girls oon boy's sports teams in HS: wrestling, football..what say you?

[Alidar Jarok]

Re: girls oon boy's sports teams in HS: wrestling, football..what say

And maybe someone could tell me why it bothers so many people that Americans call football "soccer" and American football "football." I've never understood that.

Soccer comes from a very specific version of football known as Association Rules Football (The "Soc" comes from "Association"). As it's the most popular form of Football, most people just call it football. However, there's also Rugby Football (although most people call that Rugby) and, of course, American Football.

It's pretty weird to think that all these forms of football had the same origin, but they did.

 

[archeryguy1701]

Re: girls oon boy's sports teams in HS: wrestling, football..what say

^No kidding? I would hav never thought that any of those games would have any sort of connection, much less being connected at their origins and roots. Interesting.

 

[gblews]

Re: girls oon boy's sports teams in HS: wrestling, football..what say

"Defence"?

That's the normal spelling across the pond.

For the record, I wasn't commenting on the spelling of the word, but the notion that I was offering a defense of American football players wearing helmets.

 

[Alidar Jarok]

Re: girls oon boy's sports teams in HS: wrestling, football..what say

^No kidding? I would hav never thought that any of those games would have any sort of connection, much less being connected at their origins and roots. Interesting.

Well, football originally meant a game played on foot (not horse) so it was played by the common people. They took a ball (well, pig's bladder), ran it to the other village and the other village tried to stop them by tackling them, maybe hitting them with sticks, stealing the ball, and running it back to the original village.

Over time, different people tried to civilize the game by adding rules. Some people kept the game similar to that (eventually becoming Rugby). Other people changed it, eventually leading to kicking it and goals. I think Cambridge is the one that standardized what is Association Football.

So they are very distantly related, but they are still related. I think there were some versions that were basically Hand Ball (you could kick the ball or carry it and you had goals).

 

[Hermiod]

Re: girls oon boy's sports teams in HS: wrestling, football..what say

"Defence"?

As has already been pointed out, that is the correct English spelling of the word.

My larger point; to imply that soccer players don't use armour so they must be tougher (which is what you did in the post I originally replied to), is misleading. Soccer players don't use armour because they don't need it. Because violent contact in soccer is accidental, not a part of strategy as it is in the American game.

Why do boxers not wear padding then ? Or MMA fighters ? Violent contact in those sports is more deliberate than in American Football.

Hermiod, you say flamingliberalis ignorant of soccer and dismiss her points for that reason, and yet you haven't exactly displayed your extensive knowledge of gridiron. So how about it? What's the difference between a first down and a touchdown? When does a team punt? Have you ever watched and/or played a game? A lot of times people who don't like football were never actually told the rules, so it all looks like a bunch of people hitting each other and doing other things (like punting) randomly, when it's actually far from that.

I don't doubt that the sport is highly complicated, most professional sports are. The reason why I said flamingliberal doesn't know a lot about football is because we've had this conversation before and she told me as much.

And maybe someone could tell me why it bothers so many people that Americans call football "soccer" and American football "football." I've never understood that.

It is because the name of the sport is Association Football, not "soccer". Soccer is a nickname based on the "Soc" part of the word "association".

Football is the world's most popular spectator sport and very high up the list of participation sports as well. Just because people in the US don't like it very much that does not mean you get to change its name. Majority rules here.

TheArsenal - I think you and I can both name a certain teenage Premier League footballer who no American Footballer would be able to keep up with.

 

[Roger Wilco]

Re: girls oon boy's sports teams in HS: wrestling, football..what say

Why do boxers not wear padding then ? Or MMA fighters ? Violent contact in those sports is more deliberate than in American Football.

Because the spectators want to see people bleed in these sports, and occasionally boxers/MMA-fighters actually do die in the ring. That is something that the audience in American Football, which despite everything wants to be family-friendly, does not want to see. And it would happen, if they didn't wear armour; the reason they started wearing padding and helmets was, that players were dying left and right...

The people want violence in American Football, but only just enough to make it exciting, not so much that their heroes get killed on the pitch. Similar to motor sports, where crashes are part of the excitement, but when drivers burn to death in the cockpit, noone's happy.

 

[Hermiod]

Re: girls oon boy's sports teams in HS: wrestling, football..what say

Because the spectators want to see people bleed in these sports, and occasionally boxers/MMA-fighters actually do die in the ring. That is something that the audience in American Football, which despite everything wants to be family-friendly, does not want to see. And it would happen, if they didn't wear armour; the reason they started wearing padding and helmets was, that players were dying left and right...

The people want violence in American Football, but only just enough to make it exciting, not so much that their heroes get killed on the pitch. Similar to motor sports, where crashes are part of the excitement, but when drivers burn to death in the cockpit, noone's happy.

Of course they aren't, but that's maybe the root of the problem here - Americans calling Football boring because it's not violent enough.

I've heard all the other arguments, you can't use your hands (because it's called football), it's slow (watch a Premier League game), there aren't enough goals scored (that's because goals matter in football - in other sports you may as well only watch the last minute) etc etc etc.

 

[the 4th hanson bro]

Re: girls oon boy's sports teams in HS: wrestling, football..what say

...or interesting...

American Football is only interesting if you enjoy advertising.

Because none of the Premier League teams are sponsored by companies who plaster their name across the front of the jersey.

How are these any different?

Of course they aren't, but that's maybe the root of the problem here - Americans calling Football boring because it's not violent enough.

No it's not. Put your broad brush away.

If this were true, baseball would not be one of the most popular sports in the US, because it's not violent and can be as exciting as watching paint dry some games.

 

[archeryguy1701]

Re: girls oon boy's sports teams in HS: wrestling, football..what say

Of course they aren't, but that's maybe the root of the problem here - Americans calling Football boring because it's not violent enough.

No, I call soccer boring because nothing happens. You give 2 teams 24 hours to play non-stop, and you might end up with a grand total of 7 points in the game. Otherwise, it's just a bunch of guys chasing a ball. Same reason I hate watching baseball: nothing happens. If it helps any, I'm finding that I like watching volleyball, and that's not violent.

 

[Hermiod]

Re: girls oon boy's sports teams in HS: wrestling, football..what say

How are these any different?

They don't stop the game to show that advertising.

Nice pick using my team to illustrate your point, though.

If this were true, baseball would not be one of the most popular sports in the US, because it's not violent and can be as exciting as watching paint dry some games.

Come on, I hear the same criticisms of football all the time. Even the bloody Simpsons does it.

 

[the 4th hanson bro]

Re: girls oon boy's sports teams in HS: wrestling, football..what say

How are these any different?

They don't stop the game to show that advertising.

But they work it in to the broadcast in other ways though, at least in games I've seen, so that you can't get away from it. When the commercials come on, you can choose to not watch.

TV shows in the US are the same way with commercials throughout.

Nice pick using my team to illustrate your point, though.

That was actually the first jersey that came up on google with English Premier League.

 

[Hermiod]

Re: girls oon boy's sports teams in HS: wrestling, football..what say

But they work it in to the broadcast in other ways though, at least in games I've seen, so that you can't get away from it. When the commercials come on, you can choose to not watch.

TV shows in the US are the same way with commercials throughout.

Football runs for 45 minutes then a 15 minute break and then another 45 minutes. No commercials are shown during the actual game.

American Football seems to stop every few minutes for commercials.

 

[archeryguy1701]

Re: girls oon boy's sports teams in HS: wrestling, football..what say

^The game isn't designed around commercial breaks. The commercial breaks are designed around times in the game where the clock is stopped and personel changes/ time outs/ injuries are taking place. The game has never been stopped to show advertising, the stations and broadcasters are just taking advantage of when the game is already being stopped.

 

[TheArsenal]

Re: girls oon boy's sports teams in HS: wrestling, football..what say

No, I call soccer boring because nothing happens. You give 2 teams 24 hours to play non-stop, and you might end up with a grand total of 7 points in the game. Otherwise, it's just a bunch of guys chasing a ball. Same reason I hate watching baseball: nothing happens. If it helps any, I'm finding that I like watching volleyball, and that's not violent.

This is the intellectual equivalent of saying movies are better than books because books are nothing more than a bunch of letters lying around on a page. Until one knows what they're looking at, of course it is boring. And it's your right to think soccer is boring. I won't argue you out of it. But it's not boring because nothing is happening. It's boring to you because you've reduced the game to goals, and are unable to see the rest. Fair enough.

I am fully able to enjoy an American Football game which ends up 14-7 - the same as a 2-1 soccer game - for 3 plus hours mind, without complaining that there wasn't enough scoring, just a bunch of guys chasing a ball hitting each other.

If the whole world enjoys something, and you don't, there is a chance that the whole world is wrong. Happens. But more likely ...

 

[Roger Wilco]

Re: girls oon boy's sports teams in HS: wrestling, football..what say

^The game isn't designed around commercial breaks. The commercial breaks are designed around times in the game where the clock is stopped and personel changes/ time outs/ injuries are taking place. The game has never been stopped to show advertising, the stations and broadcasters are just taking advantage of when the game is already being stopped.

That's not entirely true; there's no way a normal NFL game would take 4 hours if it weren't for making time for as many commercials as possible.

 

[TheArsenal]

Re: girls oon boy's sports teams in HS: wrestling, football..what say

^The game isn't designed around commercial breaks. The commercial breaks are designed around times in the game where the clock is stopped and personel changes/ time outs/ injuries are taking place. The game has never been stopped to show advertising, the stations and broadcasters are just taking advantage of when the game is already being stopped.

True. But commercials extend the natural breaks forever. Games run much faster when not televised, particularly college. Any one who has gone to live games has noted how officials hold teams on the sidelines until they are signaled commercial breaks are over. It does not take, for example, three minutes to move a field goal team off the field and the kick off team on. Takes 20 seconds, most. Anyone who has sat through a non-televised game live has noted how much more fluid it is, and how much more quickly they get on with it.

 

[gblews]

Re: girls oon boy's sports teams in HS: wrestling, football..what say

My larger point; to imply that soccer players don't use armour so they must be tougher (which is what you did in the post I originally replied to), is misleading. Soccer players don't use armour because they don't need it. Because violent contact in soccer is accidental, not a part of strategy as it is in the American game.

Why do boxers not wear padding then ? Or MMA fighters ? Violent contact in those sports is more deliberate than in American Football.

I don't know. We're not talking about boxing, we're talking about football.

Also, I disagree with your last point. The violence of a 300 plus pound offensive lineman hitting a 180 pound defensive back at full speed (and those big guys can run) FAR exceeds the violence of any boxing match. In boxing, the fighters are paired up by size so, similar to soccer, all the players are around the same size which tends to lessen the impact of contact between players.

But I will say this, boxing is another sport which is much more violent than soccer.

 

[Roger Wilco]

Re: girls oon boy's sports teams in HS: wrestling, football..what say

^^
What is your point anyway regarding violence in sports?

 

[gblews]

Re: girls oon boy's sports teams in HS: wrestling, football..what say

^^
What is your point anyway regarding violence in sports?

My original point had nothing to do with violence in sports in general. It had to do strictly with a comparison of the violence in football as opposed the "violence" in soccer.

Hermiod brought other sports into the discussion. You'll have to ask him why.

Originally Posted by gblews
My larger point; to imply that soccer players don't use armour so they must be tougher (which is what you did in the post I originally replied to), is misleading. Soccer players don't use armour because they don't need it. Because violent contact in soccer is accidental, not a part of strategy as it is in the American game.

 

[Flying Spaghetti Monster]

Re: girls oon boy's sports teams in HS: wrestling, football..what say

Can we drift back to my original topic.

It's November..and HS wrestling rosters are forming. some teams have girls on them, ready to wrestle guys.. What do you think of this?