So..
When people complain about newer Trek being dumb action and lacking morality tales then that's inaccurate to say Trek gets out on a pedestal?
When people complain about newer Trek being dumb action and lacking morality tales then that's inaccurate to say Trek gets out on a pedestal?
Probably because Garak was a minor operative who hadn’t bombed entire civilizations out of existence. Plus, we actually see him being punished for his crimes against Cardassia by way of his exile.
The acting and writing were top shelf where Garak is concerned.
All I can say is to take some time to read “A Stitch in Time” by Andrew Robinson.
Noted.
Somehow forgot this…
He went back to a razed home world with 800,000,000 dead.
I imagine it wasn’t a treat to go back to.
I disagree. Okay, sure, duplicitous. But he's loyal to Cardassia, not to be confused with the Dominion that Dukat sold Cardassia to. And he's trustworthy as long as you keep in mind that Cardassia is his first loyalty.
He's pretty straightforward about it.
I agree with you. The dialogue between Garak and Bashir after the Dominion is defeated on Cardassia shows how deeply Garak cared and how devastated he was by all the destruction the people of Cardassia suffered at the hands of the Dominion.
[Dominion briefing room]
"BASHIR: Eight hundred million dead.
GARAK: And casualty reports still coming in. Well, aren't you going to congratulate me, Doctor? My exile is now officially over. I've returned home. Or rather, to what's left of it.
BASHIR: Listen, I know that this must seem bleak
GARAK: Some may say that we've gotten just what we deserved. After all,we're not entirely innocent, are we? And I'm not just speaking of the Bajoran occupation. No, our whole history is one of arrogant aggression. We've collaborated with the Dominion, betrayed the entire Alpha Quadrant. Oh, no, no. There's no doubt about it. We're guilty as charged.
BASHIR: You and I both know that the Cardassians are a strong people.They'll survive. Cardassia will survive.
GARAK: Please, Doctor. Spare me your insufferable Federation optimism. Of course it will survive, but as not the Cardassia I knew. We had a rich and ancient culture. Our literature, music, art were second to none. And now, so much of it is lost. So many of our best people, our most gifted minds.
BASHIR: I'm sorry, Garak. I didn't mean
GARAK: Oh, it's quite all right, Doctor. You've been such a good friend. I'm going to miss our lunches together.
BASHIR: I'm sure we'll see each other again.
GARAK: I'd like to think so, but one can never say. We live in uncertain times."
Yes, that’s the ideal for which to strive.
Ever seen Casablanca? What did you think of Captain Renault?
Do I like Renault? Would he be my best buddy if I were in 1941 Casablanca?
Would I want him to be removed from the movie?
No, no, and no.
Garak was being punished for crimes against Cardassia? I don't remember the show ever pinning down why he was exiled. I think it's more likely he was exiled because Tain thought he was a possible rival for power.
Is the Dominion overrunning the Alpha Quadrant acceptable? The Federation was irritating but in no way earned the reprisals that the Dominion brought down on them and the rest of the Alpha Quadrant.
It would be great if everyone played by the same rules, but they don't. It is that simple. If someone is playing by a different set of rules, one ends up being stupid to not also adapt to them where they can. If not, you end up losing.
Do you end up just keep throwing lives at them until you run out of resources?
Yes, he had a falling out with Tain that was discussed in The Die Is Cast but the actual specifics aren't mentioned.
"TAIN: Like I used to say. Always burn your bridges behind you. You never know who might be trying to follow.
GARAK: You always used to say as well that the Tal Shiar was sloppy. You never should have relied on them to burn your bridges.
TAIN: True. They should never have hired the Flaxian to blow up your shop.
GARAK: Actually, I blew up my shop. It was a way of piquing the interest of the good constable.
TAIN: You blew up your own shop? You, my friend, are a true original. If you hadn't betrayed me, things would have been very different.
GARAK: I never betrayed you! At least, not in my heart. Why do you think I'm here? I came because I thought the Romulans were trying to kill you. I came here to save you.
TAIN: I never thought I'd hear myself say this, Garak, but I believe you. You can go.
GARAK: Excuse me?
TAIN: The changeling of course will have to stay, but you're free to go. Your runabout is in launching bay three.
GARAK: Just like that?
TAIN: Just like that."
That wasn't the question. Garak was stated as being trustworthy except he deliberately lied to Sisko and murdered multiple people in the name of Sisko's operation.
The ends certainly appear to justify the means but that doesn't make Garak trustworthy, which was my original point.
Yeeesh....Theres your first mistake. Star Trek is pure fiction created for entertainment's sake. Nothing more.
Garak isnt starfleet nor a part of the federation. He has a completely different set of values. Thats what made him interesting.
