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Didn't like the movie? How would YOU have made it?

response to OneBuckFilms: (starfleet/fed explanation)- Yeah, I would have to limit Garth's lecture to be quite short as I would want my prologue to be about the same length as the XI prologue. Better maybe to cut it and save it for later.

(Kirk)- So, I'll re-write this with Kirk as a Lt. fresh out of the academy(this is cannon, right?). He is exceptionally bright but is fresh and untested. His first assignment is USS Enterprise, under the command of Captain Pike (I know, not cannon). Here, we have a new, soon-to-be main character and one the audience has been introduced to. Kirk is nervous because Pike is a legend and it is an honor to serve under him. There is no real lecture, but maybe Pike remarks about his good performance at the academy and how he has high expectations for him.

*I'll rip-off WOK and say this is a training cruise for new graduates. For contrivance sake Scotty, Uhura, Sulu, Chekov, and McCoy are also fresh graduates posted to Enterprise. I'll make Scotty Lt. as well since he is such a genius and I want him to be chief engineer by the film's end and a Lt. Cmdr. Same with McCoy, he's a Lt. due to his civilian experience and by the end Lt. Cmdr. and Chief medical officer. Spock is Pike's XO and does not make captain at movie's end (Kirk will be) because of some reason I haven't figured out yet.

*Out of spacedock.- Everyone is at their stations preparing for departure. Let's say Kirk is at tactical ( "Obsession") and just before launching, Pike gets out of the captain's chair and tells Kirk to do the honors. Kirk, startled, clumsily seats himself in the Big Chair. Pike, "Take her out, Mr. Kirk." I know, more movie rip offs! I'll think of more later.

* I've only got two hours to make this movie happen! The rushing!*
 
response to OneBuckFilms: (starfleet/fed explanation)- Yeah, I would have to limit Garth's lecture to be quite short as I would want my prologue to be about the same length as the XI prologue. Better maybe to cut it and save it for later.

(Kirk)- So, I'll re-write this with Kirk as a Lt. fresh out of the academy(this is cannon, right?).
Just a minor correction... this isn't how the rank structure in Trek (which is primarily based upon the US Navy, but with elements taken from the "tall ships" era of the British Navy as well) works.

I'll ignore the enlisted ranks or "warrant officer" ranks because they don't relate to this particular topic... except to say that, Roddenberry's pronouncements aside, it was clearly established in TOS that there were junior enlisted personnel (usually referred to as "crewmen") and senior enlisted personnel (mostly represented by personnel referred to as "Chief"... which is sort of like saying "Sergeant" if you're talking ground forces) on the Enterprise.

For the OFFICER ranks, you basically have three categories:

1) Junior Officers
2) Command-grade Officers
3) Flag-grade Officers

Of course, before you hit category 1, you have to prove you're worth the investment, so we have one rank prior to any of those...

O-0 - "Cadet." Yes, academy cadets have already received a commission when appointed to the academy. That's how it happens today, and that's how it's always been treated relating to Starfleet.

JUNIOR OFFICER RANKS

O-1 - "Ensign." This is the rank which would be received by a junior officer upon graduation from the Academy. (NOT Lieutenant... )

O-2 - "Lieutenant Junior Grade" (LT JG). This is a promotion that happens pretty much automatically for any junior officer who does the job reasonably well, after two years of service.

O-3 - "Lieutenant". This is another "pretty much automatic" promotion which occurs at or shortly after the fourth year of service. If an officer doesn't receive this promotion, he (or she) might as well resign. At this level, you're first permitted to have direct supervisory responsibility over junior personnel. An "average" officer might level out at this rank and stay there for a significant period of time.

COMMAND-GRADE OFFICER RANKS

In order to be promoted to the "command-grade" ranks, it's necessary to return to the Academy for what's usually called the "Advanced Course." Think of it like graduate school. And like graduate school, you can't go for a "generalized degree," but have to choose a specialty.

In the case of Spock, he'd have returned for "Science Division Advanced Course," while Kirk would have returned for the "Command School Advanced Course," for example. Oh, and Chekov chose to attend the "Security" Advanced Course.

0-4 - "Lieutenant Commander." This is the first "primarily in charge of others" rank. Most department heads will hold this rank. Spock, McCoy, and Scott were all Lieutenant Commanders during the early part of Star Trek (the original, I mean). This promotion would normally happen between four and six years after promotion to O-3. A Lieutenant Commander will not normally be permitted to operate independently... not to "work without a net," in other words.

O-5 - "Commander." This is the next promotional step, obviously. While a Lieutenant Commander is almost never .. it would not be uncommon for a Commander to be given a significant, independent command. Spock was promoted to Commander after the first season of TOS, and Sisko was a commander initially on DS9. This is another 4-6 year cycle, typically, though it can last quite a bit longer, depending on "the needs of the service."

O-6 - "Captain." This is one of the more confusing ranks, because there are two meaning for the word... "Captain" is a rank, and it's also a "title," meaning the person in command of a vessel. So, Lieutenant Commander Worf, on DS9, was still "Captain" of the Defiant. We're not talking about the title here, we're talking about the RANK.

A captain need not be in independent command. Scott was promoted to Captain, and placed in charge of the Engineering division on Excelsior, after all. And I'm sure that there are plenty of adjutants at Starfleet HQ who hold the rank of Captain, and may never have held a "command position."

After "Captain," you might... if you're really good... be promoted to the next tier.

It is possible to hold the rank of Captain and hold the POSITION of "Fleet Captain," of course... and it would normally be a precursor to promotion to the next level:

FLAG-GRADE OFFICERS

In order to become a flag-grade officer, you once again have to return to school. In the US Army, this is Command and General Staff College, for instance.

There's quite a bit of debate about what the Flag-grade officer ranks in Trek are. It's not clearly established. We know that the ranks include "Commodore," "Rear Admiral," and "Admiral." I'll treat those as O-7, O-8, and O-9.

I presume that there are probably several "Fleet Admiral" positions (the equivalent of a four-star in US military terms), which would be "O-10." Each would be in charge of one of the major branches of Star Fleet. (How Starfleet is organized is also subject to debate, so I won't go into that here.)

And I'm assuming that there is a single "Admiral of the Star Fleet" (the equivalent of a five-star... and per US military terms, there can only be a single Five-star in each service at any given time). This one guy would be an O-11.

And there's noplace to go from there.

Sorry... just wanted to clarify all that.
 
This was problematic for XI and trek in general. It seems that all of the cadets in XI held the rank of Lt (O-3) and I didn't get the sense that these were field promotions either, but there actual ranks. At least Uhura, Kirk (yes, Kirk), and Sulu were clearly identified as such. I do not remember the rank insignia of McCoy. It could be, as you said, that these are "positions" rather then actual ranks, with them still being cadets, but I never got that vibe from the film.

On the other hand, junior ranks can be skipped over if I remember correctly: Didn't JFK receive a commission of Lt. JG upon graduation of the naval academy? And he was "captain" of PT-109, which was his position.

I really thought that Kirk was an O-3 upon graduation in TOS.

Thanks for the info. I was aware of the rank structures in the Navy/Army but i didn't know about the returning to school parts or the time intervals. That's the problem with an origins star trek movie: you have to do it within 2 hours but show rises in rank from cadet to captain within that time frame, which, if trying to adhere to the real time intervals you stated, would require massive cut scenes and rank jumps.
 
This was problematic for XI and trek in general. It seems that all of the cadets in XI held the rank of Lt (O-3) and I didn't get the sense that these were field promotions either, but there actual ranks. At least Uhura, Kirk (yes, Kirk), and Sulu were clearly identified as such. I do not remember the rank insignia of McCoy. It could be, as you said, that these are "positions" rather then actual ranks, with them still being cadets, but I never got that vibe from the film.
This is the big problem with people who've got no personal knowledge or experience with how the military works writing about the military. (And Starfleet IS a military organization. "Military" does not NECESSARILY mean the same thing as "combat-focused." There are many military jobs, and even one military service, which are absolutely non-combat-related even today. So, saying that Starfleet is "military" does not mean what some folks with no understanding of the military assume it means - ie, that Starfleet is about blowing up nurseries full of babies... :rolleyes: )
On the other hand, junior ranks can be skipped over if I remember correctly: Didn't JFK receive a commission of Lt. JG upon graduation of the naval academy? And he was "captain" of PT-109, which was his position.
Well, there are "field promotions," of course, and as always, there's "the needs of the service." I am not aware of JFK having "skipped ranks," so I can't deny that, but I certainly can't confirm it either and it seems a bit dubious to me.

There are also some obvious exceptions to these rules today, and presumably in Trek times as well. This is something that people old enough to remember "M.A.S.H." will understand even if they never served in the military, and also something that recent events down in my area (I'm about 30 minutes from Fort Hood) will be aware of as well.

Certain specialties... primarily medical and legal... get special "promotional privileges." I, personally, object to this... but this is how it works, like it or not. Our local "radical islamic terrorist psychologist" is a great example of this.

Now, I used the terms "O-1," and so forth, above for a reason. Every military service in the US has a slightly different rank structure, in terms of the NAMES of the levels... but the "rank levels" are consistent.

So, a naval Ensign is the same as an Army Second Lieutenant. A Naval Lieutenant JG is the same as an Army First Lieutenant. A Naval Lieutenant is the same as an Army Captain. A Naval Lieutenant Commander is the same as an Army Major. A Naval Commander is the same as an Army Lieutenant Colonel. And a Naval Captain is the same as an Army Colonel.

SO... in M.A.S.H, which used proper US Army ranks, we see civilian doctors immediate granted the rank of Captain (O-3), which is the same as Dr. McCoy, in Star Trek, being immediately granted the rank of Lieutenant. Of course, McCoy would not have been required to attend the Academy, any more than Hawkeye and Trapper John and B.J. Hunnicutt were required to attend West Point.

And, our local mad gunman was also brought in at the rank of Captain, due to his "specialty." (The one that didn't involve Al Qaeda, I mean.) He, much like the fictional Major Burns and Major Winchester, had simply served for several years and as a result had been "automatically promoted," essentially the same way that a 2nd Lieutenant is automatically promoted to 1st Lieutenant as a general rule.

This is supposed to serve as an incentive for these "highly skilled, highly trained" types to serve in the military versus civilian practice. They start at a pretty nice income, with a lot of unearned authority...

Anyway... back to your points...
I really thought that Kirk was an O-3 upon graduation in TOS.
That's a common misconception, based upon CORRECT lines from "Where No Man Has Gone Before" talking about Lieutenant Kirk teaching classes at the Academy. However... look over my description of the rank structure from above. His "teaching" would have occurred when he had returned for his "Command Course."

That, also, is when he would have taken the Kobayashi Maru test. ST-II got this right... LIEUTENANT Saavik, who had probably served on active duty for six years prior to this point, was back at the Academy, with a crew of Cadets. This is exactly the same situation Kirk would have been in. This would have occurred after his service on the U.S.S. Republic, and after his service on the U.S.S. Yorktown. And it would have been a MANDATORY PRECURSOR to his being given any real command authority.
 
Thanks. That really clears a few things up. I know that somewhere around this forum people were using Savik's rank of Lt. during the Kobayashi Maru test to support the idea of cadets being full lieutenants during their final years and upon immediate graduation thus giving more support to the "Kirk is a lieutenant and not a cadet" idea. Although, there is a screen cap posted in one thread that clearly shows Kirk as a Lt., along with Sulu in the falling/no transporter lock scene.
 
I'd have vampires, a clown as a serial killer, and starships that become giant-ass robots that beat the crap out of each other. A winning formula! :techman:
 
On the other hand, junior ranks can be skipped over if I remember correctly: Didn't JFK receive a commission of Lt. JG upon graduation of the naval academy? And he was "captain" of PT-109, which was his position.
Well, there are "field promotions," of course, and as always, there's "the needs of the service." I am not aware of JFK having "skipped ranks," so I can't deny that, but I certainly can't confirm it either and it seems a bit dubious to me.
Nutshell version: JFK never attended the Naval Academy; he was a Harvard grad who received an appointment as Ensign in the Naval Reserve. After the Pacific war broke out, he went through Reserve Officer Training School and MTB Squadron Training Center, was promoted to Lt.(j.g.) and assigned to a training squadron. He transferred to combat duty within three months.

http://www.history.navy.mil/faqs/faq60-2.htm
 
I liked the movie as it was.

I would have found a way to have both William Shatner and Leonard Nemoy in the movie. They used time travel to get Nemoy into the film, they could have done the same with Shatner.
 
For the record, I very much like the film and highly recommend it. But as far as Trek films go, it hovers around #4 or 5 for me.

Sulu: TOS same. If fencing is involved, uses actual fencing sword and not katana.

This gets me every time. Using a katana sword is still a form of fencing, specifically Kendo. It may not be the European martial art or the Olympic version, but it's fencing nonetheless.

In all honesty, I would have preferred an actual rapier or foil (Takei's got a great story about why he chose a foil over a samurai sword), but there's nothing wrong with the katana, either.

Anyway, back to the topic, I would have done without the slapstick moments as many others have said. I would have also tied up the pacing, too: while there's nary a boring moment in the film, at times there's almost too much going on. Also, too many conveniences that sort of shatter the suspension of disbelief in an ID4 sort of way.

And finally, Kirk not getting captaincy. I could see him being promoted straight to XO/First Officer, as a way of learning even more under Pike's tutelage. This ties in to one of my points above: the film seems to be rushing as opposed to using its time carefully. We the audience know what will ultimately happen to the crew (after all, that's the point of an origin story), but the writers seem to use that as an excuse to barrel through.

Lastly, a cameo of the E-E during Spock Prime's flashback. Why? I dunno, just cuz.
 
Normal fights with a katana don't last very long though, and really they don't "fence" with them in the Western style. I actually liked in the original series that Sulu was into a Western sport, which kind of breaks the stereotype of say a Japanese guy strictly adhering to his own culture and never going outside of it. Giving him a katana was kind of a stereotypical move if you ask me.
 
Giving him a katana was kind of a stereotypical move if you ask me.

Be that as it may (again, referencing Takei and his choice of a foil over a samurai sword), it bugs me when people don't consider Kendo as an actual form of fencing, which it truly is. Stereotype or not, there's still a misconception here. I get the same way when people say martial arts and boxing as if boxing itself isn't considered a martial art.
 
I don't see fighting with a gladius or a long sword as fencing either, really. And while I'm hardly an expert, from what I've heard most engagements with katanas are over in seconds unless both users are pretty skilled. The ideal being a quick draw that combines as a strike and returning the sword to its scabbard all in one smooth motion.
 
Anyone remember the poster here who cried about stereotyping and Roddenberry rolling in his grave because Sulu could take care of himself in a fight? Because him getting his ass kicked is much more P.C. :lol:

This thread could open up quite the flame war, especially from those that said the movie would be ruined completely if Gary Mitchell weren't in it (I remember one poster off hand who said exactly that.

"Damnit! This movie sucks! If I were making it, I'd have Gary Mitchell call Kirk a walking bookstack, then have 10 minutes of Kirk walking around with a stack of books! That's true Trek and brilliant moviemaking!"
 
On the other hand, junior ranks can be skipped over if I remember correctly: Didn't JFK receive a commission of Lt. JG upon graduation of the naval academy? And he was "captain" of PT-109, which was his position.
Well, there are "field promotions," of course, and as always, there's "the needs of the service." I am not aware of JFK having "skipped ranks," so I can't deny that, but I certainly can't confirm it either and it seems a bit dubious to me.

I don't recall where I'd heard it, but isn't there a provision that if a cadet already holds a university-level degree prior Academy graduation, then they graduate at O2?
 
The Sequel ;)

Next, a shot of Jim Kirk as an academy upperclassman... hard, unyielding, driven to the point of being a martinette. Several of his instructors are reviewing him, along with a few serving line officers. Among these are John Gill, Aaron Stone, and Kirk's academic advisor, Ben Finney. They agree to give him a starship assignment, but express concerns that he doesn't have the "flexibility" needed to serve in command. Captain Pike is present and argues that he sees something there, however.

Interesting. Ben Finney might point to the idea that Jim has no sense of humor. Perhaps commenting that he needs to loosen up a little.

Flash forward... and Lieutenant Kirk is returning to the Academy for his Command Course. Part of this involves teaching underclassmen at the academy (think "graduate assistant). This would permit some exposure as cameos for known characters (Sulu, Uhura) as his students, and we might see a young Pavel Chekov arriving for his first day aboard the same shuttle as Kirk. Kirk would see the Enterprise as they arrive, and would comment to the young recruit that there was nothing he wanted more than the command of a ship like the Enterprise.

I kind of like this. The origin of Kirk's love of command, and of the Enterprise we see later.

Kirk was assigned to this course on the recommendation of Captain Garrovick, immediately prior to his death. Kirk, who had mellowed over time, is tortured over this and is hardening again. He's become a "walking stack of books with legs."

I would imagine all of this academy material might start losing interest for some.

A few months pass, and Kirk is preparing to undergo one of the "Command School" tests... the Kobayashi Maru. Kirk would discuss this with his friend, senior underclassman Gary Mitchell, who would mention to Kirk that he needed to hook him up with this cute blonde lab technician he'd met, and that Kirk just needed to lighten up and accept that sometimes you just don't win... after all, "we're not gods, are we?" Kirk proves his skill by reprogramming the "respawn enemy vessels" mode of the simulation (which is what makes it unwinnable) to fail. Kirk fights through the scenario, and after defeating a three-to-one fight, is able to rescue the crew of the Maru. The ONLY thing Kirk did was remove the "cheat" from the program... no "smug asshole" tone from him like we got in this movie. Rather, we see him breaking his "by the book" pattern... and that's what gets him the commendation.

Good for the character, and nice easter-egg with Gary Mitchell.

Immediately after this is the "evaluation cruise." Kirk was bucking to get a cruise on the Enterprise, under Pike, but while some of the Academy staff approve of his "Kobayashi Maru" solution (even so much as managing to get him a commendation), a few are still hostile to him over that, and one of those is the one responsible for assigning ships for the cruise. Instead of getting assigned to the Enterprise, Kirk gets assigned to an old police cutter. The Academy "evaluator" on this particular ship is a very competent but very unpopular officer, the only Vulcan in Starfleet... Spock.

(At this point, we're about 1 hour into the movie, by the way.)

I don't see anything bad with the Academy scenes, but it seems a lot more focused on the Academy, which doesn't really mesh with the Adventure side.

During the cruise, Kirk and Spock "rub each other wrong," for reasons we can imagine from the TOS characters' personality traits. However, unlike in the new movie, they handle things in a very professional manner... the tension is actually stronger that way (think about how Kirk dealt with the ambassador in "The Galileo 7.")

Perhaps Kirk needs a sounding board of sorts, so the audience can get a better picture of Kirk's frustrations?

During the cruise, this ship (let's call it the "Peregrin") receives a distress signal from a civilian vessel. Kirk recognizes the interference patterns in the distress signal, just before losing the signal, as being what he'd seen when his father died. He and Spock come into conflict over how to handle the situation... "by the book" or "by my guts." Kirk, who's usually thought of as being "by the book," instead is reacting purely "by my gut."

This could be good.

The Peregrine arrives, and is hit by the same "event" that has struck the civilian vessel... resulting in the bridge of the Peregrin being destroyed, killing the senior officers and leaving Kirk and Spock as the two most senior officers aboard. Kirk prevails, but not without ongoing opposition, as he's the "command school" officer (while Spock thinks that he's the logical choice).

More command decision conflicts with Spock.

The Peregrine, itself damaged, now has to deal with rescuing the civilian ship, a massive passenger liner, and saving itself as well.

Arriving aboard the liner, they encounter the ship's civilian engineer, a former starfleet officer named Montgomery Scott. They also find a disillusioned civilian doctor, on his way off-planet after a particularly ugly divorce, named Leonard McCoy, helping to deal with casualties.

Cool. I like this intro.

The technical details don't matter... suffice it to say that Kirk's command skills, Spock's logic and analytical capabilities, and Scott's technical talents combine to save the personnel aboard both vessels, while McCoy and Kirk bond, Kirk and Spock develop a strong mutual respect, and Scott becomes known to Kirk as a "miracle worker."

Can't argue with that.

At the end, Kirk is granted a position as first officer of the USS Alexander, a destroyer-class ship... and Scott decides to rejoin Starfleet, asking if Kirk thinks the Alexander could use an old engineer... and McCoy realizes that Starfleet (and men like those he'd just met) could give his life meaning again.

I like this, but McCoy is not really as involved with Kirk and Spock as he should be. The audience has barely met him.

As Kirk is preparing to report to the Alexander, he encounters Spock, who is preparing to return to his assignment aboard the Enterprise, under Captain Pike. There is a "warm" moment between them.

I would have though they would be cordial, with Kirk barely holding back from hitting him. Perhaps that changes with Spock acknowledgeing Kirk's style of command shows that Logic alone is not enough.

During the final scene, we see the Alexander leaving orbit, and Kirk is making a log entry. The Alexander flies past the Enterprise on the way, as Kirk talks about his optimism about the future ahead of him.

I love the romance of that, and the score would play the TOS fanfare as the camera lingers on the Enterprise for a moment.

THAT is the movie I would have made. No "villain." No tossing out history (but no slavish "fanboy moments" either). Different design work, because we'd be seeing different ships... but we'd see the familiar designs as well. No "everything happens at one moment and stays that way forever after, amen."

The next movie could be about Kirk taking command of the Enterprise. We'd have Kirk, Spock, Scott, and Sulu from the original characters... plus Gary Mitchell.

If there was a third movie, we'd have the entire TOS "crew" present, serving on the TOS (ish) Enterprise, at some point between WNMHGB and the beginning of Season 1. (Chekov might be there, but not as a bridge crew member.)
[/QUOTE]

As a Star Trek fan, I like a lot of what you've done here, but there are some things that jump out at me:
- There seems to be a lot of Academy material, which is not really where Star Trek should focus, IMHO.
- It assumes 3 films, which may not be a given.
- Dr. McCoy and Scotty are grossly short-changed in their introductions, and we see little to tell us that Dr. MCoy and Kirk would be long-term friends later.
- The Enterprise is also a BIG part of TOS, and is underrepresented here. A general audience will want to see how the crew of the ENTERPRISE gets together, and that implicitly means the ENTERPRISE should be a much bigger part of the movie.
- The threat would probably need more prominence and definition, and really doesn't drive enough of the plot for audiences to care about. It is simply there.
- Spock probably needs a journey for the film beyond arguing with Kirk. They should learn something about each other, and bond in the process to become the friends we see later.

Taking Spock as a tutor, perhaps he's the one who recommends to the powers that be that Kirk be in command?

After the arguments between him and Kirk, which could get rather heated (on Kirk's end), and a hint of deepening respect, might raise eyebrows both on and off screen.

Spock's cold logic here could be played a little too cold, and we need a hint of something personal for him, and something to show the audience who HE is, beyond the cold, emotionless foil for James Kirk's wild plans.

On the other hand, there are some great opportunities with regards to Gary Mitchell, and with something more defined, meeting the Blonde Lab Technician in the movie might work to get more information about Kirk's feelings and thoughts, and could be used to illustrate his womanizing side, and his charm, which is a little bit lacking here.
 
As a Star Trek fan, I like a lot of what you've done here, but there are some things that jump out at me:
- There seems to be a lot of Academy material, which is not really where Star Trek should focus, IMHO.
Well, I'd equate that to what was done in "Batman Begins," for example. How long was it before we saw Bruce Wayne in the batsuit? And yet, I think this worked much better.

The story I see is primarily a Kirk/Spock film, with two major supporting characters. Too many characters with major roles in a 2-hour movie and, inevitably, you either dilute the story or you underserve the characters.

So I focus, almost exclusively, on Kirk and Spock, and merely "introduce" other characters. I try to give them introductions that the audience will like, without seeming "pandering." But Kirk and Spock, they need a lot of depth here, as the heart of the movie is really about the two of them.

The the "childhood" stuff would run for a bit longer than we saw in ST'09 (roughly the same as if they hadn't removed the deleted scenes, really). The Academy stuff would run roughly twice as long as what we saw in ST'09, but we'd lose the "hangar scenes" and so forth, so we're probably really only talking something like 150% of the ST'09 "Academy screen time" shots. My main purpose was to make these scenes more "personal" in nature... more about the characters than I felt that they were in this film. This is because I really, truly believe that the character development in this film was its major failing. I really didn't find myself caring about these characters... and considering that I DO care about the characters I've know for all 44 years of my life, well, that's actually a fairly significant thing to say.
- It assumes 3 films, which may not be a given.
No, not really. It's just my desire to treat the situation as something more realistic. I HATE the idea that everything from TOS sort of "falls into place" in the space of a few hours, and then stays that way forever after. REAL LIFE is all about change and growth. I specifically structured things as I did to emphasize that everything doesn't magically happen all at once.

Star Trek, ultimately, is about people and about ideas. "The Human Adventure" and all that. That may seem pretentious to some folks, but to me, well, that why I love Star Trek, and that's what I miss when it's absent.

So, I wanted to make it more about people, and for it to be about REAL people (or rather, people we can believe could be real), these people need to have lives that make sense. Change is a part of real life, and I want to see change occur in this venue as well. That makes it more real... and thus makes it easier to make myself "willingly suspend my disbelief" and become involved in what I'm watching.

The three movies I listed need not all be made, obviously. Each would have had a different, and largely independent, theme.

  • Kirk becomes the man we know
  • Kirk gets command of the Enterprise
  • The Adventures Begin...
To me, these really are different things - different events, different adventures - which would, in "real life," occur at different times.

Do we really need to have the second and third "events" covered in order for the first one to be relevant? Not at all? Do we really ned the first and third for the second to be relevant, or the first and second for the third to be relevant? Nope. I just think that the three should not have occurred simultaneously. That's not believable to me.
- Dr. McCoy and Scotty are grossly short-changed in their introductions, and we see little to tell us that Dr. MCoy and Kirk would be long-term friends later.
Well, obviously, I'm playing with ideas, not writing a script. I've never been very good at writing dialog, so I normally don't bother to try. There are lots of people who are very good at this (Roddenberry was an expert at it, for example), but I'm not among them.

I think that, halfway through the film, when the audience first sees Kirk leading a rescue party aboard the liner, and Kirk encounters the makeshift triage area... and then we see Urban walk in, covered with blood, with the "shellshocked but hard at work" thing Kelley did so well (and which was what made latter-day MASH shows so effective as well) would have been amazing. The audience would have had an introduction to McCoy that would have shown us his humanity... and passion for saving lives... in a way that the movie we actually got didn't so much as hint at.

In my outline, McCoy would be a constant participant in the plans to rescue everyone... because he'd be the one bringing up "and how do you propose that we get my three hundred unconscious wounded patients to climb six decks of ladders, you green-blooded hobgoblin!" and so forth.

Meanwhile, Scotty would also be a major participant, as he would be the only reason that the liner was still in one piece. And I'm certain that he would be the one to come up with the technical recommendation on how to use resources from both wrecks to allow everyone to survive. He'd be a major player. I just didn't bother to write the specifics...
- The Enterprise is also a BIG part of TOS, and is underrepresented here.
I hope you understand how much I LOVE the Enterprise... that is, the original ship, as seen on TOS. I don't leave it out lightly.

But, all that aside, the Enterprise is NOT a character. It's not. It's a "setting." It's a work of art. It's a machine. But it's not a character.

The Enterprise, under the command of Captain Scott Ferguson and first officer Mike Dubois, wouldn't be a central part of Star Trek as we know it. Any more than the house you may have grown up in is still "your house" if you've lived elsewhere for 20 years, and three other families have lived there after you did.

The Enterprise is significant for three reasons:

  • 1) It's the plot-device for TOS which explains how our characters get from adventure to adventure, and how they deal with each adventure.
  • 2) It's a distinctive visual design which, through what I consider to be some pretty masterful design, simultaneously brings to mind modern naval vessels and historical "tall ships," with all of the grace and beauty associated with them.
  • 3) It holds a special place in the heart of two major characters... Kirk and Scott, both of whom fall in love with the ship and, because we see the ship through their eyes, make us care about the Enterprise.
A general audience will want to see how the crew of the ENTERPRISE gets together, and that implicitly means the ENTERPRISE should be a much bigger part of the movie.
I disagree, almost entirely.

"General audiences" don't care one bit about the "Star Trek Family." They want exciting entertainment about characters who they can, in the course of a couple of hours of entertainment, come to relate to and empathize with. This is why "ensemble" movies usually don't do well. The audience can really only be made to empathize with one, two, or SOMETIMES, three characters in that period of time. The more characters you "focus on," the less "focus" any individual character will get, and the less the audience will be able to "connect" to that character.

It's mainly the Star Trek FANS who want to see "everyone all together at once," not the "general audiences." So, as I see it, what I've proposed actually would better meet the "wants" of the general audience. You may not agree, of course, but I do, and I did what I did intentionally, and for that very reason.

You focus on your lead characters, and treat your supporting characters as just that... supporting characters. I wanted two leads, two "major supporting characters," and a few minor roles which don't have to be, but easily COULD be (and thus ideally SHOULD be) names which have been established as parts of these characters' pasts.
- The threat would probably need more prominence and definition, and really doesn't drive enough of the plot for audiences to care about. It is simply there.
And again, I did that intentionally. The story should not have been about "beating the enemy," it should be about the experiences which our characters go through. In other words, I don't WANT the audience to care about the threat... I want them to care about the characters and how the characters deal with that threat. The threat, itself, is ultimately irrelevant... it's a Deus Ex Machina. It could be a plague. It could be an attack by some never-identified hostile force. It could be a spontaneous singularity formation. It could be ANYTHING... as long as it creates the situation where our characters are stranded, facing death of not only themselves but many many more civilians (I chose the liner because it would have a massive civilian population... people who had never made a choice to "put their lives on the line" and thus would be more impactful to the audience, even intangibly, if they were at risk (how many of US have been on a cruise ship at some point?)

I'm trying, really hard, to make this less about "a mustache-twirling bad-guy ties Dora Do-Right to the train tracks" and more about "what's going on inside the minds and hearts of our main characters?"
- Spock probably needs a journey for the film beyond arguing with Kirk. They should learn something about each other, and bond in the process to become the friends we see later.
Well, I agree... I just didn't outline that aspect of things, again.

I hinted at it by pointing out that Spock was widely recognized as being "highly competent" but was also very unpopular in Starfleet. The reason for this, and the beginning of his growth beyond that, would be his "personal journey" in this film. AND the basis of the strong Kirk/Spock relationship we see throughout the entire series. Kirk is the first person to really drive home to Spock that there are ways of viewing the universe other than "pure logic." Although we know that, prior to this point, Spock (under Pike) had been more emotionally open, that could be a matter of his simply being less controlled, not of having made a conscious choice to be open to "outside of the box" solutions. Kirk, after all, is the one who taught Spock the advantages of Poker over Chess, remember. Maybe this movie would show us where this begins?
Taking Spock as a tutor, perhaps he's the one who recommends to the powers that be that Kirk be in command?
Well, I can see Spock recommending Kirk to Chris Pike (in the previously mentioned hypothetical second film)... and Pike being surprised (and pleased) at this recommendation. Kirk would not remember having met Pike (at the age of 12) but Pike would have kept his eye on Kirk over the years... and a recommendation from Spock would be all it would take to push Pike over the edge to "go to the mat" and argue to Starfleet Command that, at his promotion, they should make a relatively "young and unproven" officer, albeit with at least a few years of command-grade experience under his belt, captain of one of the most powerful and capable ships in the fleet.

See, this is an entirely separate event... and thus, in my opinion, is worthy of independent treatment as a separate film.

Obviously, for this second film to be worthwhile, it would need to have more to it than just "Kirk takes command of the Enterprise." And please understand, I don't inherently dislike the idea of villains... just not every SINGLE FREAKIN' FILM. ;)

So, I'd argue that this movie could involve a major conflict involving a major villain. I think a couple of hints as to what sort of villain this might be could be drawn from Kirk's list of commendations in "Court Martial." But I haven't really given it much thought beyond that.
After the arguments between him and Kirk, which could get rather heated (on Kirk's end), and a hint of deepening respect, might raise eyebrows both on and off screen.
Agreed. It seemed way too fast, too extreme, and honestly too "forced" in ST'09. The shift from "abrasion" to "mutual respect" should take more time, and would grow with a bit of distance (both physically and more importantly, psychologically). That's why I chose not to put them both onto the same ship at the end of my "treatment," in fact.
Spock's cold logic here could be played a little too cold, and we need a hint of something personal for him, and something to show the audience who HE is, beyond the cold, emotionless foil for James Kirk's wild plans.
Ah, but that's what worked so well in TOS. Spock always took the "logical" side of the argument... the "ego" point to McCoy's "id" and Jim's "superego"... according to Freud's theories, at least:
they are the three theoretical constructs in terms of whose activity and interaction mental life is described. According to this model, the uncoordinated instinctual trends are the "id"; the organized realistic part of the psyche is the "ego," and the critical and moralizing function the "super-ego
but that did not means that he was actually a cold character. Because Nimoy did so well with giving the character depth, even when the character was being played as "cold" he had greater depth than most "normal" characters would. I think Quinto could have pulled this off as well, had the director been sufficiently familiar with Star Trek and been able to steer his performance in that direction, rather than in the more overt, even hostile way that the character was portrayed in ST'09. That's ABRAMS' failing, not Quinto's, as far as I'm concerned.
On the other hand, there are some great opportunities with regards to Gary Mitchell, and with something more defined, meeting the Blonde Lab Technician in the movie might work to get more information about Kirk's feelings and thoughts, and could be used to illustrate his womanizing side, and his charm, which is a little bit lacking here.
Well, Mitchell would be a character who (at least in this movie) would be a throw-away. We, the fans, would have a little mental "hey, I recognize that guy" moment, but the general audience wouldn't care. They WOULD care, however, about how he would interact with Kirk... who they should care about at this point. Mitchell, in the context of this movie, would be a mirror for explaining aspects of Kirk, through dialogue, that's all. It could just as easily be "Joe Smith," for the purposes of storytelling... but why not use Mitchell, since the character already exists in the role of "Kirk's best friend" during this period?

Similarly, I specifically chose not to mention the "little blond lab tech" by name. WE know that this is Carol Marcus, but it's really irrelevant to the movie as a stand-alone piece. All the "general audience" really needs to know is that "Kirk's best friend is trying to get him to lighten up and accept that you can't always win."
 
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