Excelsior Technical Manual (Third Time's The Charm?)

[yotsuya]

And, IIRC, the device up there that's the rough analog of the refit Connie's magnatomic amplification Crystal was the top cockpit canopy piece off Darth Vader's TIE fighter. Or, at least, it looks a hell of a lot like it.

Yes, it is the cockpit canopy from the MPC kit of Darth Vader's Tie Fighter and is 1 1/2 inches in diameter. Also, on the original nacelles (before Generations) they are not positioned the same. You will not see that reflected in my drawings. It is one of the oddities I fixed (there were very few but no real way to represent them without driving myself crazy).

 

[Praetor]

I just realized I forgot to emote the kidding tone in the first part of my statement, ahh! Apologies if I came off too strong!

It's your project, so define it as you will. I just wanted to have a little more interesting of a solution than just hiding them behind the leading edge. Excelsior was a prototype in many ways, so if I'm writing my own guesses on it, might as well make that an interesting new take on the tech that never caught on, either.

I figured that blue top was the same construct as whatever flanks the Refit Enterprise warp nacelles. One plan calls this structure a Thermal regulator system, so I guess it makes sense. Excelsior is using a bigger version of a technology introduced in the 2270 refit a little over a decade prior. Whatever this is eventually morphs into the surround system used in Ambassador/Galaxy successive designs, probably replacing the bussard collector system I described above.

No worries at all! I wasn't offended.

I think having bussards lining the grill is an equally valid solution as any, and certainly has the virtue of being unique. Like I was alluding to earlier, the hardest part for me is to reconcile TOS > Movie > TNG engine structures. I feel like these are the main three groups that are just, well, different.

I have never given any thought to what the structures are on the top of the nacelles (other than the dome which I assume is the same as the Refit Enterprise dome in much the same location). I think it must run hotter so they left that section uncovered for cooling.

That's a good point about the location of the dome and being analogous to the crystal dome, I hadn't thought of that.

Yes, it is the cockpit canopy from the MPC kit of Darth Vader's Tie Fighter and is 1 1/2 inches in diameter. Also, on the original nacelles (before Generations) they are not positioned the same. You will not see that reflected in my drawings. It is one of the oddities I fixed (there were very few but no real way to represent them without driving myself crazy).

That's interesting, I didn't realize the domes moved between Excelsior and Enterprise-B.

Not much progress to report today, as I have been sick and preoccupied with work the last few days. But, I hope to have more soon. As an interesting manifestation of my obsessive compulsive disorder (and desire for symmetry) most of the shapes that have been used here are basic polygons that i have pushed and pulled into the shapes that I've needed. Because I'm nuts.

Stay tuned!

 

[Norsehound]

Like I was alluding to earlier, the hardest part for me is to reconcile TOS > Movie > TNG engine structures. I feel like these are the main three groups that are just, well, different.

TMP has more commonality with TNG, in my opinion. Seems like whatever advancements made in TMP in terms of buzzard caps was reversed to an advanced TOS model when the Ambassador and her contemporaries were developed. The Thermal Regulators were introduced in TMP and were evidently retained in virtually every nacelle model since (excepting the marker-pen engines on the Wolf 359 forces). TOS nacelles either didn't have this requirement, or it was a technology developed for faster speeds.

Still the TMP model nacelles must have been good enough to retain in service for a long time, since Mirandas and even the Sydney class has very long service time with virtually their original nacelles. We see some blue lit models out of the CG reconstructions, but I don't think they have red christmas light bussards.

 

[yotsuya]

It's probably one of those cases where you have design A that is in use and then someone creates something better using a different method and you have Design B and then someone else comes along and sees a way to improve design A and makes design C. In Enterprise and TOS you have a round glowing bussard. In TMP era you have a black or gray grille. In TNG you have a more oval shape and back to glowing.

 

[yotsuya]

On the lower hanger....

While from a distance it looks like the opening goes below the hanger inside the opening, the closeup pictures show that it does not. The bottom of the space rises up and one of the ribs directly joins the bottom of the hanger piece. There is space to either side going back a short way, with ribs on both the inside and outside in back of the Formula 1 chassis that forms the majority of the part. Along with that, both side curve in so the space is a lot smaller than the volume of the ship at that point . A good thing since there are ports on either side and a phaser bank below that would not make sense if the opening went clear to the outter hull. When the model was converted for Generations, the lower hanger was removed, cut down, and reinserted moving it back and up. The part was moved as a unit so the shape of the open area and the position of the ribs and parts remains intact, but overall the part is moved back and up and the opening is smaller. One set of ribs had to be cut and redone (I detected they were cut and had an angled piece added). One chunk of greebeling was removed to accommodate it moving back. The top of the part is lit (indirectly by the florescents that light the ports on either side) giving the entire space the glowing appearance seen on screen.

From a deckplan perspective, this means that the hanger section is a narrow channel. But there are decks below it and the deck above would be the full width of the ship and there is room for narrow areas on either side leading to the ports on either side and possible other areas that narrow to near nothing in the stern.

 

[Praetor]

Welp, I"m not dead. Just slightly burned out.

Essentially starting over with the plans was more exhausting than I expected, which combined with work brought on a rather unanticipated and needed break. I'm hoping to get back into the swing of things this weekend, or this week at the very least. Stay tuned.

 

[NervousEnergy]

Looking forward to it man, don't overwork youself! <3

 

[Bernard Guignard]

Just take your time slow and easy wins this race

 

[F. King Daniel]

This is how I always imagined the engineering section of the USS Excelsior, as seen in 80's DC comics. I'm pretty sure that's an escalator in the lower left

 

[Norsehound]

One potentially awesome project by one of the incredibly awesome artists here would be to rationalize the 80s interior sets like that into something coherent that looks like it came out of the movies.

 

[Praetor]

Thank you folks. I really appreciate the moral support.

I'm pretty sure I have some of those comic issues stored someplace. Those tubes are so... Jack Kirby.

 

[Norsehound]

Thank you folks. I really appreciate the moral support.

I'm pretty sure I have some of those comic issues stored someplace. Those tubes are so... Jack Kirby.

I'm imagining the vertical tube as a thicker TMP-era warp core done vertically for some reason. Maybe not necessarily a shaft to the warp nacelles, could be experiments with a new warp control system by having a vertical intermix shaft.

I'm supportive of re-interpreting the comic depictions (after cleanup and re-rationalizing) because I kind of want to canonize those comics. Though they're sometimes weird, it's the closest to a TMP-era TV series we're ever going to get.

 

[DaveyNY]

This is how I always imagined the engineering section of the USS Excelsior, as seen in 80's DC comics. I'm pretty sure that's an escalator in the lower left

Now we know where JJ got the idea for very large, clear tubing in his Enterprise.

 

[DEWLine]

Tom Sutton was never one for sticking close to the series' technical design sense as a comics artist.

 

[Gary8]

Love this thread!

 

[F. King Daniel]

Now we know where JJ got the idea for very large, clear tubing in his Enterprise.

It's definitely the first thing I thought of when I saw huge open spaces with catwalks and machinery.

 

[Admiral Archer]

I've always wondered what the completed shot of the Excelsior's engine room looked like, and after reading this thread I edited together a quick super wide shot of what it might have looked like.

 

[Mark_Nguyen]

That's about as nondescript as an engine room can be. Just re-using the warp core prop from the Enterprise (whose full engineering set was not re-built for this movie), along with its railing and tech console, and slap some generic walls behind it with a couple greeblies. Unless this is one tiny corner of a much grander engineering space, no wonder Scott would have a problem with working in such a dull environment. :P

Thanks for doing that! I don't suppose the same would be possible with the Excelsior's bridge..?

Mark

 

[fireproof78]

Welp, I"m not dead. Just slightly burned out.

Essentially starting over with the plans was more exhausting than I expected, which combined with work brought on a rather unanticipated and needed break. I'm hoping to get back into the swing of things this weekend, or this week at the very least. Stay tuned.

Slow and steady wins the race. Rome wasn't built in a day.

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In all seriousness, this is a project of fun and hopefully it stays that way.

 

[Firebird]

Just re-using the warp core prop from the Enterprise (whose full engineering set was not re-built for this movie)

That's not correct. By 1983, the sets on stage 9 had been left standing since TWOK (possibly even TMP, but I haven't found evidence for that). As I've detailed elsewhere on the board, the standing Enterprise sets were reused and redressed heavily in Star Trek III and later IV. Roddenberry's intro to the 1986 release of The Cage, filmed at Stage 9 shows the Engineering set completely intact, though it hadn't been used in the production of TVH at all.