembers. If we omit the Maquis (31 total including 11 characters mentioned in books) plus Kes, Neelix and Naomi Wildman, we will be down to 152 Starfleet crewmembers when Voyager arrived in the Delta Quadrant.
Unfortunately, my Crew List is a bit dated now. Recently I found a site at Memory Beta which mentions all characters from the books, including characters from the books published after seasons 1-3 which lazy me didn't knew about since I own only few books from the later seasons and didn't bother to buy.
When I get time to do it (as soon as possible I hope but most likely in a week or two). I will add those characters plus the characters from the Elite Force game.
Then we have a problem because even if I omit the characters mentioned on computer screens in episodes like "Projections" and "Non Sequitur, there will be more than 152 original characters on the ship. I I keep those names, then there will be more than 184 original Starfleet crewmembers which it was in the beginning and more than 218 totally.
Now that has made me wonder about some tghings and here is a theory:
I think that the whole mission to the Badlands had a hidden agenda. It was about more than finding one lost Maquis ship.
Among the original crew members, which were more than the official 141, there was a special commando force which was supposed to attack and take over at least one of the planets in the Badlands where the Maquis did have bases. This commando force included about 70 people and they would be led by Liutenant Cavit. That purpose was a military secret. Most of the crewmembers on board didn't know anything about this mission. Only the members of the force plus their CO Cavit, Janeway and Tuvok were aware of the upcoming action.
When Voyager was transported to the Delta Quadrant, Cavit and some of the commando force members were killed. When it was clear that Voyager was stranded in the Delta Quadrant and that it could be a long journey home, Janeway and Tuvok decided to dissolve the whole commando force. The former members were informed one after one by Tuvok because Janeway didn't want to upset or annoy the new Maquis members of the crew by letting everyone on the ship know what had been planned from the beginning. Chakotay was informed later on but told to keep it a secret and not mention anything to the former Maquis.
Does anyone recall how many crew were non-human? In Lineage, doesn't B'Elanna say there are 140 humans (possibly a rough estimate). That seems like almost the whole crew compliment.
Let's see, by that time there were 2 Bolians, 2 Vulcans, 3 Bajorans, 1 Talaxian, 1 Brunali, wasn't there another Betazoid that was still alive by that point? Have I missed any? Well other than B'Elanna herself and Naomi. Wasn't there a Vulcan female seen in Repression?
Let's see, by that time there were 2 Bolians, 2 Vulcans, 3 Bajorans, 1 Talaxian, 1 Brunali, wasn't there another Betazoid that was still alive by that point? Have I missed any? Well other than B'Elanna herself and Naomi. Wasn't there a Vulcan female seen in Repression?
It's a shame there wasn't a story or episode where there were some Voyager crewmembers who sided with the Maquis' cause.
If you count the Borg baby who survived, that's five people taken aboard in Collective.
Considering it's explicitly said that there are no female Vulcans on Voyager when Vorik goes into Pon Farr, I guess the female Vulcan died.
She's also not mentioned when there's an issue of telepaths onboard.
I can dig out my old workings out and provide the best list - includes notes regarding episode titles and such
The best list I already gave to you. There it is even mentioned about the female vulcan from repression.
When I did my Crew List on the Kes Website, I found 218 names on the list.
If we omit the Maquis members (31 total including 11 characters mentioned in books) and characters who came on board after Voyager's arrival to the Delta Quadrant, such as Kes, Neelix, Naomi Wildman and later additions such as Seven Of Nine, The Equinox crew and such, we'll discover that Voyager, when it arrived in the Delta Quadrant, had 184 Starfleet crew members, not 141 which is the official number. These numbers include Tom Paris and Tuvok but not The Doctor since he wasn't regarded as a Starfleet crewman when the ship arrived in the Delta Quadrant.
However, if we omit the characters mentioned in the Voyager books, (65 characters total) then we can bring down the Starfleet personnel to 119 which is more acceptable. If we omit the crewmembers whose names were visible on lists in alternate universe or dream sequence episodes like "Non Sequitur" and "Projections" (32 crewmembers) we are down to 87 names.
If we omit the crewmembers whose names were visible on lists in alternate universe or dream sequence episodes like "Non Sequitur" and "Projections" (32 crewmembers) but add the crewmembers mentioned in books, we will have total 186 crewmembers. If we omit the Maquis (31 total including 11 characters mentioned in books) plus Kes, Neelix and Naomi Wildman, we will be down to 152 Starfleet crewmembers when Voyager arrived in the Delta Quadrant.
Unfortunately, my Crew List is a bit dated now. Recently I found a site at Memory Beta which mentions all characters from the books, including characters from the books published after seasons 1-3 which lazy me didn't knew about since I own only few books from the later seasons and didn't bother to buy.
When I get time to do it (as soon as possible I hope but most likely in a week or two). I will add those characters plus the characters from the Elite Force game.
Then we have a problem because even if I omit the characters mentioned on computer screens in episodes like "Projections" and "Non Sequitur, there will be more than 152 original characters on the ship. I I keep those names, then there will be more than 184 original Starfleet crewmembers which it was in the beginning and more than 218 totally.
Now that has made me wonder about some tghings and here is a theory:
I think that the whole mission to the Badlands had a hidden agenda. It was about more than finding one lost Maquis ship.
Among the original crew members, which were more than the official 141, there was a special commando force which was supposed to attack and take over at least one of the planets in the Badlands where the Maquis did have bases. This commando force included about 70 people and they would be led by Liutenant Cavit. That purpose was a military secret. Most of the crewmembers on board didn't know anything about this mission. Only the members of the force plus their CO Cavit, Janeway and Tuvok were aware of the upcoming action.
When Voyager was transported to the Delta Quadrant, Cavit and some of the commando force members were killed. When it was clear that Voyager was stranded in the Delta Quadrant and that it could be a long journey home, Janeway and Tuvok decided to dissolve the whole commando force. The former members were informed one after one by Tuvok because Janeway didn't want to upset or annoy the new Maquis members of the crew by letting everyone on the ship know what had been planned from the beginning. Chakotay was informed later on but told to keep it a secret and not mention anything to the former Maquis.
But you are aware of the fact, that books and the game Elite force and so on are not canon facts? Because of this you can not see this data as official facts and you should ignore this. Just official mentioned information should be listed
I must state that I don't care about canon when it comes to Voyager!
No, I'm not trying to provoke you or insult you in any way. I can clearly see your point here. The reason for me to dismiss what's canon or not actually depends on the fact that those in charge messed up the show so much that it's sometimes impossible to try to sort anything out in matters like this even if it's regarded as canon or not.
If you look at my Crew List on the Kes Website, you will see that even if we would totally dismiss the characters in the books, it still wouldn't work coming up with a crew list with the 141 people which was stated as canon when it comes to the Voyager crew.
And I won't go into the amount of torpedoes and shuttles destroyed already in the first seasons or that the Stardate for the episodes "Lifesigns" and "Investigations" places the events in "Investigations" before the events in "Lifesigns", something we know is impossible.
I must also admit that I really like the early season 1-3 Voyager books and that they are very easy to adapt to the Voyager timeline. OK, there are some things who have to be overlooked and sorted out but most of all they are possible to fit in the events in the books into the Voyager timeline which has actually given me a lot of fun with using my imagination and fantasy potential to maximum.
Besides that, the season 1-3 Voyager books are very good. Exellently written by authors who are actually better than the writers of the TV-series. The adventures in those books would have been great Voyager episodes.
My old fans remember me!
To be honest, I don't remember if you were one of my "fans", if you hated me or if you were just one of many innocent bystanders. However, I do think that I'm a little more peaceful and civlized these days than I used to be.
Not to mention that this forum is very peaceful nowadays. So many nice people which are impossible to get angry with.
I'm a dedicated person when it comes to certain matters, even outside Star Trek. As for Kes, she's still a favorite.
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