Poll Did You Watch "These Are the Voyages" When It Originally Aired?

[ichab]

Yes, I saw it when it aired and it hasn't aged any better.

1.) The entire premise for the episode is stupid. Riker came to his decision to do the right thing after he transported over to the Pegasus. There's a whole speech he gives to his former captain while there as to why what he did was wrong and he wasn't going to make that mistake again. There was no need to shoehorn this into the Enterprise finale just so you can bring Riker and Troi into the show.
2.) This episode showed once again why Berman and Braga should have been put out to pasture after Voyager. They couldn't think outside the TNG box and coming back for this final episode left a huge stinker on an otherwise great season. A season that Braga had almost nothing to do with up to that point.
3.) It was a huge slap in the face to the main cast. A show finale is suppose to be about the characters you've come to know and care about for years, not guest stars who already had their time in the sun.

By the way, had we gotten another season, this is what Manny Coto was planning to do..

Season five

At the time of the cancellation, Coto had hoped for renewal and already started to make plans for the fifth season. These included the expectation that the show would begin to cover the buildup to the Romulan War, as well as continue to link to The Original Series with references to things such as the cloud city of Stratos, as seen in "The Cloud Minders". Another feature Coto planned was to have a "miniseries within a series", with four or five episodes devoted to following up on events from the Mirror Universe episode "In a Mirror, Darkly". The producers also intended to bring Jeffrey Combs onto the series as a regular by placing his recurring Andorian character Shran on the bridge of the Enterprise in an advisory capacity.

Work had already begun on an episode referred to by Coto as "Kilkenny Cats", which would have seen the return of Larry Niven's Kzinti, usually seen in his Known Space novels, and who had previously appeared in the Star Trek: The Animated Series episode "The Slaver Weapon". At the same time Enterprise was broadcast, writer Jimmy Diggs was pursuing the idea of a CGI animated film, Star Trek: Lions of the Night, with Captain Hikaru Sulu leading the Starship Enterprise and attempting to prevent a Kzinti invasion of the Federation. Coto's episode was based on a similar premise, with Diggs brought onto the Enterprise team to work on the episode. Production had begun on the new Kzinti ships for "Kilkenny Cats", with Josh Finney commissioned.

HUGE missed opportunity there.

 

[Captain Zog]

I believe so. Shouldn't have wasted my time.

 

[penguin44]

I enjoyed it then and now. I felt the last 2 eps were the Ent finale and this was the cool after bit. It was Afterall the last Trek show May 13, 2005 until Discovery in 2017. I have no issues with it except I want to see the speech!

 

[Shat Happens]

I'm sure and sorry this isn't the 'controversial opinion' thread but here it goes:}

Sirtis did not remember or didn't care how Deanna acts like. This has been going since the TNG movies and went on to PIC

Now I'd ask forgiveness to extend the rant from ENT to the Kelvins:

The two previous episodes to TATV were great because Robocop was in them and we were all happy (I at least was happy) when I heard Robocop would be in Star Trek 2009 Part II but JJ happens and this was the worst Star Trek ever forever (until Disco)

 

[Kor]

It might have been easier to digest if it was a mid-season episode and not the finale, and if B&B didn't have the audacity to call it a "valentine to the fans" or whatever they said.

Kor

 

[XweAponX]

One thing that the episode proved, was that the enterprise D did not “look bad in 16 x 9”, which was Braga’s reason for blowing it up. It looked absolutely fine in this episode.

I didn’t really have that much of an issue with the enterprise “story”, except that Tripp would not have allowed alien gangbangers to get the drop on him. But even considering that, they could have just made a new Tripp Sim and performed the operation that the original “Sim” had for giving the Sim a full lifetime.

on the next generation side of the story, it’s bogus. Because we know Riker was not in an enterprise holo, he was actually with Worf doing calisthenics… and he didn’t plan to tell Picard anything about his earlier association with the admiral. He told nobody about it until he blurted it out on the bridge, after the enterprise D got buried in rubble.

 

[TheAdmiralty]

Yes and it was as lame then as it is now.

 

[Alex1066]

I did and I am still unhappy about it. I am sure many people have listed the shortcomings of the episode more eloquently than I can, but it was a gut punch to me because I absolutely loved that cast of characters. I felt like the worst part is they tied everything up so hard with the telling of everything that happened in the coming years that there is no way to fix it. I know it will never happen, but I have always wanted a revival of that series that could give it a better ending.

 

[suarezguy]

Not something to admit or not but yes I did.

I knew from the pre-release spoilers and discussion that it would be at least pretty weird and not liked, show fans would not like having Riker and Troi play big parts and it being through a holodeck program and even a lot of TNG fans being pretty tired of them after Nemesis and not liking that the new story could mess up the flow of "The Pegasus" and that there would also be a lot of negativity to skipping over 6 years of Enterprise history (and Trip and T'Pol being separated) and Trip dying unnecessarily. Well all those aspects were true and did happen and did get those general reactions.

Me being a big fan of TNG, having already been very disappointed with Enterprise, and not caring much for Trip, I didn't hate it but still thought too much was bad including being a little too non-respectful to the main cast, I think revealing Trip's death before it happens, not having Archer give the speech (though he did, really bad coordation, give one in the previous episode).

 

[suarezguy]

everyone else stagnated for six years. Why did they think we wanted this?

I wonder if Berman and Braga legitimately did think fans, or at least some sizeable portion of them, *did* like Harry being stuck at ensign for 7 years and would also like/find amusing the characters including Travis and Hoshi not getting promoted in 11 years.

I do think that, while not deliberately trying to do something bad, Berman and Braga wrote it while they were in very bad bitter moods ...

To this day, I still have no freaking clue why they chose "The Pegasus" for the framing story. No clue whatsoever.

Braga having had his falling out with Moore and Berman also not liking that he had become critical? Both thinking we'll show him, we'll do an extension of him that's as good?

Agreed that "Terra Prime" was not much better, the weapon succeeding in firing but it just missing was really bad.

 

[Oddish]

I wonder if Berman and Braga legitimately did think fans, or at least some sizeable portion of them, *did* like Harry being stuck at ensign for 7 years...

Given the sheer amount of sadistic glee people these days seem to take in it, I have to wonder. But that may be because when the subject of Harry Kim comes up, there's not much else to talk about.

Having Janeway quietly pop a pip on his collar near the end of the series would have restored the character's dignity, but he would still have been a painful waste of potential.

would also like/find amusing the characters including Travis and Hoshi not getting promoted in 11 years.

Seems to me like that was just laziness. Same reason they didn't change anyone's appearance. Because everyone knows, people in their 30's look just the way they did in their 20's.

Because of this, it remains my head canon that most of the characters in the TATV holosimulation were 2155 versions of the main cast, spliced in at Riker's request. By 2161, most of the crew were promoted and serving elsewhere. Except Phlox, who was back with his extended family on Denobula. It just makes more sense that way.

Agreed that "Terra Prime" was not much better, the weapon succeeding in firing but it just missing was really bad.

It didn't miss; Trip hastily reprogrammed its firing coordinates while Archer was rasslin' with Peter Weller. It hit exactly where it was told to.

 

[Anna Yolei]

This episode showed once again why Berman and Braga should have been put out to pasture after Voyager. They couldn't think outside the TNG box and coming back for this final episode left a huge stinker on an otherwise great season. A season that Braga had almost nothing to do with up to that point.

Absolutely this. I can't describe to anyone who wasn't here in '04 how absolutely thrilled fans were when Manny Coto came onboard for Season 4. The love being showered onto Terry Matalas currently is nothing compared to the praise Coto received because I've seen people criticize the former without getting run out on a rail the way Coto critics did.

I do often wonder where this franchise would be now if any of the TOS writers that Roddenberry alienated with his controlling tendencies and post divorce bitterness had the opportunities to run the franchise after he'd stepped down. Wouldn't have taken till 2017 to have non-metaphorical queer characters in Trek for damn sure.

 

[SiddFinch1]

Poorly done and a bad conclusion to the show. Really wish Cotto got a 5th year. Whole point was leading to the Romulan war and creation of Federation and we waste time on Riker as a chef. Don't know why they used Riker during Pegasus instead of a more time appropriate captain of Titan.

 

[JonnyQuest037]

Yes. I experienced the disappointment in real time!