Heroes: Your Thoughts?

[DarKush]

Yesterday I finished Heroes Season 4. I didn't watch the series during its run, but I did eventually pick up all four seasons on DVD. I finally decided to watch the series this year. I wanted to be up on it before Heroes Reborn started.

I had heard a lot of stuff online about how good Season 1 was, but that it went downhill Season 2.

After watching the entire run, I actually thought the first three seasons were good. I don't think that Season 1 was brilliant, but good. Season 2 wasn't as good. I enjoyed Season 3 as well. I thought Season 4 was the weakest season. Perhaps throughout the (hopefully) following conversation I can explain more in detail about what I liked/didn't like about the various seasons.

I'm curious to hear what other people who watched Heroes thought about the series and why people felt that things went horribly wrong after Season 1.

 

[Christopher]

Season 1 was pretty good, but the problem is that it was designed to end after one season. The original plan was that each season would pick up with a different set of characters, so the story arcs of the season-1 characters were written with definite conclusions. So when the network insisted on keeping the characters around because of the actors' popularity (or giving Ali Larter yet another lookalike to play), the writers were forced to continue stories that had already reached their natural conclusions, and so what came after was contrived and forced.

Also, the loss of Bryan Fuller badly hurt the quality of the writing. And some of what we got in the next couple of seasons was achingly stupid, like the 2-parter where the second eclipse happened -- and somehow happened simultaneously all over the Earth, because evidently the Earth is flat. Not to mention that the impossibly global eclipse lasted for hours rather than the few minutes that real total solar eclipses last. Not to mention that it somehow took everyone's powers away, the implication being that the previous eclipse in the pilot had given them their powers in the first place, even though a number of the characters overtly had powers well before the eclipse in the pilot.

Anyway, while season 3 was horrible, I felt that season 4 was somewhat better, though still a shadow of the show season 1 had been.

 

[Relayer1]

I agree - I can't see the 'everything went completely down hill after season one' either, although there were certainly some issues, especially with season four.

I've just purchased them all on Bluray - a rewatch is in order, especially with a new show coming.

I wonder if Sylar will turn up in the new show ? He doesn't have to look like Zachary Quinto...

 

[Christopher]

I think they're already bringing back too many characters. The reason the original series went so wrong was the insistence on bringing back characters whose stories had already ended, concocting lamer and lamer excuses to keep them around. I think Heroes Reborn should be a fresh start, with maybe just one or two returning characters, or the occasional cameo. But it looks like they're determined to bring back everyone they can, and that's just repeating the greatest mistake of the original.

 

[DarKush]

Season 1 was pretty good, but the problem is that it was designed to end after one season. The original plan was that each season would pick up with a different set of characters, so the story arcs of the season-1 characters were written with definite conclusions. So when the network insisted on keeping the characters around because of the actors' popularity (or giving Ali Larter yet another lookalike to play), the writers were forced to continue stories that had already reached their natural conclusions, and so what came after was contrived and forced.

Also, the loss of Bryan Fuller badly hurt the quality of the writing. And some of what we got in the next couple of seasons was achingly stupid, like the 2-parter where the second eclipse happened -- and somehow happened simultaneously all over the Earth, because evidently the Earth is flat. Not to mention that the impossibly global eclipse lasted for hours rather than the few minutes that real total solar eclipses last. Not to mention that it somehow took everyone's powers away, the implication being that the previous eclipse in the pilot had given them their powers in the first place, even though a number of the characters overtly had powers well before the eclipse in the pilot.

Anyway, while season 3 was horrible, I felt that season 4 was somewhat better, though still a shadow of the show season 1 had been.

Thanks Christopher and Relayer for sharing your thoughts.

I had read that the show changed directions after the first season regarding continuing with season 1 characters. And I while they did add new characters like Maya and Monica in Season 2, though I don't think they did good jobs developing those characters and integrating them into the main action.

Good point you made about the eclipse, however could the eclipse not trigger some of the superpowers? I don't think that was ever explained. Granted there were some specials-the founders of the Company-before the eclipse in season 1, but maybe it triggered superpowers for some of the specials.

Christopher I wonder why you think Season 3 was horrible? I didn't see it that much different in quality from the previous two seasons. Perhaps the "Fugitive" arc was more tightly focused than the "Villains" arc, however I did like the main antagonist in the "Villains" arc. I thought they were pretty formidable. Regarding Season 4, it just felt like the stakes weren't big enough. It felt like the villain's goal was a bit underwhelming, though I did like the main villain. I wish he had had a bigger agenda.

Relayer1, I've read that Quinto isn't returning. But maybe it's something they are keeping for a surprise. As much as I liked Sylar I wonder if some of the problem was keeping him on the show because he was so cool. Maybe they should've moved on, or brought him back on a recurring basis.

 

[Mr Light]

Each "volume" felt like an entirely different show so I'll break it down...

Season One: great stuff but way over-rated. people forget all the time wasting episodes in the middle. And there was a brilliant build-up to an utterly terrible and disappointing finale.

Season Two: generally good stuff but I couldn't stand the brother/sister characters. Kristin Bell was a great addition.

Season Three: Villains: my favorite volume. We finally get a team of super-villains led by an evil mastermind. I thought Arthur Petrelli was awesome. I haven't seen it in a long time but I thought it was very solid.

Season Three: Fugitives: THIS is where it nose-dives for me. I just don't care about non-powered government people hunting them.

Season Four: this is where I just stopped caring all together. I had high hopes for Robert Knepper but the story was just bad and went nowhere.

 

[hux]

One was great. It had an objective and was effective in getting there whilst simultaneously introducing characters and bringing the whole piece together. The pacing was just right and the role each character played appeared to have a purpose in the bigger scheme. It was a reasonably good self-contained adventure.

Two was utterly abysmal. Slow, meandering, pointless. Characters that now have no role in anything outside of themselves. Plot lines that served no purpose. New characters who are inconsequential. But it's the awful pacing that truly ruins the momentum established in season one.

Three was just terrible. The criticisms levelled at season two (slow and boring) obviously compelled them to throw more action at the viewer. Sadly this resulted in tedious and pointless battles, overkill on powers (now you have them, now you don't) not to mention, heroes becoming villains and villains becoming heroes. Dumb, noisy and superficial.

Four was a marginal improvement on what had gone before but it was all too late by now. The whole thing had become a forgettable mess.

 

[DarKush]

Mr. Light,

Interesting that "Fugitives" didn't work for you. I enjoyed that arc quite a bit. I thought the antagonists were good. The storyline felt like a X-Men storyline. Granted it would've been cooler to perhaps have special weapons to take down the heroes or to have other specials to take down the heroes.

Hux,

Perhaps with Season 3 more space should've been given between the arcs. I mean it was two separate major storylines shoved into one season. Perhaps they should've went with their original "Exodus" (viral outbreak) storyline for the beginning of Season 3. And then moved into "Villains". And saved "Fugitives" for season four. I think that storyline was more compelling than the carnival.

 

[Relayer1]

I think they're already bringing back too many characters. The reason the original series went so wrong was the insistence on bringing back characters whose stories had already ended, concocting lamer and lamer excuses to keep them around. I think Heroes Reborn should be a fresh start, with maybe just one or two returning characters, or the occasional cameo. But it looks like they're determined to bring back everyone they can, and that's just repeating the greatest mistake of the original.

I suppose it depends on how they do it. A couple of recurring characters and two or three cameos would be fine. Too many appearances not so.

If it works, there's always the option of catching up with other characters in later seasons.

 

[Morpheus 02]

i actually liked the 1st 1/2..... Robert Knepper's character seemed interesting... slowly building an army with persuasive arguments.

But when it turned out he was just an obsessed petty brat...that's what killed it for me. It was a lack of payoff, kinda like Season 1 finale.

 

[DWF]

I always liked the show, they maintained the premise of ordinary people with extraordinary abilities and how they handled their powers. I also liked how the show followed the characters on their own stories and how they corssed paths wth each other from time to time. I liked the first and third seasons the best, the second was ruined by the writer's strike. I am looking forward to the upcoming miniseries though.

 

[Trekkin]

Somehow I managed to avoid the confirmation that the new series was happening. You could have knocked me down with a feather when I saw the trailer on TV.

Heroes is one of those things where I like a lot of the components, but find the whole to be a bit of a mess. I found that a lot of the latter series flaws were already present in Series 1, but they were balanced out a bit more with the engaging mystery. S2 was just filled with plot lines that ultimately went no where and some absolutely terrible characters. The first half of S3 kept S2's flaws going, but at a faster pace.

I actually liked the second half of S3 and S4. My only major complaints there were Noah's morality flip-flops were really starting to grate, and each season essentially 'reset' so that all the characters were separated and couldn't resolve the plot in less than an episode. They're not great by any means, but I find them more focused and entertaining.

Peter, Claire and Sylar were certainly much better handled in S4 - a good thing considering they were pretty much the series protagonists by that point. They had arcs that actually seemed planned out for once.

 

[MacLeod]

The show overall went downhill after S1, not to say that later seasons didn't have their moments, but has already been highlighted each new seasons was supposed to have a group of new characters, of course executive meddling put an end to that.

As for Hereos: Reborn, not really seen or read much about it so at best I'm cautiously optimistic about it but I'm going with fairly low expectations for the new series.

 

[Aragorn]

The completely underwhelming season one finale was a red flag for the rest of the series, even if we didn't know it at the time.

Stephen Tobolowsky actually explained his time on Heroes quite well. He said they were a one act show. They would reach the end of act one, then start act one all over again.

 

[One Lucky Red Shirt]

im gonna give the new heroes a try. i loved season 1. very addicted. i never watched the show as it aired but season 1 was dirt cheap so i picked it up. i was hooked.

season 1 - kept me hooked and loved it. save the cheerleader, save the world.

season 2 - too short and no direction. pointless.

season 3 - not as good as season 1 but kept me hooked.

season 4 - interesting but never finished watching it.

i loaned season 1 out to a few friends who loved it. but then by season 2 most of them were like it was just ok.

 

[Mr Light]

In preparation for the return I've been watching Season Three Villains. I still think this was the high point of the series. We actually had a strong competent central villain with a bunch of lackey bad guys. Daphne was a great addition to the cast. The only bits that were a little silly were Sylar becoming a good guy and Hiro becoming a ten year old, but at least it changes things up a little.

Why didn't people like the Villains arc?

 

[Guy Gardener]

Marvel finally got rid of the Red Hulk, so Hiro felt like it was safe to come out and play.

 

[Morpheus 02]

oh! Forgot to respond... like most, loved the first season, though the finally was super disappointing.

I actually liked the 1st 1/2 or so of season 4. Robert Knepper made a very convincing charismatic leader building an army of superbeings poised to take over the world. But when they made him into a lovesick puppy who gets denied -- that killed it.

some of the arcs were silly...like Sylar becoming Nathan for a season, and then being good. Him and Ali Larter's character being forced in for so long. (Did we ever really understand the evil twin's power -- was it taking over a body, and then surfacing? could SHE have escaped the fire?)

I did like the season 3 arc -- having old vs. new generation.

I am hoping it'll be good this season...they're bringing back some of the better characters, and I think one makes a lot of sense

Spoiler: Dark Matter reveal

Micah, who looks like a lead character now, especially on the WB IMDB says he's in for 13 episodes. If true, that'd be a good thing, IMHO.

Can't wait for it to start...

 

[Christopher]

Him and Ali Larter's character being forced in for so long. (Did we ever really understand the evil twin's power -- was it taking over a body, and then surfacing? could SHE have escaped the fire?)

You mean Niki and Jessica? There was no "evil twin." Jessica had died in childhood, killed by her and Niki's abusive father. Niki was the one with the superpowers, but IIRC, her father had beaten her whenever she'd manifested them, so she'd suppressed them so deeply that she forgot she had them at all, just as she suppressed the memory of Jessica's death. Eventually, she developed dissociative identity disorder, with the "Jessica" persona being an alternate personality she constructed for herself, one that embodied all those parts of herself that she couldn't consciously remember, including her superpowers.

 

[DWF]

In preparation for the return I've been watching Season Three Villains. I still think this was the high point of the series. We actually had a strong competent central villain with a bunch of lackey bad guys. Daphne was a great addition to the cast. The only bits that were a little silly were Sylar becoming a good guy and Hiro becoming a ten year old, but at least it changes things up a little.

Why didn't people like the Villains arc?

I've been rewatching the entire series and I'm up to season four now. Villains nicely dovetails into Fugitives, but until the end of Villains the characters do at times out of character. But everything imagable is thrown at them ini the third season and overall I do think it's a good season.