Then I can watch Data's Day right after it.
Spoilers General Prodigy plot-arc speculation thread...
- Thread starter eschaton
- Start date
Wasn't 'Data's Day' after 'The Loss'?
Suggesting to use the fluid he was found with isn't that uncommon though... but my beef with the suggestion is: 'if he was in stasis with the suit on and fluid maintaining him, why would it suddenly jog him out of stasis?' (unless of course it was the interaction of whatever treatmet the doctor onboard the Dauntless administered, but it seemed like he couldn't do much to begin with... so it could be a change in environment (temperature, etc.) onboard the Dauntless that could have done the trick... but still..
It shouldn't have any given the kind of society UFP is supposed to be.
Stern and maybe behaving abrupt towards others? Yeah (since it may come with the job)... but duplicitous or corrupt is not something SF should have by default.
Exactly yet it happens all the time, with leadership, and bad admirals. So, clearly something is faulty with Starfleet to produce such officers.
Maybe it's the interaction with threats that creates a more defensive reaction.
The suit may have been what kept him in stasis (in order to preserve him in his post-Medusan state) in the first place. However, the fluid is necessary to sustain him. And dr. Noum is a self-declared miracle worker, so he probably did one or two things to help.
In the latest episode ("Crossroads"), Ascencia looks to me to be suspicious for the first time (outside the information of the casting spoiler, that is). When she encourages the Diviner to remember things, she triggers him with "there's no obstacle that can stop you", which is a weird thing to say for a Starfleet Officer, considering she doesn't know the Diviner and his mental state does not suggests that there is nothing that can stop him. I think she is aware of his catchphrase "no barrier we cannot overcome" and she was pointing him in that direction.
I also got the impression that Ascencia had quickly found Gwyn on the ice planet, and was observing her from a small distance as she comes out of nowhere to help her against the agressive Klingon. The other encounters in that episode were all by chance, but if Ascencia is Vau N'akat she could likely easily find Gwyn either because of Vau N'akat quasi-telepathic powers or because she knew what to scan for (based on unique aspects of Vau N'akat physiology or on the composition of the heirloom, for example). And even Ascencia as Vau N'akat spy/operative would likely be confused about what is going on, especially as creating offspring was apparently a no-no, and she may be unaware of what the Diviner was up to (and I think his memory loss is real).
I wonder if Ascencia will mention her meeting with Gwyn to Janeway. If she is a Vau N'akat, she may wish to hide that info in case Janeway hasn't yet picked up on the fact that Gwyn is in rebellion against her father. But it would be risky, as there would be awkward questions if Janeway learns of the meeting through other means (like directly from Gwyn).
Ascencia does seem respectful of the Diviner though. It may be interesting to see if she would defer to him (once he regains his senses fully) or run her own agenda. She could be an interesting character, with potentially conflicting motivations. She must have been among Starfleet officers for a long time, which could rub off on her much like Gwyn was influenced by her (future) friends.
As an aside, in the first part of the season Drednok mentioned "the order". Do we think this is an order as in a standing military command, or rather an Order in the sense of the Teutonic Order, an organisation with a nominal goal and a hierarchy? I suspect the latter is more likely.
I also got the impression that Ascencia had quickly found Gwyn on the ice planet, and was observing her from a small distance as she comes out of nowhere to help her against the agressive Klingon. The other encounters in that episode were all by chance, but if Ascencia is Vau N'akat she could likely easily find Gwyn either because of Vau N'akat quasi-telepathic powers or because she knew what to scan for (based on unique aspects of Vau N'akat physiology or on the composition of the heirloom, for example). And even Ascencia as Vau N'akat spy/operative would likely be confused about what is going on, especially as creating offspring was apparently a no-no, and she may be unaware of what the Diviner was up to (and I think his memory loss is real).
I wonder if Ascencia will mention her meeting with Gwyn to Janeway. If she is a Vau N'akat, she may wish to hide that info in case Janeway hasn't yet picked up on the fact that Gwyn is in rebellion against her father. But it would be risky, as there would be awkward questions if Janeway learns of the meeting through other means (like directly from Gwyn).
Ascencia does seem respectful of the Diviner though. It may be interesting to see if she would defer to him (once he regains his senses fully) or run her own agenda. She could be an interesting character, with potentially conflicting motivations. She must have been among Starfleet officers for a long time, which could rub off on her much like Gwyn was influenced by her (future) friends.
As an aside, in the first part of the season Drednok mentioned "the order". Do we think this is an order as in a standing military command, or rather an Order in the sense of the Teutonic Order, an organisation with a nominal goal and a hierarchy? I suspect the latter is more likely.
With the end of season 1 in sight and with Dal's augment status (and what it means in the Federation) now in the open, it may be interesting to look at the possible implications.
Given that the ban of augments has been described by people from the production as "the last prejudice in the Federation", I'm guessing this won't be resolved as part of the season finale and it will get its own 10-episode or season-long arc before Dal may have a realistic possibility to apply for Starfleet. I'd expect that such a prejudice won't fall overnight after a good speech by VA Janeway, as it is not Prodigy's style to solve such problems (beyond the specific mystery/distress of the week) within one or two episodes.
I also think that it's likely that the Protogies will continue together on the Protostar during season 2, possibly involved in an attempt to rescue Chakotay and his crew. Which would also mean that the Vau N'akat storyline would continue in some form. And I would guess that they will be instrumental in saving Chakotay and gaining some sort of accomodation with the Vau N'akat, giving VA Janeway munition for their eventual admission.
I also think that Dal's eventual admission will not be framed as an exception that will be hushed over, like Bashir (and probably Una), but it will lead to a change in policy. I don't expect Prodigy to go for less than that.
The threat of the living construct will likely be ended or at least "paused" in the season finale, perhaps the Diviner shuts it down (though he may do so under certain conditions with the ability to activate it again should those not be met; he could for example demand that Starfleet does not make first contact with the Vau N'akat or he may get the Protostar and its crew to travel with him to Solum in the future so that they can see the results of the war there - if he can find the same or similar anomaly Chakotay ran into) or the teens and the Janeways find a way together.
As an aside, I think the unfortunate message of VA Janeway for Dal shows that Starfleet is too rigid. By refusing Dal, they also very likely miss the chance to get Gwyn into Starfleet. And while Gwyn's application could also present problems (due to her not being a Federation citizen, being complicit in slavery, attempting to steal a ship from Starfleet on behalf of the Vau N'akat, and potentially conflicted loyalty in future dealings with Vau N'akat), the others normally should be admitted pretty easily. However, Rok, Zero and Jankom may also decide that they can do without Starfleet if Dal is not welcome there, and even the most conservative/morally rigid Starfleet admiral would rue the loss of someone with Rok's enormous potential.
Moreover, they run the risk that the group decides to simply keep the Protostar even once the weapon has been neutralised, if they are not welcome at Starfleet, which would be a very bad outcome for Starfleet. Even if they don't, they would have Dal and Gwyn on the loose in or around the fringes of the Federation, probably looking to join some other organisation that would take them in without prejudices and restrictions. As they know confidential details of a very advanced Starfleet prototype, and both teens have unique properties (physiologically and genetically) that would make them potentially very interesting for less scrupulous organisations (like the Tal Shiar or Orion syndicate, for example), that could also end up backfiring badly on Starfleet in one way or another.
It's situations like this that show that organisations like S31, or other possible fringe divisions of the intelligence or operational branches of Starfleet that may be willing to be more loose with some of the rules, can have value. The best outcome for the Federation, in a hypothetical scenario where VA Janeway does not attempt or succeed in getting them into Starfleet, would probably be to lead the teens to a branch organisation that has (covert or open) Starfleet support, but that is not legally Starfleet and thus not necessarily subject to the same restrictions. Say, something like the Fenris Rangers or Lower Deck's archaelogists guild. Or indeed, S31 itself. They could potentially be very good "operatives" for S31, though I very much doubt a family show would ever go that route.
Having said that, I fully expect the show will get them all into Starfleet and probably due to the full support of Janeway and Chakotay.
Given that the ban of augments has been described by people from the production as "the last prejudice in the Federation", I'm guessing this won't be resolved as part of the season finale and it will get its own 10-episode or season-long arc before Dal may have a realistic possibility to apply for Starfleet. I'd expect that such a prejudice won't fall overnight after a good speech by VA Janeway, as it is not Prodigy's style to solve such problems (beyond the specific mystery/distress of the week) within one or two episodes.
I also think that it's likely that the Protogies will continue together on the Protostar during season 2, possibly involved in an attempt to rescue Chakotay and his crew. Which would also mean that the Vau N'akat storyline would continue in some form. And I would guess that they will be instrumental in saving Chakotay and gaining some sort of accomodation with the Vau N'akat, giving VA Janeway munition for their eventual admission.
I also think that Dal's eventual admission will not be framed as an exception that will be hushed over, like Bashir (and probably Una), but it will lead to a change in policy. I don't expect Prodigy to go for less than that.
The threat of the living construct will likely be ended or at least "paused" in the season finale, perhaps the Diviner shuts it down (though he may do so under certain conditions with the ability to activate it again should those not be met; he could for example demand that Starfleet does not make first contact with the Vau N'akat or he may get the Protostar and its crew to travel with him to Solum in the future so that they can see the results of the war there - if he can find the same or similar anomaly Chakotay ran into) or the teens and the Janeways find a way together.
As an aside, I think the unfortunate message of VA Janeway for Dal shows that Starfleet is too rigid. By refusing Dal, they also very likely miss the chance to get Gwyn into Starfleet. And while Gwyn's application could also present problems (due to her not being a Federation citizen, being complicit in slavery, attempting to steal a ship from Starfleet on behalf of the Vau N'akat, and potentially conflicted loyalty in future dealings with Vau N'akat), the others normally should be admitted pretty easily. However, Rok, Zero and Jankom may also decide that they can do without Starfleet if Dal is not welcome there, and even the most conservative/morally rigid Starfleet admiral would rue the loss of someone with Rok's enormous potential.
Moreover, they run the risk that the group decides to simply keep the Protostar even once the weapon has been neutralised, if they are not welcome at Starfleet, which would be a very bad outcome for Starfleet. Even if they don't, they would have Dal and Gwyn on the loose in or around the fringes of the Federation, probably looking to join some other organisation that would take them in without prejudices and restrictions. As they know confidential details of a very advanced Starfleet prototype, and both teens have unique properties (physiologically and genetically) that would make them potentially very interesting for less scrupulous organisations (like the Tal Shiar or Orion syndicate, for example), that could also end up backfiring badly on Starfleet in one way or another.
It's situations like this that show that organisations like S31, or other possible fringe divisions of the intelligence or operational branches of Starfleet that may be willing to be more loose with some of the rules, can have value. The best outcome for the Federation, in a hypothetical scenario where VA Janeway does not attempt or succeed in getting them into Starfleet, would probably be to lead the teens to a branch organisation that has (covert or open) Starfleet support, but that is not legally Starfleet and thus not necessarily subject to the same restrictions. Say, something like the Fenris Rangers or Lower Deck's archaelogists guild. Or indeed, S31 itself. They could potentially be very good "operatives" for S31, though I very much doubt a family show would ever go that route.
Having said that, I fully expect the show will get them all into Starfleet and probably due to the full support of Janeway and Chakotay.
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This isn't really a spoiler, so I'm not using the tags. Anyhoo, the next two episodes (presumably the season finale) are called "Supernova" - does this mean what I think it does?
Probably not, because no-one outside production (or those who have already seen the episodes) knows what it means. It is quite unlikely to be about the Romulan star, as negotiations regarding evacuation of Romulus were already shown to be in progress in "Crossroads". This star is already going nova without involvement of the Protogies. It also doesn't seem to have a direct link to the game of the same name, which is set between eps 10 and 11 and not really part of the "canon" of the show (though it is said to share thematic elements with the finale episodes of the first season).
Moreover, the plot of the season finale seems to whirl around the Living Construct and the attempt of Ascencia/Diviner to destroy (a large part of) starfleet. If an actual supernova is involved, it may be a random star or it may be about the Protostar's experimental engine (which is also a compacted star, apparently, not unlike Romulan propulsion with the singularities). Or it may have a more symbolic meaning.
This is wrong actually, unless something has been added in to the episode since I first watched it, which is easily done in an animation. Crossroads just references ‘negotiations’ with the Romulans. There is no indication that the Romulan sun is already going Nova in Prodigy unless they want to add some references to confirm this over the next two weeks. These negotiations between Starfleet and the Romulan’s could have been peace negotiations, and someone or some group might not have wanted those peace negotiations to happen or be successful. Danatra could have been part of the peace talks.
The Romulan Nova took about 4-5 years of known buildup. The ‘Zero Hour’ that leads to this supernova event is currently unknown but could take place anytime in the Prodigy timeline, or not.
See https://memory-alpha.fandom.com/wiki/Star_Trek:_Prodigy_Logs
"Despite our best efforts, they escaped into the Neutral Zone. We nearly endangered our fragile truce with the Romulans and the evacuation dealing there. Jean-Luc would've never forgiven me."
Those are written as companion pieces for the show, by Prodigy's head writer Aaron Waltke.
"Despite our best efforts, they escaped into the Neutral Zone. We nearly endangered our fragile truce with the Romulans and the evacuation dealing there. Jean-Luc would've never forgiven me."
Those are written as companion pieces for the show, by Prodigy's head writer Aaron Waltke.
Oh right, it must be a different Supernova next week then. Are the extra logs canon though? Like budget ‘short Treks’?
I really feel for the Romulan’s, this is terrible. Prodigy could have prevented this, but they obviously didn’t feel the need to despite setting the show in the perfect timeframe to do so.
Let’s see if Temporal Investigations have anything to say about this, but I guess if they let the Romulan sun go Nova it was just meant to be, being a fixed point in time and all that.
They are probably not strictly canon, but they are written as direct companion pieces to expand a bit on the episode that aired before (in this case, Crossroads). By the guy who is deeply involved with the writing of probably all the scripts (including season 2 scripts, which have been written already as producing animation requires long lead time in order to produce all the complicated 3D CGI animation on time, and you can't just change things a few weeks in advance a la Picard) and credited as writer of "Kobayashi" and "all the world's a stage". There is no doubt that this is what was behind the Tysess' line in "Crossroads", they added this to make it clear which negotiations he was referring to.
I suppose the supernova could still be stopped - Spock was attempting just that, after all - but it would put Picard in another timeline and I'm guessing TPTB wouldn't go for that at this point. It also probably isn't the point of Prodigy, which is a show to get new viewers and to focus on its young characters (and some veterans like Janeway, to lure in existing fans as well - succesfully so in many cases, including mine). I wouldn't mind if those young teens found a way to save Romulus - I would want to see Starfleet refusing them after that - but I doubt it.
Oh right, it must be a different Supernova next week then. Are the extra logs canon though? Like budget ‘short Treks’?
I really feel for the Romulan’s, this is terrible. Prodigy could have prevented this, but they obviously didn’t feel the need to despite setting the show in the perfect timeframe to do so.
Let’s see if Temporal Investigations have anything to say about this, but I guess if they let the Romulan sun go Nova it was just meant to be, being a fixed point in time and all that.
How do we find out what Temporal Investigations have to say about it?
Because they would show up in an episode one day to investigate like Dulmar and Lucsly did in Trials and Tribble-ations. Or they could send the USS Relativity, we know that Seven of Nine served on this ship too so it could be a potential spin-off.How do we find out what Temporal Investigations have to say about it?
Just because it's called Supernova doesn't mean it's dealing with a literal supernova.
Because it would contradict canon.
False advertising then.
JJ Abrams Star Trek movies contradicted established canon, therefore from one perspective everything that branches from JJ Abrams Trek is *not* canon. I like to see it all as being canon myself, a bit like a multiverse. I would just rather Star Trek be set in a more utopian multiverse branch rather than a borderline dystopia. But that is just my opinion.
It may also involve timetravel, as they will need to go to the future at some point (to reach Chakotay) and the Protostar drive has been shown to cause strange timey-wimey anomalies in "Time amok" - and maybe had something to do with Chakotay's anomaly as well.My guess is that the title has something to do with with the protostar drive. Either it just explodes or gets even better.
Then again, my predictions are rarely good, so...
Dal may need to give up his ship and explode the Protostar to neutralise the Living construct if the writers can not think of a better solution. Auto destruct sequence… engaged.My guess is that the title has something to do with with the protostar drive. Either it just explodes or gets even better.
Then again, my predictions are rarely good, so...
As Janeway would have said “Get that *thing* off my ship!”.
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