DC Cinematic Universe ( The James Gunn era)

[Mage]

OK, I apologize for the real fans comment, I should have said fans of a traditional Superman. I guess it just seems kind of strange to me to see a person who says they're a fan of a character who seems to hate everything that makes that character who they are in most versions.

I understand and respect your point of view. And I know many share that. In fact, they are among the most vocal among fans. Others, like me and many like me, stopped sharing that we are a fan of for example Cavill/Snyder's Superman, because we get treated like we are horrible people by the more traditional crowd. 'This Superman killed, how dare you like this version!!'

And, again, there is a very vocal part in any fandom, which leads to the concept that that part of said fandom is what the entire fandom is like. Which is often simply not true.
I am a huge Star Trek fan. I know quite a few who, like me, watch the shows and movies. And that's it. In that group, I am the only one that has Star Trek books and few little nicknacks for on shelfs and posts on this forum. I don't own a costume, or have posters and what not. Don't go to conventions. I just geek out over the shows and movies and talk about it sometimes. Yet many people still believe that's what all Star Trek fans do. Because they are, well..... louder. Not in a negative way, but they are.

Same goes for the Superman fans you talk about. The majority just reads the comics for fun and put them away again. They'll watch a movie or a show and that's it. They'll have an opinion about it, thoughts and ideas. But they don't really talk about them, or search out places to do so. They just enjoy reading the comics. Does this make THEM less of a fan? Because they are more casual.
You use the word 'hate'. That is an intense feeling. So is love. Many people who read comics are watch certain shows or movies don't 'hate' or 'love' anything. They just enjoy, or do not. It doesn't have such a huge impact on them. It's just there. I REALLY like Star Trek, and have favorites. I don't HATE any Star Trek. If I didn't enjoy it, I don't watch it. I don't go online and get angry at fans for enjoying it because I dislike it.
Not would I ever call someone else not a real fan for disliking something I enjoy. That would be an unhealthy sign of my passion for something taking over my humane thought process, if I ever decided to get so mean to another human being for disagreeing with me.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

I have literally seen dozens or even hundreds of people expressing the kind of opinions about Superman that I have, and I have only seen you and maybe one or two other people who express the kind of opinions that you have. So I'm basing what I'm saying on the clear evidence that I have seen.

I'm calling the "I have literally seen dozens or even hundreds of people expressing the kind of opinions about Superman that I have" unsubstantiated bullshit. Its quite convenient for you to say this now, as you believed your phantom "hundreds" is some weighty evidence, yet its just you attempting to speak for others and silence anyone who is not on your bandwagon.

OK, I apologize for the real fans comment, I should have said fans of a traditional Superman.

More bullshit, as you do believe there's such a thing as a "real Superman fan", which you have posted in this thread--a type of person you cannot produce.

There is no "traditional Superman", hence the numerous reworkings of the character seen in the 60s and 70s, the Crisis and post-COIE period and beyond for just a few examples.

I guess it just seems kind of strange to me to see a person who says they're a fan of a character who seems to hate everything that makes that character who they are in most versions.

Speaking from ignorance once again with the "most versions" nonsense. If anyone were to follow your prescription about what makes the character, they would not have a knowledgeable view of the character's history. It is quite obvious you are attempting to sell a long abandoned version as the one and only interpretation of the character, which is an agenda which ignores important, defining periods of the comic books you clearly have never read before. One might argue that you are not a real fan for that lack of historical awareness of the thing you claim to cherish more than others.

Moreover, no one here ever claimed to "hate" anything about the character, yet in classic propagandist fashion, you use the word to exaggerate any view or position that does not support your lone view of a comic book character.

 

[JD]

You sure seem to hate the George Reeves, Silver Age version of the character. All you ever do is complain about how horrible they were, and how any version of the character that is similar to them is completely wrong and nobody should like them, ect.
And I'm basing my "most versions" off of things like the George Reeves series, Christopher Reeve movies, Superman: The Animated Series, there-New 52 comics like The Last Son of Krypton, All Star Superman, Superman and Lois, and the current World's Finest series.

 

[Mudd]

The Snyder thing was an abberation and a creative cul de sac. It's had no impact on the chatacter's evolution over time. And it's over.

 

[StarTrek1701]

The Snyder thing was an abberation and a creative cul de sac.

Disagree. It brought something new to the mythos and properly modernized Superman.

It's had no impact on the chatacter's evolution over time.

Blame DC for that, not Snyder.

And it's over.

Too bad, because Gunn's universe seems DOA.

 

[The Realist]

Too bad, because Gunn's universe seems DOA.

Given that the first film in said universe has not yet been released, this can only be interpreted as sour-grapes wishful thinking. None of us knows whether it will be a success at this point, and your evident desire for it to fail confers no special insight.

 

[JD]

Too bad, because Gunn's universe seems DOA.

What makes you think that? Most of the reactions I've seen to Creature Commandos and the Superman trailers seem pretty positive.

 

[BillJ]

Given that the first film in said universe has not yet been released, this can only be interpreted as sour-grapes wishful thinking. None of us knows whether it will be a success at this point, and your evident desire for it to fail confers no special insight.

They have fantasies of WB going back to Snyder on their knees, begging for him to come back.

If it fails, Superman will be put on the shelf for a long while.

 

[theenglish]

The Superman trailer seems to have close to 100 million views on Youtube. I just quickly added the 59 million on DC's trailer and the half dozen or so listed as coming from other sources. By comparison the final FF trailer has a little more than 20 million.

 

[oktay]

Can Warner's DC Studios Rise From the Ashes With 'Superman?' | Analysis

James Gunn's Superman reboot not only aims to restart the entire DC universe but is one of Warner Bros.' most crucial releases of the year

www.thewrap.com

 

[Set Harth]

Did someone run over that guy's face?

 

[Kai "the spy"]

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[StarTrek1701]

Given that the first film in said universe has not yet been released, this can only be interpreted as sour-grapes wishful thinking. None of us knows whether it will be a success at this point, and your evident desire for it to fail confers no special insight.

I have zero desire for it to fail. But whatever I am seeing isn't giving me a good feeling or a good sign.
I am getting the same vibe as The Marvels in terms of hype and notice.

What makes you think that? Most of the reactions I've seen to Creature Commandos and the Superman trailers seem pretty positive.

Online reactions don't translate to real life success.
If it did the Minecraft Movie and Lilo and Stitch live action would be massive flops, but it's the opposite.

They have fantasies of WB going back to Snyder on their knees, begging for him to come back.

If it fails, Superman will be put on the shelf for a long while.

That isn't my take. Snyder is done for realistically.
I want something new and fresh.
We may be getting something new, but fresh? Nah, we seen the same crap three times in a row now.

 

[Nerys Myk]

Nah, we seen the same crap three times in a row now.

 

[TREK_GOD_1]

You sure seem to hate the George Reeves

But I believe the Kirk Alyn Superman serials--which predate the George Reeves TV series--are the 2nd best interpretation of the character. So much for your self-inflicted, all-downhill-from-here analysis. That said, You most certainly despise the Cavill version (spare the spin job response to that), and are completely unaware of eras of the Superman comic crucial to his development. Got anything else, hypocrite?

Silver Age version of the character.

The Silver Age Superman was changed toward the end of the 60s, as it was not seen as being on the same, maturing level of other comics, even within the same publishing house (you seem very unfamiliar with). You might cling to that version, but DC moved away from that, and the character has continued to change ever since.

And I'm basing my "most versions" off of things like the George Reeves series

Since this is a thread about the Gunn film, set to be released this year, and the average moviegoer age in 2025 is roughly 18-39 (with increases in the under 17 demographic), it is highly doubtful a relevant number of this group knows anything about George Reeves, or his TV series. One, Superman has been adapted in many forms since, so its not some benchmark, definitive version (the way some feel about the Universal Frankenstein from 1931). Two, despite ending its production in 1958--two years into the historically accepted beginning of the Silver Age of comics (with the 1st appearance of the Barry Allen Flash in Showcase #4 from October, 1956), the Reeves series was purely a late Golden Age product in tone, presentation and influence from that period, one you are not finding the swelling masses calling for its return.

Christopher Reeve movies, Superman: The Animated Series, there-New 52 comics like The Last Son of Krypton, All Star Superman, Superman and Lois, and the current World's Finest series.

Back to trying blur the lines again, I see. If you actually watched Superman and Lois, you would know it was largely an adult superhero drama, with many of its most known subjects (struggles with cancer, facing mortality in a non-superhero manner, the ethics of using media to convict people, drug use, etc.) taking next to none of its inspiration from the Silver Age interpretation, so even referring to that as part of your "Silver Age" / phantom majority fairy tale is simply a lie. The same could be said of the WB/"Timmverse" Superman cartoon (and most certainly the character as part of Justice League / Justice League Unlimited).

Disagree. It brought something new to the mythos and properly modernized Superman.

Agreed.

Too bad, because Gunn's universe seems DOA.

At present, there's no way to know that. While some of the screenings have resulted in negative impressions, the wider audience has not had their chance to see it, so again, there's just no way of knowing how this will impact Gunn's DCU.

 

[StarTrek1701]

Superman Returns - Lex is the villain.
BvS - Lex is the villain.
Superman 2025 - Lex is the villain.

Brainiac, Lobo, Metallo, Parasite and a host of other villains are yet to make their movie debut.

 

[StarTrek1701]

At present, there's no way to know that. While some of the screenings have resulted in negative impressions, the wider audience has not had their chance to see it, so again, there's just no way of knowing how this will impact Gunn's DCU.

I get what you're saying, Gunn did make GotG a success, but he also made a big flop in TSS.
Really want this new DCU to succeed but I am already getting bad vibes from it.
Half a decade ago we were pretty sure Marvel could do no wrong, yet here we are.
DC or WB rather have been wrought with mismanagement for over two decades.
That wont be fixed with just one movie.

 

[JD]

But I believe the Kirk Alyn Superman serials--which predate the George Reeves TV series--are the 2nd best interpretation of the character. So much for your self-inflicted, all-downhill-from-here analysis. That said, You most certainly despise the Cavill version (spare the spin job response to that), and are completely unaware of eras of the Superman comic crucial to his development. Got anything else, hypocrite?

I'm not a hypocrite, and I don't appreciate being accused of being one. I apologize if I upset you with my last post. I realize I've lost my temper a few times after I found some of you posts highly insulting, and I do apologize, and I'm really trying hard not let it happen again, and I realize I might have failed at that with my last post and, and so I again I whole heartly, truly, and honestly do apologize for that.

The Silver Age Superman was changed toward the end of the 60s, as it was not seen as being on the same, maturing level of other comics, even within the same publishing house (you seem very unfamiliar with). You might cling to that version, but DC moved away from that, and the character has continued to change ever since.

I have no real attachment to that version of the character, all I meant was that you seem to hate a lot more of the eras of the character than you like.

Since this is a thread about the Gunn film, set to be released this year, and the average moviegoer age in 2025 is roughly 18-39 (with increases in the under 17 demographic), it is highly doubtful a relevant number of this group knows anything about George Reeves, or his TV series.

The series is on 4 or 8 times a week on MeTV and is on several different streaming services, so it's actually one of the most easily accessible adaptations out there right now.

One, Superman has been adapted in many forms since, so its not some benchmark, definitive version (the way some feel about the Universal Frankenstein from 1931).

It kind of is, there are lot of elements of it that have gone on the become fairly well known elements of the character.

Two, despite ending its production in 1958--two years into the historically accepted beginning of the Silver Age of comics (with the 1st appearance of the Barry Allen Flash in Showcase #4 from October, 1956), the Reeves series was purely a late Golden Age product in tone, presentation and influence from that period, one you are not finding the swelling masses calling for its return.

OK, I was not aware of that, so I'll give you that one.

Back to trying blur the lines again, I see. If you actually watched Superman and Lois, you would know it was largely an adult superhero drama, with many of its most known subjects (struggles with cancer, facing mortality in a non-superhero manner, the ethics of using media to convict people, drug use, etc.) taking next to none of its inspiration from the Silver Age interpretation, so even referring to that as part of your "Silver Age" / phantom majority fairy tale is simply a lie. The same could be said of the WB/"Timmverse" Superman cartoon (and most certainly the character as part of Justice League / Justice League Unlimited).

I'm sorry, I think I wasn't clear enough here. I wasn't comparing those versions to the Silver Age, I just listing the versions of the character that I'm familiar with, to give some context to my "most versions" comment.
You also seem to misunderstand, which again is possibly my fault, because I know I am bad about mixing things up, I think partly because my brain gets ahead of my fingers, and so multiple thought jumble together and thing come across differently than how I intend, but I actually don't like the Silver Age comics, I only mentioned them because of how often you complain about them.

 

[DarrenTR1970]

I get what you're saying, Gunn did make GotG a success, but he also made a big flop in TSS.

One of the reasons TSS flopped was that it was released during a second COVID surge and theaters were either closed or at reduced seating capacity. I remember trying to see it on my birthday and the only place it was playing was a drive-in two hours' drive from my apartment.

 

[Tosk]

Superman Returns - Lex is the villain.
BvS - Lex is the villain.
Superman 2025 - Lex is the villain.

You said three times in a row, but your list leaves out Man of Steel and Justice League.

Superman Returns - Lex.
Man of Steel - Zod.
BvS - Lex.
Justice League - Steppenwolf.
Superman - Lex.