First-Timer's Impressions of Enterprise

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Enterprise' started by Jimmy Bob, Jul 6, 2009.

  1. Guardian Bob

    Guardian Bob Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    Yeah, Degra dying was a bit of a shock to me as well. You have to hand it to shows that kill off important characters. I'm not sure why, but I like death in TV shows.
     
  2. Jimmy Bob

    Jimmy Bob Commander Red Shirt

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    Countdown

    So nothing really groundbreaking happened to Hoshi, but at least we can say that she did stuff in this season. Like getting beaten up, injected with brainworms and attempting sacrificial suicide. Unlike Travis who didn't get anything to do. He was even left behind on the shuttle in that sphere scene in previous episode.

    Didn't expect Malcolm to get so much love. First his "do-they-don't-they" military manlove with Major Hayes gets it's conclusion with Hayes dying in Malcolm's loving hands, uttering with his last breath "Pick McKinsey" and then he was no more...

    It's a possible interpretation. Just saying.

    I was so sad when the aquatic ship got destroyed. The aquatics are my favorite Xindi species. So now, Enterprise with Trip and T'Pol goes to shut down the spheres and Archer and newly military-inspired Malcolm go with Degra's tiny ship to stop the weapon.

    By the way, when Malcolm picked his team I didn't hear any McKinsey being called out.

    But the one scene I really loved was the dining scene. I don't think we've had a dining scene between Trip, Archer and T'Pol in this season. Usually they were just some scenes where Archer drank ice tea and Trip teased T'Pol... but now this dining scene created a really powerful feeling of optimism. Archer laughed and everything. I like it when a tv show manages to make you feel "just like old times" with a nostalgic smile.

    And then there are those transdimensional women who say timeline after every single word. I kinda miss Silik. I don't know why, I just felt that way when watching those transdimensional timewomen.

    Also I just noticed that the council building sets are the Beast's castle sets from Exile.

    Okay, so onwards with the final. This thing is really better on dvd with them last episodes having no proper beginning nor ending.
     
  3. Jimmy Bob

    Jimmy Bob Commander Red Shirt

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    What the fuck?
     
  4. commodore64

    commodore64 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I like the writers left it up for our discretion. Archer says it never happened and T'Pol asks, simply, "Then why do I remember?" That means, to me, it's up for interpretation whether it "existed."

    Ha - I'm thinking I know what the WTF is about, but to refrain from spoilers -- maybe you should tell us!
     
  5. Dane_Whitman

    Dane_Whitman Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    :lol:

    Pretty much the general consensus on this board on may 13th 2005.
     
  6. Mach5

    Mach5 Admiral Admiral

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    Whether Lorian existed or not is not in question (you cannot remember something that never existed, simple logic). "In which reality did he exist" is the question we should be asking.
     
  7. HopefulRomantic

    HopefulRomantic chain mail is the new black Moderator

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    Degra's death was a real shock to me too. He was a great character, and he earned my respect big-time. I like that before he died, he and Trip made a kind of peace with each other.

    I thought this episode was outstanding.

    Yes, it was spectacular and sad at the same time.

    The Captain's Mess scenes have always been welcome, and (understandably) there weren't many in Season 3. There was a lot of hope in this scene, with Archer beginning to reconnect with the others after his self-imposed emotional isolation, and Trip and T'Pol getting along after being out of sync for several episodes. T'Pol seems to be getting a sense of her place in this world -- Starfleet and Enterprise, her post-trellium perspective and how it impacts her connection with Trip. You get the idea that the Big Three are beginning to think they'll actually make it through this.

    I didn't see Season 3 when it was initially broadcast; I got caught up with Seasons 1-3 over a month's time right before the premiere of Season 4. So yes, I agree these episodes are much more powerful when seen back to back, without having to wait days in between.
     
  8. Jimmy Bob

    Jimmy Bob Commander Red Shirt

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    Zero Hour

    It was the last ten seconds of this episode that made me go "wtf?" Space Nazi?

    The episode itself was marvelous. I especially loved the moment when Archer attached that detonator at Sulim and blowed him up. Now that was badass. Take that Picard! Though that running towards the camera thing was bit of an overkill. But still :cool:.

    Season 3 ended in a rollercoaster ride. This was a really satsifying and concluding season finale.

    But yeah... completely wtf ending.

    Concluding thoughts about season 3


    Pretty damn good season. There are some issues though. The first half of the season wasn't quite strong. I think it was because of writers inability to overcome their comfort formula. While there was an edge and a sense of direction, some of those episodes were season 2 quality. And the structure of the season-long arc was also a bit too formulaic in the beginning. But the second half of the season kicked ass! Suddenly the episodes (when previously it was mostly the continous substory that was interesting) themselves began to be really interesting and exciting, there was an inspired touch to the whole thing and it ended in amazing and satisfying fireworks. This is a season that Voyager needed for a long time and never dared to go with it. Well obviously Enterprise needed this season too, I'm just saying that Enterprise had guts to do stuff. Enterprise crew has to live with this season - with all those deaths and choices. Things happened and they didn't go away. They got worse.

    I'm now going to rate characters in the order of how integral to the storyline they were.

    1) Archer - this season belongs to Archer. He was the driving force and the central moral conflict of this season. Season 3=Archer. You don't know Archer if you haven't seen season 3. Bakula really really outshone himself as Archer here. He perfected the performance of a driven man into an art form. If you haven't seen season 3 you don't know Bakula either. There was a scene in Firefly which stated that you don't know somebody if you haven't tortured him. Because under torture the true nature comes out. For Archer this was that torture that revealed what kind of a man he is.

    2) Degra - Degra is the second lead in this season. Though in the first half of the season he was just some face, the second half of the season developed him into a tragic and brave man who actually shares traits with Archer. This season is their story.

    3) T'Pol - T'Pol was more of an observer this time. But her foundations were definitely shaken in this season. That scene in Damage where she puts on the EV suit, goes to cargo bay, falls and almost dies, gets the trellium, goes to her room, burns it and injects it - that scene was just beatiful.

    4) Trip - This place was a bit hard to pick for me. This was definitely a good season for Trip. In season two he didn't get actually much to do. But he kinda loses to Malcolm in some way because it was Malcolm who got to be all manly in the last episodes while Trip was reduced to being "love me T'Pol". Because in the end nothing really depends on Trip. More things depend on Malcolm and Phlox, and Malcolm kicked ass in Zero Hour. It was like literally "okay Trip, you sit here and let the real men finish this season." Though Trip wins them with having a personally changing journey. But I think that his journey concluded in a bit too isolated way. Then again, his thing with T'Pol is obviously unresolved and most likely continues on in season 4.

    5) Malcolm - Before the last few episodes I would have put Doctor in this place. Malcolm's only real thing was just running around and shooting things in this season. He got a bit of man-rivalry with Major Hayes, which brought us a rather entertaining fighting scene, but not really any shaking and changing the core foundation moments. However he was the only character besides Archer to earn badass points in this season. Some of his "running around and shooting things" moments were pretty awesome. I guess I can say that for Malcolm too it was so far the best season, because I remember how in most of season 2 he was just being reduced to flirting with alien women and having suggesting lead-into-sex scenes.

    6) Doctor - Just a few days ago I would have rated him much higher. For a long time he felt much more integral to the storyline than Malcolm for example. Probably because quite a lot of scenes take place in the medical bay. And he is featured quite a lot. And while not getting any personal focus, he was the only non-trinity character to express a certain emotional turmoil consistently throughout the season. Malcolm for example got his acting moment just right before the ending. Many of Phlox's scenes with Archer are good stuff. Though they mostly are meant to serve Archer's character and to show how dangerous he is, John Billingsley manages to steal a little something for himself too. Since Phlox was surreally jovial in the first two seasons, his resigned grief over the matters definitely added quite a lot of personality to the season. So actually I don't know... I'm now thinking of putting him in place number 4. Too late now I guess. But as I said before, these 4-6 places were a bit hard for me to choose. Let's just say they change a lot according to mood.

    7) Hoshi - this wasn't a good season for her. Sure she got some moments in the end, but... she was reduced into a Travis-like extra in this season. Worst season for her.

    8) Travis - The worst season for him. Ironically the worst season, season 2 was best for him. This season doesn't even try to bother that he's anything more than an extra. He doesn't appear in all the episodes, and he gets always left behind. And in Twilight he died in the first minutes and no one cared.

    So in essence, a pretty damn good season but suffers from uneven handling of characters and some questionable quality in the first half. We can actually see how this season struggles to break through it's writer's lack of talent (I actually don't mean it that badly, it's just tough forum talk). It wins in the end, but it wasn't an easy struggle and the season was quite often in the losing position. This made me realize that season 2 wasn't just an accident... there really is something wrong with the writers, and it was hard for the show to pull itself together. But kick-ass ending. Awesome.


    Definitely to be recommended. :bolian:
     
  9. Mach5

    Mach5 Admiral Admiral

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    I hope that by this you mean "ready to sacrifice his own immortal soul for the sake of his species, home world and people he cares about."

    Interesting, most T'Pol fans think of her addiction as plain character assassination.

    Both Trip and Malcolm do their parts in resolving the Xindi crisis. Malcolm, the armory officer, is in charge of kicking butt, while Trip's job is keeping Enterprise from falling apart. Enterprise most certainly wouldn't have lasted long in the Expanse if it hadn't been for Trip.
     
  10. HopefulRomantic

    HopefulRomantic chain mail is the new black Moderator

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    That's pretty typical.

    Agreed. I thought Season 3 was terrific for Archer and for Bakula.

    Most effective stories put characters in crisis, which forces them to reveal deeper layers of themselves -- as you say, their true natures. This season did a great job of revealing more of the characters, and it did so with a variety of scenarios -- "Anomaly," "Twilight," "Similitude," "Harbinger," "Zero Hour," to name a few standouts.

    I found T'Pol's character arc in Season 3 quite compelling -- taking elements planted in earlier seasons, such as her curiosity about emotion, her unseemly emotional sensitivity, her isolation from her people and the resulting need to connect more with the humans on Enterprise, and her closer connection with Trip -- and then exposing her to the "forbidden fruit." I think Blalock did a great job with it.

    I was touched by the end of "The Forgotten," the way Trip says good-bye to his sister as he dictates that letter to Taylor's parents. After the dam burst in that earlier scene with T'Pol, the peace Trip seems to be feeling in that last scene is almost tangible.

    Grief for some is a very private thing, something they choose to suffer alone. Or they'll only open up and allow themselves to be vulnerable in front of someone they trust -- such as Trip did with T'Pol in "The Forgotten."

    Billingsley is that sort of quietly skilled actor who brings out the best in his colleagues, I think. Plus, he can do wonders with whatever he's given. I really enjoyed his performance as Phlox, and the depth he brought to the character.

    Season 3 is my favorite. :)
     
  11. Jimmy Bob

    Jimmy Bob Commander Red Shirt

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    Storm Front I&II

    Hmm... I guess it's okay. I wasn't really interested what was going on though. Though the set-up for this two-parter in Zero Hour was definitely a very memorable way to end season 3, I don't think this is the follow-up what season 3 needed. Season 3 needs a quiet meditative episode acknowledging how everything has changed. Sort of something like TNG's Family.

    I must say that for me personally this whole Temporal Cold War thing doesn't make sense. And personally, in season 1 with Broken Bow and Cold Front I was expecting something completely else... something cooler to be honest. So Silik dies... and... it's not really satisfying. Daniels says "you've said more lives than you can comprehend" and I'm like "okay... don't care really." In season 1 this thing seemed so cool but this episode ended it all in a really huh? manner.

    I think this would have been more emotionally satisfying if instead of random Vosk guy it was the sphere-builders. Yes, Archer is presumed dead but he is instead in the land of the sphere-builders, who are having their way with him, but Archer goes all survival of the fittest on their asses and collapses their space-time continuum and gives a timely fuck you to Daniels and then rips a hole in the fabric of space and steps on Enteprise and then everyone hugs him. Yes. Much better.

    What I liked? Eh, it can be enjoyed in a silly fun way. Also the teaser for Storm Front II was great. And Silik saying to Archer "you've changed" and Archer's reaction (letting Silik go in a bit too startly way). Hoshi's hug. There were couple of small moments like that. Oh and that scene where Enterprise battles those airplanes above New York's skyline... that looked really cool. And the guy who played Vosk did it in a quite entertaining manner. So...

    Hopefully Home brings some sort of emotionally satisfying conclusion to season 3.
     
  12. bluedana

    bluedana Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    The thing I liked best about SF 1&2 was Archer's interactions with Alicia (much better than the analogous Picard/Lily version). He fits so smoothly into the past - even a messed-up past, it was like watching a Quantum Leap episode. Those notes about racism were so unexpected and note-perfect, I liked that thread better than the actual story.
     
  13. commodore64

    commodore64 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    That's pretty much my opinion, too. I thought it failed on a lot of levels: characters (even melting pot of people) were fairly bland. Alicia - I liked her, but we didn't really get to know her. And the Temporal Cold War came to an unceremonious end. Boo! You can't end something you've built the series on overnight in such a lame way.

    I do think Berman/Braga gave Coto a pile of dung to clean up, but I feel more like Coto spread it around than found a clear way of actually handling it.
     
  14. Jimmy Bob

    Jimmy Bob Commander Red Shirt

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    Home

    I want to mention a thing about Storm Front which I forgot to do in the first time. In Storm Front when Enterprise approaches planet Earth it's the eurasian continent that's on their screens. I just wanted to bring it out because most of the time earth is always shown as the american continent. So that was rather refreshing, as in "I've never seen earth from that angle" refreshing.

    Anyway, Home? Did it deliver? Yes. Archer got laid. Good for him, he deserves it after his trials in season 3. I liked Archer's discomfort with being hailed as a hero and carrying the burden of his actions. It shall be interesting to watch if Archer's leading style is going to be different from how he acted in the first two season.

    Jolene looks so boney. In a bad way. Usually boney look is bad, unless you're a very cool skeleton like this mexican gal right here.

    [​IMG]


    T'Pol looked much more healthier in season 3. Now she looks... well she does look like a crack whore so I guess that's in character, no?

    I just wanted to punch that vulcan groom guy in the face. Vulcan itself looked pretty cool. Certain Star Wars Sith vibe, reminded me of Korriban in Kotor rpg series (which came out like 2-1 years before this season... god, it's funny how recent this all seems).

    Hmm... this episode really did make it seem like all Archer needed was a good shag to get rid of the weight of the world. I'm not sure if this was the most effective way to conclude this. I mean, there's Archer telling Soval to fuck himself, dreaming of Xindi and having conflicting thoughts about season 3... and after getting laid, everyone smiles and even Soval wants to make best friends with Archer. I'm not sure but there's something lacking here.

    The most interesting thing for me about this episode was the rising xenophobia of earth. Wonder if they go
    into it. Vulcan also was somewhat xenophobic in this episode.
     
  15. HopefulRomantic

    HopefulRomantic chain mail is the new black Moderator

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    There was a terrible intestinal flu going around when Season 4 started filming, and Jolene was hit very hard by it. That's why she looks, well, ill, for the first several episodes.

    It's unfortunate that the episode wasn't a two-parter, which would have allowed for a more well-rounded treatment of Archer's self-hatred and lingering guilt. I thought it was a great touch that he hated the idea of people thinking of him as a hero.

    More time might have allowed for more about the crew reacting to returning home (Trip and his family mourning Elizabeth, Hoshi recovering from her torture by the Xindi, Phlox and the Vulcans dealing with xenophobia, etc.). Maybe we would have heard about the steps taken to rescue the stranded Illyrians, or revisit the "North Star" planet. Alas, there's only so much you can cram into 42 minutes.

    In an earlier draft of the screenplay, there was a tag where Archer visited his father's grave. Little touches like that would have been sweet to see.
     
  16. miriel68

    miriel68 Lieutenant Commander Red Shirt

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    I think Bakula did the best of what the script offered him, but still, there was not time enough to develop his plot line enough.

    I disliked very much that Trip was so ready to go with T'Pol on Vulcan and that there was no mention of his family (I don't blame Tripe, of course :lol: but I do blame the script writers)
     
  17. commodore64

    commodore64 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Bingo. That really bothered me. I didn't think this episode delivered much other than: Archer got laid and Trip got his heart broken. Seems like both characters deserve more. T'Pol - in season 4 I had a hard time getting a read on her. I suspect Jolene did too.
     
  18. Jimmy Bob

    Jimmy Bob Commander Red Shirt

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    Augments Trilogy

    Whoa, Nelly! A three-parter! Two-parters suck! Three-parters for the win!

    Brent Spiner. Is. Awesome. :bolian:

    This was Brent Spiners most interesting and charming role. 7 years in TNG+4 films, and he brings his greatest in this three-parter – 18 years later from his first appearance as Data. Okay, your mileage may vary. I'm just saying this doctor Soong got more characterisation in this trilogy than Data in 16 years.

    Man, this is so... cool. It's a pretty self-contained story and thus it's quite easy to force other people to watch this.

    Our characters are more like observers in this story. They just are there beside the main characters of this story – Soong and Malik. And the mid-chapter of this trilogy – Cold Station 12 – almost reached Azati Prime/Damage level of serious business.

    Perhaps there are some things that could have been better. I didn't like that all the augments died. Or the general judgement of last chapter "they're evil, because it's in their genes." I just don't agree. Genes are irrelevant. And while Soong was awesome, it was his last moment "Oh noes, so sad my childrenz died... oh godz why!!... Oh well. Hmm... artificial lifeforms. Yes. Will be a generational thing, but Data here you will be made!", that kinda ended this pretty awesome three-parter in a bit off-key manner. Methinks that was too fanwankery, as in fanwankery took over and consistent characterization went bye-bye.

    Now Orion slave girls... that's an inspired wankery. When I grow up I wanna buy myself also an Orion slave girl. God I can't believe it that Orion slave girls were never seen in TNG era. That's so many sad decades with no slave girls.
     
  19. Jimmy Bob

    Jimmy Bob Commander Red Shirt

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    Vulcan Saga

    Can this series get any better? Two three-parters twice in a row!? These three-parters have been amazing. I think Enterprise has found that magic balance in between telling an arced storyline and being Trekkianly episodic. These two three-parters have had more things happening in them, more touching character moments in them than some Trek seasons had in entire season. As much as I loved season 3 (one of the best Trek seasons ever), if these two three-parters give any inclination of what this season is like... then this could be the best Trek season of all times. This season has been so good that it's ridiculous.

    And this three-parter was even better than the last one. Outstanding. Simply marvelous. Brilliant. Genius. Inspired. Inspiring. And in this one the regular characters were much more involved personally in the storyline. Even regular guest characters. And it balanced so brilliantly between regulars like Archer and T'Pol, old-timer guests like Soval and Shran and new ones like T'Pau and T'Pol's mother.

    And I can't believe it was just 3 episodes ago when I last saw T'Pol's mother. And it all ties so tightly together. Makes sense. It's like... I'm speechless.

    We have a really personal story again for most of the characters that make Enterprise the show it is.

    And perhaps it's just me, but it seems to me that the crew has really matured. Although Trip tried to use the same trick again, it just felt like they had much more understanding and experience.

    Archer: "Let me guess: with the originals lost, whatever is left is open to interpretation."
    T'Pol: "You find this amusing."
    Archer: "I find it familiar."

    Tell me about it. Surprisingly doesn't apply to just religion, but almost everything that's used to create a collective identity.

    I knew that vulcans had their own interpretation thingy. As an anti-authoritarian myself I appreciated this trilogy's message that status quo is most likely always wrong. But I'm so anti-authoritarian that methinks Starfleet of TNG era is also a bit wrong. But how close the syrianites were to the teachings of Surak? Is mild xenophobia (I'm so superior that I don't even bother to discriminate you) part of Surak's teachings? Like this episode said, there were countless of different cults running around and claiming to be the real thing. Perhaps it's the cult factor... cults often might have a few decent ideas, but the cultness really distorts it. Personally I liked the guys in Fusion, they were vulcans with whom you could get stoned. I mean, a stoned vulcan – you haven't lived if you haven't talked with a stoned vulcan. But that's just me. I'm not sure even Surak undiluted is the absolute spiritual truth to follow. Kinda gives me a Mohammed vibe. Or Joseph Smith. Or Moses. Or any other prophet-based religion. I prefer my faith to be non-prophet based. Prophets are all great and that, but when they start to get ideas about controlling you or making you part of their flock... I've got issues with prophets, and all that systematic theological practice that is based on random things they did. "Oh this is where Surak pissed. I am enlightened now." So I'm not really a Surak fanboy. I prefer slutty stoned vulcans. You can be slutty and do drugs without getting too emotional, can't you? I'm just thinking out loud here. Writing. Loud? Writing random thoughts that come to my head... yeah I guess that's the way to describe it. I'm not thinking actually slutty and stoned... just a certain hedonistic quality. But then again, it is all about interpretation. Going back to the actual thing can of course help do away with some unnecessary things... but even the original thing needs interprating and stuff, and I'm not so sure that I'd want people like T'Pau to interpret those things for me. Sure she was relatively okay, but all that self-righteous cult mindset...

    Then again religions have always changed. They are always integrating new things into them. Sufism. Tibetan buddhism. Gay-loving episcopalianism. These are rather evolved from their crazy fanatic roots. In a way, sometimes the "back to the roots" movements are quite dangerous. Depends on what they mean by those roots.

    But the status quo was of course clearly evil. Status quo needs always to be questioned. All that crazy control politics. It's really amazing how Enterprise has really humanized vulcans. So many different idealogies, behaviors, personal ideas about right and wrong... I'm not saying anything exactly, but usually aliens have always been too dictated by their mainstream culture, so to have this level of complexity shown in alien cultures after so many years. It's great. What more can I say. Wonderful. Brilliant. Creating this "it's all coming together" effect I really love.

    Characters really start to die like flies now. Poor Admiral.
     
  20. You_Guyz

    You_Guyz Commander

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    You really need to split those big blocks of text into paragraphs.
    I agree though that the Vulcan saga was just pure awesome trek.