Dune Part 2 2023 (24, 25, 26...)

[Starbreaker]

The book is too complicated and there's several characters left over from the Butlerian Jihad. The main character of Sisterhood of Dune in my opinion is still Vorian Atreides, trying to rescue his family from a slavery operation. The names of the BH&KJA novels never really match with what's going on in the books.

 

[The Nth Doctor]

I don't have any preconceived notions about the non-Frank Herbert books but I've only ever heard criticism about them, the most damning one being (as already stated here) that they miss the point of Frank's novels. They've all sounded terrible so hopefully the series only takes whatever good parts are available and develop into its own thing. I am curious about the origins of the Bene Gesserit so the basic premise is sound.

 

[wayoung]

I don't have any preconceived notions about the non-Frank Herbert books but I've only ever heard criticism about them, the most damning one being (as already stated here) that they miss the point of Frank's novels. They've all sounded terrible so hopefully the series only takes whatever good parts are available and develop into its own thing. I am curious about the origins of the Bene Gesserit so the basic premise is sound.

Paul Muad'dib Atreides runs away from home to join the space circus

 

[The Wormhole]

I usually find entertainment value in most of the Brian Herbert and Kevin J Anderson novels and let's be honest, Frank Herbert wasn't exactly cracking out masterpieces by the end either. I will say, BH and KJA really could have toned down the graphic violence in their books. I'm not squeamish about that sort of thing, but I also don't need to read about someone soiling themselves just before each individual limb is removed with detailed descriptions of the puddle all the blood and other bodily fluids are forming. It's okay to leave some things to the imagination.

The names of the BH&KJA novels never really match with what's going on in the books.

Which reminds me, I've always felt The Butlerian Jihad and The Machine Crusade should have their titles swapped, as the novel titled The Butlerian Jihad focuses more on the Thinking Machines and their domination over humanity while the novel titled The Machine Crusade is more about humanity fighting back against them. But I understand the marketing logic in having the first book in this trilogy titled The Butlerian Jihad since that's a term people will recognize from the original Dune novel.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

The Butlerian Jihad/Machine Crusade in the BH&KJA novels is not similar to what Frank Herbert had in mind. He imagined the mass of humanity enslaved and enfeebled by their reliance on machines, which a small number of people controlled, so that the race stagnated and was in danger of extinction. It wasn't about a viciously deranged AI trying to take over.

 

[DigificWriter]

And that's ok and if it led to you reading the original novels all the better. But do you honestly think these novels are on the same level as the original ones by Frank Herbert?

I'm not knocking them completely - i only ever read the House books and started on the Butlerian Jihad novel but especially the House novels lacked the finesse of the Frank novels. They just took some details of the original story such as how Gurney Halleck got his scar or why Barin Harkonnen was so fat and crafted something around it. You can read them on the train or if you don't want to tax your brain too much but ultimately it's not these books or books at that level that will be read decades from now and turn into classics.

If they were needed is up for debate and anyone has to decide for themselves but personally for me it was just a cash grab to make some more money off the Dune IP.

I can't make any comparisons because on my first attempt to read the OG Dune novel, I was thrown off by the change in writing style and narrative perspective from the Legends and Prelude novels and haven't had occasion to revisit the OG book now that I'm familiar with its story (a consequence of the fact that I'm not reading nearly as much as I used to).

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

I'm glad that Denis Villeneuve is involved in some way in the series as I believe he groks Frank Herbert's intentions, while neither Brian Herber nor KJA seem to. The fact that Emily Watson and Shirley Henderson are playing lead characters also makes me more interested in watching the series.

 

[The Nth Doctor]

Paul Muad'dib Atreides runs away from home to join the space circus

Yeah, I had heard about that particular bit of stupidity.

 

[fireproof78]

I don't have any preconceived notions about the non-Frank Herbert books but I've only ever heard criticism about them, the most damning one being (as already stated here) that they miss the point of Frank's novels. They've all sounded terrible so hopefully the series only takes whatever good parts are available and develop into its own thing. I am curious about the origins of the Bene Gesserit so the basic premise is sound.

Agreed. I may not agree with the choices of the non Frank Herbert books but I welcome more Dune content.

Yes, I know, it's heretical to enjoy more content, regardless of the silliness of it.

 

[Set Harth]

I didn't read any of the Pinky and the Brain books but from what I've read about them it seems they misunderstood or misrepresented the nature of the characters Daniel and Marty ( who in Frank's conception appear to be evolved Face Dancers ).

 

[Hartzilla2007]

I didn't read any of the Pinky and the Brain books but from what I've read about them it seems they misunderstood or misrepresented the nature of the characters Daniel and Marty ( who in Frank's conception appear to be evolved Face Dancers ).

Honestly some of the stuff made it sound like Honored Matres got their asses handed to them by a group descended from the Tleilax who went wild with genetic engineering not remnants of the Thinking Machines.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

I thought God Emperor of Dune made a fitting climax as it revealed the purpose of the Golden Path and resulted in the Scattering. The two books that Frank wrote after that were unnecessary IMO. BH&KJA's attempt to finish the series was ludicrously contrived from the synopses I've read and probably diverged from what Frank Herbert intended. But no-one else has access to his notes so it's a moot point.

 

[wayoung]

I thought God Emperor of Dune made a fitting climax as it revealed the purpose of the Golden Path and resulted in the Scattering. The two books that Frank wrote after that were unnecessary IMO. BH&KJA's attempt to finish the series was ludicrously contrived from the synopses I've read and probably diverged from what Frank Herbert intended. But no-one else has access to his notes so it's a moot point.

Actually, that's not entirely true. The first two chapters and outline for The Butlerian Jihad book Herbert had planned to write with McNelly when he got sick are available for public viewing as part of McNelly's donation to a university library, I can't recall which off the top of my head. They've also been scanned and uploaded online, although they are hard to find. Since THP did not want to pay McNelly the official Butlerian Jihad novels are purposely different than what had been planned.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

The Butlerian Jihad takes place a very long time before Chapterhouse though, which is what I'm referring to - basically how Daniel and Marty, the evolved Face Dancers and Honoured Matres stuff would play out. However, by the end of Chapterhouse, I wasn't that bothered about ever finding out and I'm still not.

 

[wayoung]

Dune Part 2 has taken Blade's Nov 3 slot. Which is weird to me because I'd have thought the US Thanksgiving is a better slot than Nov 3.

 

[fireproof78]

Dune Part 2 has taken Blade's Nov 3 slot. Which is weird to me because I'd have thought the US Thanksgiving is a better slot than Nov 3.

Not as much any more. With so many different sales the weekend has a different feel, and usually not seeing people doing movies.

 

[The Nth Doctor]

Another reason for me to get excited about Sisterhood of Dune despite its source material: Indira Varma has joined the cast!

 

[Kai "the spy"]

Another reason for me to get excited about Sisterhood of Dune despite its source material: Indira Varma has joined the cast!

I wonder how she's gonna die this time.

 

[Asbo Zaprudder]

Another reason for me to get excited about Sisterhood of Dune despite its source material: Indira Varma has joined the cast!

I don't think a TV adaptation of a mediocre novel need itself be mediocre. Most of the TV adaptations of The Expanse novels were better than the source material - even though the same writers were involved. They took the chance to polish their own stories.

 

[The Nth Doctor]

I wonder how she's gonna die this time.

They keep killing Suzie.

I don't think a TV adaptation of a mediocre novel need itself be mediocre. Most of the TV adaptations of The Expanse novels were better than the source material - even though the same writers were involved. They took the chance to polish their own stories.

Oh, certainly. It's just not a good starting point in general. I definitely have high hopes that the show can improve upon the source material (and I say that as someone who has only heard about it and not actually read it).