HBO's "Westworld", starring Anthony Hopkins/produced by J.J. Abrams

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by Ensign_Redshirt, Jul 23, 2014.

  1. Kahless the Unforgettable

    Kahless the Unforgettable Captain Captain

    Joined:
    May 7, 2016
    Location:
    Vancouver, Canada
    And be sure not to forget that J.J. Abrams said Khan was definitely not in Into Darkness, and he clearly wasn't! Always believe what the showrunners have to say. They have no motives for trying to obfuscate the story when it's prematurely unveiled. <thumbs up!>
     
  2. DigificWriter

    DigificWriter Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    May 20, 2001
    Location:
    West Haven, UT, USA
    Jonathan Nolan and Lisa Joy Nolan are not J.J. Abrams.

    Plus, @Christopher had the perfect response to this kind of thinking:
    "As a rule, though, there's such a thing as the presumption of innocence. If you expect someone to be honest and they turn out to be lying, that's their fault. But if you assume they're lying and they actually aren't, then you're the one in the wrong. So giving others the benefit of the doubt is a basic part of just generally not being a jerk. If you're going to accuse someone of lying, it should be based on evidence, and "Well, some other person with a similar job lied once" is not evidence by any rational standard."
     
    The Nth Doctor and Beagleman like this.
  3. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Location:
    JirinPanthosa
    What made Dolores run off, injured if it wasn't continuous from that rape scene? And what did she do after escaping if not run into William? It was pretty obvious to me that after she ran off from that scene she immediately ran into William, unless she went 'way off loop' due to some other reason in the past that we weren't shown. It also doesn't make any sense for Dolores to have been 'Malfunctioning' in the past.

    And, if those flashes to MiB were actually a cinematic cut to the similar scene in the future, why did they evoke body language of recognition from memory from Dolores? That wasn't a comparison to the future, it was quite clearly Dolores remembering the past.

    There's also the issue that it was stated that most of the hosts weren't around nearly as long as Dolores yet we see all the same hosts. We even see Clementine taking the role of Madam in the past, which would only be explained if she previously held that job and was demoted for Maeve.

    Even if you can make some circumstantial arguments that suggest multiple timelines, would you really think that was good television? This would push the story over the line between 'Complicated' and 'Convoluted' and ask the audience to go back and re-watch everything trying to spot what was actually happening. Also it would make MiB seem more like a comic book villain's backstory than a mysterious sociopath. Both characters are less interesting if they are the same person as the other.

    Lawrence was able to be repaired quickly for the same reason a character in Game of Thrones leaves one place one episode and shows up on the other side of the world the next episode. The story moves at narrative pace, not chronological pace.
     
    Last edited: Nov 5, 2016
    Beagleman and The Nth Doctor like this.
  4. Kahless the Unforgettable

    Kahless the Unforgettable Captain Captain

    Joined:
    May 7, 2016
    Location:
    Vancouver, Canada
    <simply shrugs> You can't convince some people.

    Time will tell.
     
  5. Roshi

    Roshi Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2004
    Location:
    Roshi
    Original Gunslinger/Chris spotted in the background when Bernard visited sub-level 82!
    This episode was bonkers!
     
  6. DigificWriter

    DigificWriter Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    May 20, 2001
    Location:
    West Haven, UT, USA
    Regarding that little Easter Egg glimpse of the Yul Brenner Gunslinger, it doesn't actually mean anything with regards to the mythos of the series and was there purely as a 'wink' to the audience.

    For its first five episodes, the series had been following the Game of Thrones model by crediting main cast members only if/when they appear in an episode, but The Adversary saw Evan Rachael Wood get a credit even though she was nowhere to be found, making me wonder why.
     
  7. Forbin

    Forbin Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Mar 15, 2001
    Location:
    I said out, dammit!
    We saw a character portrait sketch of her in the book that was being thumbed through. I guess that was enough to warrant a credit?

    My thought after the Gatling gun scene: "Looks like they upgraded Teddy's balls!" :O
     
  8. Roshi

    Roshi Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 22, 2004
    Location:
    Roshi
    Jesus, do you really need to spoil the fun out of everything??? Of course it doesn't mean anything!
    :rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes::rolleyes:


    Oh, Cirroc Lofton got credited for every DS9 episode. So what's your point?
     
  9. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Location:
    JirinPanthosa
    Now they're teasing the possibility of Arnold still being alive and directly modifying the original hosts to be more independent. I wonder if it will really turn out to be him.

    One thing I don't like about last night's episode, Elsie made a classic horror movie mistake. Just hang around in the place you know a dangerous person frequents after you prove something seedy is happening. Bad things shouldn't happen to characters because they make silly obvious mistakes.
     
  10. DigificWriter

    DigificWriter Vice Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    May 20, 2001
    Location:
    West Haven, UT, USA
    I brought up the Evan Rachael Wood credit thing because it's a departure from what had happened prior to now, and brought up the fact that there's no deeper meaning to the Yul Brenner Gunslinger cameo because that particular point was specifically stressed by the showrunners in their weekly postmortem chat with James Hibbard.
     
  11. Kahless the Unforgettable

    Kahless the Unforgettable Captain Captain

    Joined:
    May 7, 2016
    Location:
    Vancouver, Canada
    She was also in the database of first generation models Bernard was looking through. (You know, seeing as how she was around back when William had first come to the park. <cough>)

    Also, we now know those first generation models, despite being more mechanical rather than biological on the inside, can still bleed courtesy of Ford's dog. Oh, and that they're pretty much indistinguishable from the latest generation on the outside, with not a single one looking anything like Old Bill.

    (But I'm sure all those tidbits will be ignored by certain posters.)
     
  12. LJones41

    LJones41 Commodore Commodore

    Joined:
    Sep 21, 2015
    Location:
    I'm from Long Beach, CA.
    What exactly did Felix and Sylvester do to upgrade Maeve?
     
  13. Mr. Adventure

    Mr. Adventure Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Jun 9, 2001
    Location:
    Mr. Adventure
    Turned the dials to 11.
     
  14. Serial thread killer

    Serial thread killer Vice Admiral Premium Member

    Joined:
    Apr 20, 2003
    Location:
    uk
    I wonder why they have sub levels that have been left to rot, you think it would be cheaper for a firm to refurbish them, instead of building up.
    Not to mention the security risk of having old tech lying around.
     
  15. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Location:
    JirinPanthosa
    Maeve is using game genie.
     
  16. JirinPanthosa

    JirinPanthosa Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Nov 20, 2012
    Location:
    JirinPanthosa
    Is there a any indication Clementine is or is not first gen?

    We haven't seen any bot interacting with William and Logan whose role is different than it is in any other part of the show, when supposedly they are reassigned frequently.
     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2016
  17. Kahless the Unforgettable

    Kahless the Unforgettable Captain Captain

    Joined:
    May 7, 2016
    Location:
    Vancouver, Canada
    What, you mean like Delores and Lawrence?
     
  18. The Nth Doctor

    The Nth Doctor Bah humbug! Premium Member

    Joined:
    Jul 20, 2000
    Location:
    Sardicktown
    I've been interested by Maeve's storyline from the get go, but now things are really becoming interesting with Maeve gaining self-awareness and getting the upperhand on Felix and Sylvester. However, I can't help but think that whoever made the "much higher than us" modifications to Maeve (presumably Robert or Arnold) wanted or even expected Maeve to act the way she did so she could adjust her attributes to her own liking.

    I know this is a minor nitpick, but why on earth would a giant advertisement for the park be running on the Design floor? Other than conveniently placed so Maeve would see her past self.

    Nice to see the show finally answered my question about surface access points.

    Yeah, I realized the moment she went down there, abruptly hanging up on Bernard, that something bad would happen to her. Hopefully, considering we didn't see her die right away, she won't be killed (at least yet). I quite like Elsie, although largely because of Shannon Woodard.

    I likewise wasn't surprised Theresa was the one who was responsible for the information leaks because of how Bernard was initially cut off from telling her about Elsie's discoveries when she broke off their relationship.
     
  19. Aragorn

    Aragorn Admiral Admiral

    Joined:
    Dec 30, 2002
    I noticed that too. She probably has a contract where she gets paid for every episode, while the ones who keep disappearing from the credits don't. The latter is one way to save money.

    :D I just came across this comment elsewhere and it made me think of this thread:

     
    Last edited: Nov 7, 2016
    The Nth Doctor likes this.
  20. Kahless the Unforgettable

    Kahless the Unforgettable Captain Captain

    Joined:
    May 7, 2016
    Location:
    Vancouver, Canada
    No, realizing that something makes sense with the available information given makes you amazing. But it does make you foolish for denying it as a very strong possibility when it has become more and more obvious with every episode. Especially when one's strongest argument is effectively "I'm going to ignore that because I can't explain it."