Have you ever given up on a Trek series? If so, what was the last straw for you?

[XCV330]

Does watching less than a minute of a preview for Scouts, saying “no fricking way” and never watching the actual show count as walking away from a series?

I almost did that over the previews and the shiny people poster. But damnit, I just had to play the first episode and I kind of like it. There's a couple of characters I instantly don't like.

Spoiler

Thok. A poor man's Shax, except not funny and uninteresting. I hope she overdoses on whatever color Ketracil they are into in the extreme future

 

[korblborp]

I almost did that over the previews and the shiny people poster. But damnit, I just had to play the first episode and I kind of like it. There's a couple of characters I instantly don't like.

scouts is the one that's a glorified screensaver for preschoolers, not academy

 

[XCV330]

scouts is the one that's a glorified screensaver for preschoolers, not academy

I’m aware of scouts. I don’t have any reference to judge it against anything else. I’m just speaking of SFA.

 

[Rowdy Roddy McDowall]

People poop.

So's the current magazine. 80 pages with a maximum of 5 of content at best.

They need to cover serious STAR TREK, not just glamour photos.

 

[FredH]

I’m aware of scouts. I don’t have any reference to judge it against anything else. I’m just speaking of SFA.

Ok — your post looks like it was responding to mine about Scouts because it didn’t mention SFA.

 

[Firebird]

Sadly, even Academy, the one series you'd expect not to have, or need it - apparently has incorporated swearing.

In what universe would young adults in their late teens/early 20's not drop a fuck or two?

 

[Timewalker]

Pretty close, though.

Did you all gather again for Q-Pid?

Considering that our gathering that night consisted of people from many towns and cities in Washington, Oregon, British Columbia, and Alberta, no. I'm sure most of them watched the episode, but not all of us together at the same time.

SCA and science fiction fandom has a considerable overlap, given that it was SF/F and history buffs who created the SCA in the first place (it's just a couple of months older than Star Trek itself), and so there's usually overlap in most SCA branches. Some of the people from my shire got together and created our own Star Trek club in 1989.

For several years I'd tape the episodes on TV and when it was my turn to host the club meetings, we'd allow time to watch an episode or two (that was back when a really determined VCR user could cram 10 episodes onto an 8-hour tape by relentlessly stopping and starting the recordings to cut out the intro, commercials, and credits). So we had plenty of time.

Those episodes were very helpful to me. We had an annual summer barbecue about a month after the summer science fiction convention some of us went to. I'd pick up some odds and ends of things in the dealers' room to use for prizes, and then flange up a Star Trek Jeopardy! game. In the same way that SCA people create personas of people who could have lived in medieval times, our ST club created personas of people who could have lived in whatever Trek-related century we picked.

So for the purpose of this Jeopardy game, I became Alexius Trebekius (take real Jeopardy, add in some Roman elements from "Bread and Circuses", a mishmash of pots, pans, tupperware, spoons and spatulas from the kitchen to substitute for an electronic system for the contestants to "ring" in), and we had our game. Of course people weren't competing for money (I'm not wealthy), so whoever got the most points had first choice of the prizes I'd picked up at the convention.

I remember one year when the winner was very pleased - Peter David happened to be the Guest of Honor at the con that year (our conventions always had author guests instead of actors), and I'd snagged an extra copy of one of his novels and asked him to sign it along with my own personal copy.

Alas, time passes. I'm not in contact with anyone from that time anymore, due to some moving, some leaving fandom, and at least one person dying. But it was fun while it lasted and I still have a copy of the Star Trek filksong book that three of us co-wrote.


One thing that I've always felt is a reasonable indicator of whether a series is any good or not is if it inspires further creativity in its viewers. All of the creative things I've done related to Star Trek, whether TOS, TAS, TNG, DS9, or Voyager have had to do with writing, music, and crafting. I haven't had even one single creative impulse from Enterprise onward. No urge to write, no urge to create songs, no urge to pick up a needle and thread or even just doodle a cartoon. Creative inspiration-wise, they're barren. And I did give most of the series a try. Nothing happened, so that was it. I decided not to waste my time trying to find water in an extended desert when I still had an oasis closer at hand.

 

[Tallguy]

In what universe would young adults in their late teens/early 20's not drop a fuck or two?

The Star Trek Universe?

What is the Star Trek show or movie that you avoided because it did not have enough swearing?

 

[NigellaDeanna20]

This is my story too.

I’ve seen everything else but gave up on Prodigy after a few episodes.

Seeing this clip from the VOY episode "Flashback" again on the BBS today reminded me that it played a big part in me giving up on watching VOY regularly:

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The scripting of the scene STILL bugs the hell out of me. The "Of course, the whole bunch of them would be booted out of Starfleet today" line is SO condescending and smug, and a pretty disrespectful thing to put into an episode celebrating the 30th Anniversary of Trek.

That, and me not liking the Sulu episode in general, made me realize that I wasn't really enjoying VOY very much and was mainly watching it because it had the words "Star Trek" in the title. I finally decided that two words being in the title was a pretty silly reason to watch a show I wasn't enjoying, so I stopped cold turkey.

(Later on, I went back and saw a lot of the VOY episodes I missed when they were airing late nights on H&I, and the show massively improved after Seven of Nine came on. So while VOY has definitely grown on me, but it's still not one of my favorites.)

So I started thinking about the other times I've gotten a bit fed up with Trek in the past & stopped watching:

I gave up on ENT somewhere in S3 as I just didn't find the 9/1 metaphor Xindi arc very interesting, or at the very least, not what I was looking for on a Trek series. But I soon came back for the more TOS-prequel-y S4, as that was more what I wanted from the show. So it was more a five-minute retirement than anything.

More recently, I decided to quit watching DSC at the end of S2. I found that both seasons 1 and 2 started out pretty strongly and had really disappointing endings, so the leap to the future of the 32nd Century seemed like a good jumping off point. Maybe I'll eventually come back to it.

And honestly, this 3rd season of SNW has been trying my patience. I just watched "Terrarium," the 9th episode of the season as I write this, and it's been lots of disappointing episodes with no really great ones (IMO). I'll probably stick it out until the very end of the series, though, since there's only 17 episodes left now.

What about you folks? Have you had a last straw with any Star Trek series that got you to stop watching?

(To clarify: I'm not looking for an encyclopedic litany of everything you've ever hated about any ST series here. That will become very dull to read very quickly. More some little thing that made you say, "...Yeah, I think I'm done here." I think that is much more interesting. And if you're discussing recent episodes of SNW, please remember to use SPOILER code! )

Can't really think of anything off hand. For me, I generally like to give any new Trek series, and tv series in general, a fair crack of the whip. If I grabs me, great but If it doesn't, it doesn't. Simple as that.

 

[Greg Cox]

The Star Trek Universe?

What is the Star Trek show or movie that you avoided because it did not have enough swearing?

It's more about being grateful that Star Trek is no longer restrained by old-school Standards & Practices, so the characters can actually talk like real people without freaking out the censors.

Let's be honest here. The only reason Scotty wasn't swearing a blue streak when the plasma injectors acted up was because you couldn't show that on network television back in the day. (Just like you couldn't have gay characters, female captains, etc.)

Thankfully, it's not 1966 anymore so modern shows have more freedom. And that's a good thing in my book.

(And, trust me on this, put a bunch of Trek writers in a bar at a convention and we're not going to be talking like Sunday school teachers.)

 

[CoveTom]

In what universe would young adults in their late teens/early 20's not drop a fuck or two?

In the real world, in the late teens and early 20's, people have sex also. Should we have graphic sex scenes in the show too?

 

[Tallguy]

It's more about being grateful that Star Trek is no longer restrained by old-school Standards & Practices, so the characters can actually talk like real people without freaking out the censors.

Let's be honest here. The only reason Scotty wasn't swearing a blue streak when the plasma injectors acted up was because you couldn't show that on network television back in the day. (Just like you couldn't have gay characters, female captains, etc.)

Thankfully, it's not 1966 anymore so modern shows have more freedom. And that's a good thing in my book.

(And, trust me on this, put a bunch of Trek writers in a bar at a convention and we're not going to be talking like Sunday school teachers.)

Points all taken. But isn't there also a consideration for who you are writing for? We've been free of 1966 television constraints for a long time and I have never read a Star Trek where Scotty swears a blue streak.

He certainly doesn't on SNW. And that's on the same platform as Academy AND Discovery. (And Lower Decks. Nobody swears like Dr. T'Ana.)

 

[Firebird]

In the real world, in the late teens and early 20's, people have sex also. Should we have graphic sex scenes in the show too?

Depends on what Standards and Practices at the network can allow the show to get away with, and whether the sex scenes further the plot or help to show someone’s characterization.

Like @Greg Cox said, it isn’t the 60’s any more. Characters on screen are allowed to act like real people.

 

[CoveTom]

Depends on what Standards and Practices at the network can allow the show to get away with, and whether the sex scenes further the plot or help to show someone’s characterization.

Like @Greg Cox said, it isn’t the 60’s any more. Characters on screen are allowed to act like real people.

Hard disagree. I suspect we will never come even close to seeing eye to eye on this. If you think a graphic sex scene could ever have a place in Trek, we are not even on the same planet, let alone the same page.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

And we only had syndicated reruns for ten years.

(And, okay, a Saturday morning cartoon.)

The difference with the ten years is that TOS was viewed as such magnificent sci-fi and TV in general (rightfully so) that it became a global phenomenon millions wanted to watch over and over again in syndication, so we were very satisfied. Yes, we wanted more ST, and received a brief gift in TAS, but we had the best of the best to watch in that decade while waiting, something no Trek production since can claim in terms of quality or mass audience interest / appeal (and that's talking about the Berman Trek era--I will not work on a comedy routine by suggesting JJ-Trek and the streaming era Trek is or will be part of a similar conversation).

 

[Firebird]

Hard disagree. I suspect we will never come even close to seeing eye to eye on this. If you think a graphic sex scene could ever have a place in Trek, we are not even on the same planet, let alone the same page.

I never implied such, but if you’re so eager to invalidate my viewpoint by writing me off in such an extreme manner, might I perhaps suggest not engaging me in dialogue in the future?

 

[Tallguy]

In the real world, in the late teens and early 20's, people have sex also. Should we have graphic sex scenes in the show too?

Depends on what Standards and Practices at the network can allow the show to get away with, and whether the sex scenes further the plot or help to show someone’s characterization.

If you think a graphic sex scene could ever have a place in Trek, we are not even on the same planet, let alone the same page.

I never implied such

@Firebird that sounded at least like a maybe.

 

[Firebird]

@Firebird that sounded at least like a maybe.

The three conditions I gave are pretty indicative that it would never happen on television, so not a maybe.

 

[Greg Cox]

Depends on what Standards and Practices at the network can allow the show to get away with, and whether the sex scenes further the plot or help to show someone’s characterization.

Like @Greg Cox said, it isn’t the 60’s any more. Characters on screen are allowed to act like real people.

Exactly. Define "graphic." There's a whole spectrum between only being able to hint at sex (like on TOS) and super-explicit sex scenes. Chances are, we're not talking about anything racier than you'd see on any network sitcom or prime-time soap opera these days: Characters sharing a bed before or after, some steamy fade-outs, cadets talking openly about hooking up and whatever.

"Oh my god, I can't believe you slept with him!"

"I know! What was I thinking?"

Which is more than appropriate for Star Trek, depending on the story.

Let's not forget that the very first Star Trek episode, "The Cage," was all about voyeuristic aliens trying to force a virile Starfleet captain to mate in captivity. And TNG wasted no time establishing that Data was fully-functional. (Hi, Tasha!)

Sex has been part of Star Trek since Day One.

 

[Firebird]

Exactly. Define "graphic." There's a whole spectrum between only being able to hint at sex (like on TOS) and super-explicit sex scenes. Chances are, we're not talking about anything racier than you'd see on any network sitcom or prime-time soap opera these days: Characters share a bed before or after, some steamy fade-outs, cadets only talking about hooking up and whatever.

"Oh my god, I can't believe you slept with him!"

"I know! What was I thinking?"

Yup, this exactly. There’s no way in hell I’d ever expect a scene with something like penetration in any Trek series. Erotic and/or suggestive as hell? You bet!