Excelsior Technical Manual (Third Time's The Charm?)

[Tomalak]

That's not correct. By 1983, the sets on stage 9 had been left standing since TWOK (possibly even TMP, but I haven't found evidence for that). As I've detailed elsewhere on the board, the standing Enterprise sets were reused and redressed heavily in Star Trek III and later IV. Roddenberry's intro to the 1986 release of The Cage, filmed at Stage 9 shows the Engineering set completely intact, though it hadn't been used in the production of TVH at all.

Indeed. The sets were left standing from 1977's Phase II work until they were modified for TNG nearly a decade later. I find this extraordinary - didn't Paramount need the stages for other productions? Perhaps they decided with the continuing Star Trek film series that they'd need to store the sets somewhere.

 

[Mark_Nguyen]

You’re right, I should have typed “re-used”. What this means though is that they would have had to remove some wall segments and move them around to make space for the walls we do see. There may be some forced perspective at work (was that console REALLY that big when we saw it in TMP?) but those rear walls look further away than any existing walls were in the actual set.

Mark

 

[danellis]

Indeed. The sets were left standing from 1977's Phase II work until they were modified for TNG nearly a decade later. I find this extraordinary - didn't Paramount need the stages for other productions? Perhaps they decided with the continuing Star Trek film series that they'd need to store the sets somewhere.

Phase II into TMP was essentially one drawn-out process, so sets would've remained standing once they were up. Memory Alpha says that Rodenberry was asked to submit an STII script in early 1980, so I guess it's reasonable to assume that Paramount knew they were going to want do something with the sets before they would've been struck at the end of TMP. Two rolled into Three, rolled into Four, Rolled into TNG, rolled into Voyager, rolled into Nemesis before the sets were finally struck (presumably) in 2002 or 3.

dJE

 

[ATimson]

Two rolled into Three, rolled into Four, Rolled into TNG, rolled into Voyager, rolled into Nemesis before the sets were finally struck (presumably) in 2002 or 3.

Were they really rolled into Nemesis? Sickbay is the only Voyager set I remember them using for the Enterprise-E, and Nemesis's sickbay was a new set instead of redressing the Voyager one.

 

[danellis]

Were they really rolled into Nemesis? Sickbay is the only Voyager set I remember them using for the Enterprise-E, and Nemesis's sickbay was a new set instead of redressing the Voyager one.

I would need to do more research than I'm prepared to do (at least for now) to answer that. I'd thought engineering was featured in Nemesis, and had similarly assumed that bridge was rebuilt on bridge.

dJE

 

[Mytran]

The TMP sets occupied the same soundstage at TNG, which became VOY. The Enterprise-E sets were built in 1996, at which point VOY was in it's third season, so the Ent-E corridors and Engine Room were definitely not built over them!

 

[ATimson]

I would need to do more research than I'm prepared to do (at least for now) to answer that. I'd thought engineering was featured in Nemesis, and had similarly assumed that bridge was rebuilt on bridge.

Engineering was a new build on stage 14 for First Contact. Memory Alpha says the bridge was a new build on stage 15; they don't cite a source, but that seems more likely than it being a redress.

 

[Mytran]

This website is helpful
http://pat.suwalski.net/film/trek-stages/

 

[Tomalak]

Yeah the Enterprise-E sets were standalone as Voyager was running simultaneously.

This, incidentally, was one of the considerations for destroying the Enterprise-D in Generations - the soundstages were needed for the new series, which would have meant rebuilding TNG sets elsewhere for each film. It was just easier to have a new ship.

Back to those soundstages - the legacy Phase II sets, which I believe were elements of the corridors, engineering and transporter room, were finally struck when Voyager wrapped as Enterprise needed a fresh start.

Nemesis wasn't really affected, except, for the sickbay set as mentioned above. Did we see the transporter room in Nemesis? Insurrection redressed loads of Voyager sets - for Picard's quarters, Troi's office, the library and the transporter room.

 

[David cgc]

The turbolift alcoves on the E-E bridge were from TMP, so there's that much at least that made it to Nemesis.

It's odd. Engineering looks relatively intact in the behind-the-scenes material circa TVH (the "Cage" intro, and the GMA tour, IIRC), but TSFS certainly looks like it wasn't available. Aside from the bare-bones Excelsior engineering redress that seems to have been made from spare parts (I think the console looks bigger because the railing is hooking around it), when Scotty's on the comm at the beginning of the film, he's just standing in front of some rented props in a super-tight shot.

 

[Tomalak]

The turbolift alcoves on the E-E bridge were from TMP, so there's that much at least that made it to Nemesis.

You're right! That's cool.

It's odd. Engineering looks relatively intact in the behind-the-scenes material circa TVH (the "Cage" intro, and the GMA tour, IIRC), but TSFS certainly looks like it wasn't available. Aside from the bare-bones Excelsior engineering redress that seems to have been made from spare parts (I think the console looks bigger because the railing is hooking around it), when Scotty's on the comm at the beginning of the film, he's just standing in front of some rented props in a super-tight shot.

I think that was more down to the expense of lighting and prepping the set than unavailability - for a ten second shot of Scotty there was no need to use the full set. Again, the Excelsior shot was just for a short scene with Scotty and Styles before Scotty gets into a turbolift.

 

[danellis]

Engineering was a new build on stage 14 for First Contact. Memory Alpha says the bridge was a new build on stage 15; they don't cite a source, but that seems more likely than it being a redress.

I stand corrected, thank you.

dJE

 

[Maurice]

Just to clarify: since the Star Trek [Phase] II sets were standing sets built for an extended TV run they would not have been built to be folded up and put into the scenery dock, and all the overhead rigging was already also set up, and would have to be taken down and then rebuilt if/when the sets went up again, so unless Paramount really needed the stage for another production, there was no compelling reason to try to dismantle them. The fact that the sets were left standing indicates that Paramount had every intention of doing something else with Star Trek after TMP.

 

[yotsuya]

Any updates? My project has been dormant as I try to decide now to do the warp core in the cross section.

 

[calamity_si]

Sorry I don't mean to necropost, but...yoysuya has provided me with some amazing screen accurate plans of all the three main Excelsior variants and I've begun work on creating a new 3D model of her. So , if any renders of the model when she's finished would be useful, if be happy to contribute them towards this project. I'd love to apply the amazing text here to a book similar in style to the Haynes Starship manuals.

 

[Bernard Guignard]

Sorry I don't mean to necropost, but...Mark Breuer has provided me with some amazing screen accurate plans of all the three main Excelsior variants and I've begun work on creating a new 3D model of her. So , if any renders of the model when she's finished would be useful, if be happy to contribute them towards this project. I'd love to apply the amazing text here to a book similar in style to the Haynes Starship manuals.

I would like to see those

 

[137th Gebirg]

Hell yeah!

 

[calamity_si]

It's a long and painful process tbh. I'm going back to my old model and remaking it according to the plans that yotsuya sent, which are AMAZING! The main issue for me is the secondary hull, especially getting the curve and angle of it right.

 

[yotsuya]

I did my best in two dimensions to get the grid and ports to fit on the curves. Right now I'm working on figuring out the engineering for the Excelsior class. I've had to go back to TOS to figure out the TMP configuration (we have some nice details, but there are gaps). I think I'm close. I think the Excelsior would edge toward the TNG design. When I have that I'll get the cross sections finished. I prefer to follow the official lengths (947, 1000, and 1531) and I've figured out how to make them work with decks that align to the ports (there are more cases than the Excelsior secondary hull ports that don't line up well and they aren't going to align no matter how big you make the ships). When I'm done, I'll share them with everyone.

 

[calamity_si]

Ok so one thing I've always wondered about this ship; are there officially any phaser turrets placed anywhere on ship, other than the saucer section? I know that the Lakota shot beams out of some very strange places, but other than that, I'm pretty sure that the only 'proper' turrets are on the saucer section. If that is the case, wouldn't there be issues with a total arc of fire?