DC Comics Ongoing Discussion

[theenglish]

You mean the Justice League run that makes the Silmarillion feel like Dr. Seuss when it comes to overly complex, overly written bullshit? Seriously, even someone like Grant Morrison couldn't write something more hard to follow and also just plain shit if he tried. It is also directly responsible for dextroying several comics that were completely unrelated to the run (I will never forgive them for ruining the very good Supergirl comic by making her "infected" by the events of JL, which were completely unrelated to her book).

Fuck that JL run, from the idiotic bullshit about the Source Wall, to introducing the Monitor's fucking mother, which is so fucking stupid it feels like something Hickman would have written it if he was a DC writer. Even the New 52 JL was better written, and I considered that to be the worst run in the history of the Justice League until the current bullshit.

I actually think the Justice League was one of the things that improved with the New52, and Snyder's work over the past ten years has been pretty amazing. His run on JL is not hard to follow if you read it and is one of the best runs of Justice League stories ever. As for Supergirl, that infected story had nothing to do with Justice League--you are think of Batman Superman.

 

[kirk55555]

I actually think the Justice League was one of the things that improved with the New52, and Snyder's work over the past ten years has been pretty amazing. His run on JL is not hard to follow if you read it and is one of the best runs of Justice League stories ever. As for Supergirl, that infected story had nothing to do with Justice League--you are think of Batman Superman.

Snyder has never written a good comic. His Batman was one of the worst runs ever, second only to Tom "I fucking hate Booster Gold and Wally West" King's shit. I originally dropped it the second he had Batman cry because the Court of Owls did some sub-Riddler level mind games and beat him up for a bit (the Court of Owls also being shit, and a generally terrible idea at their core), and I think that was literally his first issue. I read a few tpbs from the library, and the "Joker ripping his own face off" and "James Gordon becomes Iron Batman while Bruce Wayne has amnesia" story arcs were also really bad.

As bad as that stuff was though, at least it was technically readable. His Justice League run is absolutely incoherent, and tries to ruin Crisis on Infinite Earths (the Anti-Monitor doesn't have a fucking mother, he's a being made of energy) and Lex Luthor (he goes full Arkham Asylum for no fucking reason, all of his actions are bullshit and make no sense for the character). I did read it for awhile, because some people were pretending it had a point so I read it for a bit, but it might as well have been written in Esperanto. It was some real Hickman level gibberish. You'd need the patience of a saint and either an IQ over 300 or a severform of insanity to try to unravel all the bullshit just to make a coherent plotline. The bits I could translate were really fucking awful, and I'm sure its worse then that if it was more comprehensible.

Also, I don't remember if this was Snyder or right before, but speaking of modern JL bullshit, where the hell did Fake Hawkgirl come from? The real Hawkgirl/Hawkwoman was in Hawkman's latest book, yet this random woman just appeared out of nowhere apparently with the name and gear. She looks like the Earth 2 Hawkgirl but I don't think the New 52 Earth 2 is still canon. The DC wiki claims that she's the normal version, but the recently ended Hawkman comic confirmed that the Thanagarian Hawkgirl/Hawkwoman was the actual version, having reincarnated with hawkman for uncounted millennia, so the Justice League version makes absolutely no sense.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Also, I don't remember if this was Snyder or right before, but speaking of modern JL bullshit, where the hell did Fake Hawkgirl come from? The real Hawkgirl/Hawkwoman was in Hawkman's latest book, yet this random woman just appeared out of nowhere apparently with the name and gear. She looks like the Earth 2 Hawkgirl but I don't think the New 52 Earth 2 is still canon. The DC wiki claims that she's the normal version, but the recently ended Hawkman comic confirmed that the Thanagarian Hawkgirl/Hawkwoman was the actual version, having reincarnated with hawkman for uncounted millennia, so the Justice League version makes absolutely no sense.

She's Kendra Saunders, who is a reincarnation Shrra. Shayera is also a reincarnation of Shrra. The Hawks have been reincarnated countless across time and space. They've existed in many times and on many planets including Rann and Krypton. The fact Shayera ans Kendra are now two separate has something to do with Perpetua and the Totality.

 

[kirk55555]

She's Kendra Saunders, who is a reincarnation Shrra. Shayera is also a reincarnation of Shrra. The Hawks have been reincarnated countless across time and space. They've existed in many times and on many planets including Rann and Krypton. The fact Shayera ans Kendra are now two separate has something to do with Perpetua and the Totality.

Oh, so its Scott Snyder bullshit about a character and concept that, as far as I'm concerned, don't exist. Perpetua isn't part of the Hawkman comic, so she's not a thing and the Thanagarian Hawkwoman/girl is the only actual version. Hawkman has literally nothing to do with the fake mommy of the fake Anti-Monitor, Hawkman and Hawkwoman/girl are very specifically not connected to any of that bullshit, so whatever Snyder wrote is irrelevant along with being crap.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Oh, so its Scott Snyder bullshit about a character and concept that, as far as I'm concerned, don't exist. Perpetua isn't part of the Hawkman comic, so she's not a thing and the Thanagarian Hawkwoman/girl is the only actual version. Hawkman has literally nothing to do with the fake mommy of the fake Anti-Monitor, Hawkman and Hawkwoman/girl are very specifically not connected to any of that bullshit, so whatever Snyder wrote is irrelevant along with being crap.

You're hilarious.

 

[kirk55555]

You're hilarious.

Read the Hawkman comic. There is no Perpetua, totality or fake Hawkgirl anywhere near it. Sure, it gets fucked over by the "infected" storyline, which is connected to Snyder's bullshit, but the writer was able to deal with it better then the poor Supergirl writer. Hawkman and the real Hawkwoman/girl have no connection to any of that shit, Snyder wasn't able to ruin them.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Read the Hawkman comic. There is no Perpetua, totality or fake Hawkgirl anywhere near it. Sure, it gets fucked over by the "infected" storyline, which is connected to Snyder's bullshit, but the writer was able to deal with it better then the poor Supergirl writer. Hawkman and the real Hawkwoman/girl have no connection to any of that shit, Snyder wasn't able to ruin them.

I've read it. The hilarity has nothing to do with that comic or any other one.

 

[Ovation]

Snyder has never written a good comic. His Batman was one of the worst runs ever, second only to Tom "I fucking hate Booster Gold and Wally West" King's shit. I originally dropped it the second he had Batman cry because the Court of Owls did some sub-Riddler level mind games and beat him up for a bit (the Court of Owls also being shit, and a generally terrible idea at their core), and I think that was literally his first issue. I read a few tpbs from the library, and the "Joker ripping his own face off" and "James Gordon becomes Iron Batman while Bruce Wayne has amnesia" story arcs were also really bad.

As bad as that stuff was though, at least it was technically readable. His Justice League run is absolutely incoherent, and tries to ruin Crisis on Infinite Earths (the Anti-Monitor doesn't have a fucking mother, he's a being made of energy) and Lex Luthor (he goes full Arkham Asylum for no fucking reason, all of his actions are bullshit and make no sense for the character). I did read it for awhile, because some people were pretending it had a point so I read it for a bit, but it might as well have been written in Esperanto. It was some real Hickman level gibberish. You'd need the patience of a saint and either an IQ over 300 or a severform of insanity to try to unravel all the bullshit just to make a coherent plotline. The bits I could translate were really fucking awful, and I'm sure its worse then that if it was more comprehensible.

Also, I don't remember if this was Snyder or right before, but speaking of modern JL bullshit, where the hell did Fake Hawkgirl come from? The real Hawkgirl/Hawkwoman was in Hawkman's latest book, yet this random woman just appeared out of nowhere apparently with the name and gear. She looks like the Earth 2 Hawkgirl but I don't think the New 52 Earth 2 is still canon. The DC wiki claims that she's the normal version, but the recently ended Hawkman comic confirmed that the Thanagarian Hawkgirl/Hawkwoman was the actual version, having reincarnated with hawkman for uncounted millennia, so the Justice League version makes absolutely no sense.

Yawn.

Oh, so its Scott Snyder bullshit about a character and concept that, as far as I'm concerned, don't exist. Perpetua isn't part of the Hawkman comic, so she's not a thing and the Thanagarian Hawkwoman/girl is the only actual version. Hawkman has literally nothing to do with the fake mommy of the fake Anti-Monitor, Hawkman and Hawkwoman/girl are very specifically not connected to any of that bullshit, so whatever Snyder wrote is irrelevant along with being crap.

Yawning. Intensifies.

 

[JD]

Snyder has never written a good comic. His Batman was one of the worst runs ever, second only to Tom "I fucking hate Booster Gold and Wally West" King's shit. I originally dropped it the second he had Batman cry because the Court of Owls did some sub-Riddler level mind games and beat him up for a bit (the Court of Owls also being shit, and a generally terrible idea at their core), and I think that was literally his first issue. I read a few tpbs from the library, and the "Joker ripping his own face off" and "James Gordon becomes Iron Batman while Bruce Wayne has amnesia" story arcs were also really bad.

I know I say this a lot but, I really, really don't get you at all. I've been working my way through Snyder's Batman, and I am absolutely loving every panel of it. The whole Court of Owls storyline was great, and Death of the Family goes right up there with some of the best Joker stories ever.

 

[kirk55555]

I know I say this a lot but, I really, really don't get you at all. I've been working my way through Snyder's Batman, and I am absolutely loving every panel of it. The whole Court of Owls storyline was great, and Death of the Family goes right up there with some of the best Joker stories ever.

The Court of Owls are just a version of the illuminauti but with stupid masks and zombie warriors, we've seen groups like them a million times, and there is at least 2-3 other secret evil organizations that pop up literally right at the beginning of the New 52. Batman should have known about them years ago and he shouldn't have been beaten to the point of crying like a baby on his first encounter with them. An unoriginal, bad idea done poorly. Not even the worst of Snyder's Batman work, but the start of it and probably the most well known.

Death of the Family has Joker rip off his face for absolutely no reason and then basically hypnotizes the Batfamily to hate Batman. I call it hypnosis because there is literally no reason for any of them to be mad at Batman, outside of mind control from The Joker. It is one of the worst Joker stories ever written, and I'm stretching the definition of what the Joker is to even count it as a joker story.

Honestly, at least Geoff Johns recent Three Jokers mini series was well written and he did his best with a terrible idea, he actually almost sells me on the idea of there being three Jokers just by good characterization. Scott Snyder's universe and/or character ruining ideas are always either badly written or absolutely incoherent.

 

[JD]

You really have serious issues with characters showing emotion, don't you? This is just one of several times I've seen you complain about characters showing emotion.
And when he did break down, it was because he'd been having his mind fucked with for 8 straight days by the Owls, and something like is going to screw with even the strongest person.

Not every character is going to be a completely emotionless Vulcan or android.
And the Joker didn't tear of his face in Death of the Family, Dollmaker cut it off in the Faces of Death storyline in Detective Comics.
The opening scene with the Joker's attack on the GCPD is one of my favorite Joker scenes ever. The whole sequence is just sooo fucking creepy.
DC has announced that they are going to be doing a new Robin solo series starring Damian Wayne, and Batman & Scooby-Do Mysteries, a new crossover series that will be 24 digital issues, and will then released as 12 print issues.

 

[Kai "the spy"]

April solicits are out.

Thoughts:

- Green Lantern launches, and it not only stars John Stewart, but also features YJ's Teen Lantern. Also, apparently, Far Sector's Jo Mullein is also brought over. I'm so up for that.

- Couple of new Bat-books, not really going to follow that, as I just got out again. Tom Taylor & Andy Kubert on a Batman book set in Europe sounds interesting, though. Maybe I'll get it in trades.

- New Super-Sons mini-series by Peter J. Tomasi disregarding what happened to Jon & Damien since the last one. Hell, yeah!

- Crossover book of Justice League and RWBY. Don't know a whole lot about RWBY beyond that it exists, so my interest in that is pretty low.

- Midnighter features in a back-up story of Action Comics #1030. Huh. Well, I'll buy the book anyway, so I'll probably read it.

- The Flash has Wally in the body of Bart Allen?! Okay, yeah, this I gotta read.

- New Dark Knight Detective collection of Alan Grant/Norm Breyfogle era Batman comics. This is what I'm dropping the current Bat-books for.

 

[JD]

Here are DC's press releases for the new Batman: The Dark Knight and Green Lantern. I didn't realize Far Sector took place in the main DC Universe, I had assumed it was it's own thing.
So how is it that Earth has so many different Green Lanterns? I thought each Sector had one Lantern at a time, but now there are like half a dozen for Earth.

 

[Xerxes82]

I'm not a fan of Scott Snyder, at all. His Batman run did nothing for me. He reminds me so very much of Brian Bendis, another writer who is great at building anticipation, but never met an ending he couldn't completely deflate and make utterly unsatisfying. (Though Bendis wasn't always this way. His Daredevil run is a masterpiece and Alias is also excellent. I didn't enjoy his second run on Jessica Jones as much, but credit where it's due.)

However, like Bendis, Snyder has his moments. His initial run on Batman, when it was Grayson in the cowl, was excellent. Moody and thoughtful. Nothing like the bombast and over-inflated "epics" he tried to do later.

Looks like I'll be down to two titles as of April. Far Sector has been quite good, and I'll by trying Tom Taylor's Nightwing. I'm debating giving the new Robin solo a shot, but I'm really over Damian at the moment. It's not that he's a bad character, I'm just burned out. But with no sign of Tim Drake, and Jason relegated to an anthology book I won't be reading, I have budget and should probably get my Robin fix somewhere.

And, god help me, I'm almost tempted by Suicide Squad. But only for Kon-El. Though I'm not digging the return of the Johns emo-jock look, even if it is the more recognizable after being used in so much other media.

Here are DC's press releases for the new Batman: The Dark Knight and Green Lantern. I didn't realize Far Sector took place in the main DC Universe, I had assumed it was it's own thing.

Eh, it's kind of both. Main universe, but the setting is so divorced from everything else it might as well be it's own universe. Though Jo is the first Lantern since Kyle to really catch my attention, so I'm cool with seeing her appear more widely in the future.

So how is it that Earth has so many different Green Lanterns? I thought each Sector had one Lantern at a time, but now there are like half a dozen for Earth.

There hasn't been one to a sector since Rebirth. It went to two a sector for a while, but even then Earth had at least 4 (with Guy and Kyle serving in special, non-standard sector duties, basically as specialists). Nowadays there are at least 7 (Hal, Guy, John, Kyle, Jessica Cruz who technically got her powers from an alternate universe evil GL analogue, Simon Baz and Jo Mullein from Far Sector). Plus Bendis' Teen Lantern, who isn't actually a proper GL, but merely mimics one with alien tech that siphons from the same Green willpower source.

 

[kirk55555]

You really have serious issues with characters showing emotion, don't you? This is just one of several times I've seen you complain about characters showing emotion.
And when he did break down, it was because he'd been having his mind fucked with for 8 straight days by the Owls, and something like is going to screw with even the strongest person.

Not every character is going to be a completely emotionless Vulcan or android.
And the Joker didn't tear of his face in Death of the Family, Dollmaker cut it off in the Faces of Death storyline in Detective Comics.
The opening scene with the Joker's attack on the GCPD is one of my favorite Joker scenes ever. The whole sequence is just sooo fucking creepy.
DC has announced that they are going to be doing a new Robin solo series starring Damian Wayne, and Batman & Scooby-Do Mysteries, a new crossover series that will be 24 digital issues, and will then released as 12 print issues.

emotion is fine, but Batman can be tortured for a year straight and not break down, there's literally nothing the court of owls could do that would make him cry. It was just Snyders cheap attempt to pretend like the court of owls were any kind of threat, instead Batman lost all credibility for the rest of his run. You're literally pulling the Android thing out of your ass, a lot of emotion is not appropriate for certain characters in certain situations and that's honestly one of my lesser issues with Scott Snyder's Batman run, it was just the initial thing that made me drop it.

aalso, you're being pedantic about the Joker oh, he had his face cut off even though he didn't do the physical cutting it was still his idea/he went along with it

 

[kirk55555]

April solicits are out.

Thoughts:

- Green Lantern launches, and it not only stars John Stewart, but also features YJ's Teen Lantern. Also, apparently, Far Sector's Jo Mullein is also brought over. I'm so up for that.

well, fuck that book then. I thought that horrible far sector of comic wasn't even in Canon, and everything from that young justice book was shit.

- The Flash has Wally in the body of Bart Allen?!

I that's the stupidest fucking thing I've heard recently from DC, and I was enjoying the Flash right now. Well, that's a DC Book dropped. I think it might be the last one I was bothering to read, especially since Hawkman ended. DC desperately needs to fire all these horrible witers, they're all just worthless. Probably won't have until Jim Lee is gone, though.

 

[theenglish]

Still no Aquaman or Legion of Super-Heroes. Also, wonder what happens in The Green Lantern #12 so that Hal is not there in the new series.

 

[Kai "the spy"]

Still no Aquaman or Legion of Super-Heroes. Also, wonder what happens in The Green Lantern #12 so that Hal is not there in the new series.

I was thinking about that. One of the criticisms Todd McFarlane threw at the New 52 from a business standpoint was the roll-out of all new books inside of a month, meaning all the "new launch" buzz was contained to that single month. Maybe, nine years later, DC is finally following his advice and does a slower rollout. So, March has a lot of books returning and new launches like Harley Quinn and Swamp Thing, April has new launches like Green Lantern and Robin. Aquaman and LoSH might be launched in May.

At least, I hope so.

 

[kirk55555]

So, are all the current DC books being cancelled/renumbered after Future Slate is done? The Flash has been the last DC book standing for me since Hawman and Shazam ended, so I haven't been seeing much about what is specifically happening with the current ongoing books, just that a bunch of new comics are coming out.

 

[Nerys Myk]

So, are all the current DC books being cancelled/renumbered after Future Slate is done? The Flash has been the last DC book standing for me since Hawman and Shazam ended, so I haven't been seeing much about what is specifically happening with the current ongoing books, just that a bunch of new comics are coming out.

The numbering remains intact for many long running titles and more recent ones.