Spoilers DS9: Sacraments of Fire by DRGIII Review Thread

[Mage]

I was a little weirded out by Kira thinking she felt sorry that Taran'atar was a non-beilever, that's not quite how I remember Kira. Cenn saying it a chapter or two earlier about Ro felt abrasive but in-character.

I took it as Kira thinking more about how it must feel to lose a faith you once had, since she knows the comfort she gets from it, as opposed to just being a non-believer in general. Whereas Cenn I couldn't definitely picture thinking to himself, "There must be something wrong with those people."

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I agree. Although Kira never really lost her faith in the Prophets, she was forbidden from actively taking part in that religion. She knows what the seperation feels like. Taran'Atar does too. She can understand that.
Cenn.... I like the guy, but he's clearly more of a zealot then he'd like to admit. Almost preventing people from challenging his beliefs. And people who don't want to be challenged, might be more uncertain than they'd like to admit.

 

[Enterpriserules]

I have been very disappointed that this was not followed up with in the books

SISKO
My life... my destiny... the
Prophets saved me, Kas -- I'm
their Emissary, and they still
have a great deal for me to do.
But first, there's a lot I have
to learn... things only the
Prophets can teach me.

To me the story seemed to be that Sisko would have a long history of being the Emissary when he returned and what he would learn from The Prophets would, I though, be used in the Ascendants story line. It also seemed that Sisko had earned the title of admiral when he came back. The man helped win the war and it's clear he's a "big picture" thinker. This would have allowed him to be on DS9 and also keep Kira, at that point as captain. But this could have even been something that could have happened in RBOE, he could have been made an admiral after the Borg invasion. Would make sense too, since he really has a tactical mind and that was an area of the galaxy that Ben knows better than anyone. To me, Sisko has been stripped of everything that made him stand apart from the other Captains. He's not the Emissary, even though he is "of Bajor" and he's become just another explorer. He's my favorite Captain and I miss that he's not set apart anymore either as The Emissary or as someone that is more of the admiral type.

 

[Tirius]

(...) It's what I've loved with the Voyager novels' slower pace, and I'd like to see more of a chance for the TNG and DS9 novels to get that opportunity.

I think this is a mistake with the DS9 books that there are so few of the original crew left on the station. (...)

I think these two are part of the same issue. I too must admit I've not warmed as much to Cenn and Blackmer as I did to Vaughn, Shar and the other "first" original cast. Slowing down the pace of the story should give us the chance to do just that, and have the newer characters establish themselves further. I loved the back-to-back narrative we had in the original Relaunch - with most books spanning a few weeks at most - which allowed us to get to know the new characters in their everyday lives as well as on duty. I recognized that style with Sacraments, which is why I'm so hoping for this to be a proper restart for the series.

 

[Enterpriserules]

(...) It's what I've loved with the Voyager novels' slower pace, and I'd like to see more of a chance for the TNG and DS9 novels to get that opportunity.

I think this is a mistake with the DS9 books that there are so few of the original crew left on the station. (...)

I think these two are part of the same issue. I too must admit I've not warmed as much to Cenn and Blackmer as I did to Vaughn, Shar and the other "first" original cast. Slowing down the pace of the story should give us the chance to do just that, and have the newer characters establish themselves further. I loved the back-to-back narrative we had in the original Relaunch - with most books spanning a few weeks at most - which allowed us to get to know the new characters in their everyday lives as well as on duty. I recognized that style with Sacraments, which is why I'm so hoping for this to be a proper restart for the series.

That is a good point and let us hope that can happen!

 

[flandry84]

Voted outstanding.
I totally loved this book as it made me realise how much I've missed DS9.Unlike some other posters here I've really taken to the new crew(Blackmer & Stinson...I have a very definite mental image of how they and the new station looks).Also glad to see Cenn finally getting to be more than just a cipher.
The set-up for new storylines and the resolution of old ones are IMHO very well done with the " part work" revelation being an a potential game changer.I cannot wait to see how this all plays out.

And yes....if the books were on a more regular schedule it would surely help establish the new milieu in the minds of more readers.

 

[ATimson]

And yes....if the books were on a more regular schedule it would surely help establish the new milieu in the minds of more readers.

Have the books ever been on a regular schedule?

Even if they were, I doubt we'd be seeing the same 4-6 books per year that we were during the series' start. I'd happily lose the "downtime" exploration in favor of narrative momentum now that we're only getting 1-2 books per year.

 

[flandry84]

Well it seemed like the publishers did make an effort to put out a string of books to help get the SD Perry relaunch off the ground some(gosh,years) ago now.
I Know that there are now a lot of corners in the Treklit universe and everyone has their favourites.It's hard to please everybody.

 

[Enterpriserules]

Had a great time talking to David about the book with Dan on Literary Treks.

 

[tomswift2002]

I just finished the book over the weekend, and I was really not that impressed with it (in the poll it just barely earned an Average rating from me). I kept finding that the constant recaps kept getting in the way and kept slowing down the pacing of the novel. There would be one scene where everything was going fine and the story was moving, but then it would go right into another scene that was full of recaps and caused the "brakes" to get slammed on on the pacing.

 

[Reanok]

I listened to the podcast it was nice to hear David George talking about Sacraments of fire and trying to tie up story arcs from Soul key and the ascendants story line and the up coming novel Ascendance. I'm looking forward to get the next book in December.

 

[Enterpriserules]

Thank you! He really had such a tough job to try and stitch all this together and makes something coherent and move the story forward in the "Current" timeline. I think it will be Ascendance that is the book we've truly been waiting for.

 

[BritishSeaPower]

I've got about 50 pages to go and I'm super conflicted about the book. On the one hand, all the characters are great, on point and It's awesome to see them all. On the other hand, it really feels like almost nothing has really happened. The few things that have are so few and far between, or are resolved rather quickly. There's more walking and talking down unremarkable corridors in this book than there was on the show! And much of it doesn't advance characters in a real way, it's mostly explaining why things happened.

Also, at this point I have to wonder what the point of Blackmer is. The constant need for approval despite doing a fairly terrible job in each book is pretty... odd. (And the forced conflict between Blackmer and Ro that was constantly brought up in R&D is almost entirely gone here.) I could also do without Cenn, though it seems like maybe he's finally going somewhere. I really don't have a connection to any of the crew members DRGIII introduced over the past few books and I find myself hurrying through their dialogue to get to Ro or Quark, or Chief O'Brien. (Who, if I'm not mistaken, had no actual dialogue in the book as yet.)

The first 250 pages of this book are the "missing" second half of R&D. Where R&D belabored the Keev storyline to a fault, Kira's storyline in this one disappears for fully 100 or so pages. I've certainly enjoyed it a lot more than R&D, and I've till got a little bit to go, but I'm really hoping Ascendance, free from recapping and with less strictures about it's placement, is a more complete and rounded story.

 

[DimesDan]

So I'm about a third of the way through, I'm not enjoying it and getting zero satisfaction from what is happening and put it aside. I may pick it up again, but to be honest, I doubt I will.

 

[20fridge]

I finished yesterday and was thoroughly puzzled, in a good way. The Endalla plot intrigues me, and as fascinating as the fallout from events on that moon is, I want to know if it really is

Spoiler: Endalla

part of whatever formed the Bajoran wormhole. If it is, what does that say about the Prophets?

Also, the 2377 plot was not what I was expecting. The tension between Kira's desire to change the past and whether she can/should is killing me. Part of me is dreading the outcome, art of me is hoping she can (and will) change things, and part of me wonders what the implications would be if she did.

I'm not sure what Odo's plotline has to do with everything else yet, but I trust DRGIII enough to wait and see.

I really enjoyed this one and it gave me a lot to think about. I'm dying to see what Ascendance will bring.

 

[Corran Horn]

And yes....if the books were on a more regular schedule it would surely help establish the new milieu in the minds of more readers.

Have the books ever been on a regular schedule?

Even if they were, I doubt we'd be seeing the same 4-6 books per year that we were during the series' start. I'd happily lose the "downtime" exploration in favor of narrative momentum now that we're only getting 1-2 books per year.

Well, years back Pocket used to do two new releases per month - not necessarily from the same series. That has definitely gone down.

 

[DS9Continuing]

I really don't have a connection to any of the crew members DRGIII introduced over the past few books and I find myself hurrying through their dialogue to get to Ro or Quark, or Chief O'Brien.

A lot of people seem to be feeling that way, and I suppose I have to say I am one of them. And I think the reason is the changed format of the series.

Under Marco's regime, the overarching stories took longer to play out. Each individual book had its own plotline but still contributed to a developing arc. The first 'season' of stories took 10 novels and four short stories to play out. That means that there is more time to spend with the characters and get to know them, so that we care more when the major plot finally kicks in in earnest.

Under Margaret's regime however, the format is different. The most recent two 'seasons' of stories have been only four books each. That gets a major storyline out there faster without waiting so long, but it also means less time to spend with the characters, which means we care less about them when shizz goes down.

It's also probably a function of where the characters and storylines are now. Back in the early days of the DS9-R, everybody was on the station or the Defiant. Yes, Sisko and Odo and O'Brien were all off having their adventures, but we didn't see them - we just focused on the station-bound characters. That means we got to know them better.

Now though, we focus on characters in many different locations. Ro on the station, Bashir on his secret S31 missions, Sisko on the Robinson, Dax on the Aventine, Nog on his illegal military rendition, Odo on his Hundred Hunt, Kira on her spiritual journey. If we keep following all those characters in their different locations (and they are the main characters, so I'm 90% okay with that), then it has the unfortunate side effect of not getting to know the supporting characters around them, because there simply isn't time.

.

 

[Enterpriserules]

^ It's what makes me wish they would not have made Sisko suddenly want to be an explorer and take away the Emissary role from him. I think it would go a long way to have his presence felt on the station, even if he was an admiral. The Dax story felt pretty natural and Bashir could always return one day, but Sisko not being there in a more permanent way is hard on the series. Plus, TNG, TOS and VOY all have their captains still. ENT is the only one where the characters are more split, yet even there some are with T'Pol and some are with Malcolm and Archer, well we knew he was destined to be the Federation president one day.

 

[TheUsualSuspect]

Under Marco's regime, the overarching stories took longer to play out. Each individual book had its own plotline but still contributed to a developing arc. The first 'season' of stories took 10 novels and four short stories to play out. That means that there is more time to spend with the characters and get to know them, so that we care more when the major plot finally kicks in in earnest.

That's a good observation. I remember how the development of Quark's and Ro's relationship, revelations about Shar's personal life, and issues between Vaughn and Tenmei unfolded at an almost leisurely pace over multiple novels. Even more plot-driven stories like Kira's attainting and the setup for the revelation about the "Conspiracy" parasites took some time before moving to center stage. In a way it was like the TV show - Jake and Nog's friendship, Garak's character, Sisko and Kasidy's relationship were gradually developed, often almost in the background, and only occasionally were the main focus of an episode. We do seem to have lost some of that slow (in a good way) development of characters in the post-Destiny novels.

In the case of Sacraments, I'm wondering if we're going to get a payoff for all of the story lines in Ascendance. It seems possible that the Odo story line or the Endalla moon revelation could turn out to be set up for major plots that will get picked up after Ascendance.

 

[Enterpriserules]

David did say in our interview that he is setting up treads for more DS9 past Ascendance if these books do sell well and they ask for more.

 

[DS9Continuing]

Had a great time talking to David about the book with Dan on Literary Treks.

Just finished off listening to this on the way to work this morning. I don't think there was anything that really surprised me, but it was nice to hear that David thinks the same way about these characters that I do. Every time he was talking about a certain character and their perceptions and the changes they've been through, I was nodding along thinking "That's exactly how I see that person too - how I've written them myself."

As I said, I'm glad that Major Cenn has been getting some development, and I liked that David described this in part as a 'Major Cenn novel.' I gave him quite a bit of development myself in my stories, precisely because as David says, he's the first officer now and a first officer character deserves more than this one has gotten so far.

Likewise with Candlewood - David says he's been around since Mission Gamma but has got no dedicated stories, but then he made him chief science officer. I wanted to explore how he got from a background nobody to a senior staff member, so I explored him fairly heavily in my own stories. Spoiler alert: he's gay, Jewish, kind of a clumsy dork and in an on-again-off-again relationship with Hetik the dabo boy.

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