Do you think Voyager wasted its potential?

[TheLobes]

Ive always been kind of interested in Voyager, because even though I think it was pretty poor, Ive always thought it had outstanding potential. I thought the characters and situation could have created a really great series, and IM always surprised just how much that potential was wasted, especially the relationship between Maquis and SF.

So I was wondering how people felt about Voyagers potential. Even if you think its the best trek, did you feel it wasted some of its initial potential, or do you think it fleshed everything out admirably?

 

[Nick M]

Even if you think its the best trek, did you feel it wasted some of its initial potential...

Yes

 

[froot]

This discussion has never happened before.

There could have been more Maquis/SF tension. Seasons 1 and 2 have more than most people remember, however.

In before a certain someone comes in here and talks about Romulans...

 

[Anwar]

I'm as infamous as Guy Gardener...

Anyways, VOY might have worked out better if they'd developed the Maquis more before the show. They were too under-developed to fulfill their role as foils to the Feds.

 

[C.E. Evans]

I think it depends on what was its intended goal. Was it to have a series with an isolated Starfleet crew in an uncharted part of the Galaxy or was it a series about a divided crew that had to learn to work together in order to survive?

 

[Anwar]

Yeah, Voy suffered from too much unrealistic expectations beforehand. If they just said it was going to be a new show about a Starfleet crew with no mentions of the Maquis or the Delta Quadrant, there may have less backlash because no one would've had any expectations to begin with.

 

[froot]

I'm as infamous as Guy Gardener.

Not for the same reasons, though.

I dunno. The bulk of "Caretaker" always gives me the impression they were going to make "The Tom Paris and Friends Show." I'm... glad they didn't do that (but I still like Paris, you Paris-haters! )

For reals, though... listen to Janeway's famous speech at the end of the pilot. That's what was meant to be the show. And that's pretty much what happened.

 

[lurok]

As a 'VOY-first Trek love' was never sure what potential was or whether wasted, as nothing to compare to. It undoubtedly wasted people (Kes, Tuvok) and over-exposed others (Seven, EMH in later series). Maquis I never cared about (even after watching DS9 later) and it made sense crew would got along. Even though drama 101 is conflict. That aside, was enough growth and development to keep me happy for 5 of 7 series. In retrospect though (post-nuBSG), I would have liked to have seen Ron Moore have more input...

 

[froot]

"We're alone... in an uncharted part of the galaxy. We have already made some friends here, and some enemies. We have no idea of the dangers we're going to face, but one thing is clear. Both crews are going to have to work together if we're to survive. That's why Commander Chakotay and I have agreed that this should be one crew. A Starfleet crew. And as the only Starfleet vessel assigned to the Delta Quadrant, we'll continue to follow our directive to seek out new worlds and explore space. But our primary goal is clear. Even at maximum speeds, it would take seventy five years to reach the Federation, but I'm not willing to settle for that. There's another entity like the Caretaker out there somewhere who has the ability to get us there a lot faster. We'll be looking for her, and we'll be looking for wormholes, spatial rifts, or new technologies to help us. Somewhere along this journey, we'll find a way back. Mister Paris, set a course for home."

There. There's the speech from "Caretaker." That's... the whole show. Right there. They worked together to survive, and looked for wormholes, spacial rifts, and new technologies to help them. They were one crew - a Starfleet crew. Somewhere along that journey, they found a way back.

The show ends on the line, "Set a course for home."

(They found that other Caretaker, and she was an ass, so that was sort of a dead end, I guess.)

 

[RyuRoots]

I'm as infamous as Guy Gardener...

Probably moreso, and with good reason.

As a 'VOY-first Trek love' was never sure what potential was or whether wasted, as nothing to compare to. It undoubtedly wasted people (Kes, Tuvok) and over-exposed others (Seven, EMH in later series). Maquis I never cared about (even after watching DS9 later) and it made sense crew would got along. Even though drama 101 is conflict. That aside, was enough growth and development to keep me happy for 5 of 7 series. In retrospect though (post-nuBSG), I would have liked to have seen Ron Moore have more input...

Even without comparing it to anything else, I thought there were just a lot of concepts in the show, as well as individual episodes, that were fumbled badly but had great ideas behind them.

I would've liked more Ron Moore, too. Survival Instinct was terrific, and Barge of the Dead was a lot better than I thought it'd be after hearing the premise. It's a shame he left. I think the last two seasons would've been improved with him as more of a presence on the show.

 

[Anwar]

Moore can't write an ending to save his life, and his own attempts at shows peter out after only 2 seasons (with the remainder not being worthwhile) at most.

He's good at balancing out guys like Braga who are good on big ideas but not on deeper characterizations, but on his own he's hardly a Godsend.

VOY suffered from conceptual problems, diva actors (or crappy actors), and too many unrealistic expectations.

 

[Navaros]

I think it depends on what was its intended goal. Was it to have a series with an isolated Starfleet crew in an uncharted part of the Galaxy or was it a series about a divided crew that had to learn to work together in order to survive?

According to VOY's official premise, it should have been about both of those things simultaneously.

As for the thread title question: I used to be adamant that VOY wasted its potential by abandoning its premise before the end of the first episode, but now I'm not so sure. If sticking to its premise means that they were going to make a soap-opera-in-space, like other (bad) modern (self-proclaimed) SciFi shows that featuring desperate crews try to do, then VOY is far better off for having abandoned its premise and ending up as it did instead.

On the other hand, I reject the idea that sticking to its premise means that VOY would have to be like other soap-opera-in-space shows. The episode "The Void" is a great example. That's just about the only episode of VOY that lives up to its potential, and it is a masterpiece. I'll never understand why they didn't make over 100 other episodes similar to "The Void" in the Voyager series. Voyager might have been the best SciFi series ever if they did so. At the very least, they could have extended "The Void's" premise over an entire season's worth of episodes, which would have made Voyager infinitely better.

Aside from all that, Voyager has tons of holodeck soap opera & malfunction episodes, and other similar unworthwhile filler. In those respects, Voyager is definitely wasted its potential regardless of premise-related issues.

 

[C.E. Evans]

I think it depends on what was its intended goal. Was it to have a series with an isolated Starfleet crew in an uncharted part of the Galaxy or was it a series about a divided crew that had to learn to work together in order to survive?

According to VOY's official premise, it should have been about both of those things simultaneously.

Then it accomplished that, I think.

 

[Jeri]

There's a lot to see and do in seven seasons of Voyager, and I've always felt it was more than plenty. So, I don't have this regret.

 

[Anwar]

Another show tried to use the premise of "The Void" as its premise, it was called Andromeda. Still think it's a good idea?

 

[lurok]

I like The Void. Recall as one of the most memorable/striking eps...

 

[SchwEnt]

I see a big part of the wasted potential in another way (aside from the creative/premise stuff mentioned).

There's a lot of technical and logistical waste.
I mean, many new shows need to assemble a presentation, a skilled cast and crew, sell the idea to a network, hope they'll go for it, pray that an audience tunes in, maybe the studio will pay for an initial run of a half dozen eps, maybe a half season. All the hard work just to get a pilot on-air and MAYBE some eps in the can and hope some suit doesn't yank the whole production after one or two airings. All this kind of stuff.

VOY was blessed with a built-in audience. A talented crew with experience already on-board. A network commitment to the series. Never mind a half-season trial, VOY had a good shot at seven years from the beginning. What other series has that chance at the get-go?

Huge HUGE advantages that any new series would be blessed to have. They had the money, the time, the network backing, the talent, the experience, the know-how. And what did they do with it all?

Now THAT'S a waste.

 

[Anwar]

Actually, being backed up like that was a cause of many of the shows problems. It was rushed into production before glaring conceptual problems could be addressed, the cast they ended up assembling needed reassessment, and being prominent meant it would suffer much more executive meddling than nearly all other sci-fi genre shows.

I could see the Void working out as a season arc, at most.

 

[Shatnertage]

I've weighed on this before, as has everyone else, I think. But here goes...

I'd have made a few tweaks, including liberal use of flashbacks to really establish characters and to get the action out of the DQ without having to use anomalies memory engram viruses. It would have been awesome to see slices of Tuvok earning Chakotay's trust, for example.

Basically I'd borrow a bunch of stuff from Lost. Maybe have them fight the Kazon for the first season, then join with them against someone else in the second season--shifting alliances.

And I think I'd change the whole premise from "Voyager is stuck in the Delta Quadrant" to "Voyager is trying to get home." I'd get them out of the DQ by the end of season 6, but have them on the wrong side of Romulan/Tholian/Breen space. Let them trick and talk and fight their way through.

It'd be a way of keeping things fresh all seven years. I'd also make much more extensive use of recurring characters, like they started to with Seska and Cullah.

On the whole, it's a good show that has some great episodes, but those are a few of the things that would have made it better, IMHO.

 

[exodus]

Ive always been kind of interested in Voyager, because even though I think it was pretty poor, Ive always thought it had outstanding potential. I thought the characters and situation could have created a really great series, and IM always surprised just how much that potential was wasted, especially the relationship between Maquis and SF.

So I was wondering how people felt about Voyagers potential. Even if you think its the best trek, did you feel it wasted some of its initial potential, or do you think it fleshed everything out admirably?

Maybe, but I'm not going to cry over spilt milk.
I enjoy Voyager for what it is and don't harp over the shoulda. woulda, coulda years later.
I enjoyed it enough to own it and that's all that matters too me.