Could the Bak’u actually bend time with their brains?

Discussion in 'Star Trek Movies I-X' started by The Rock, Jan 7, 2019.

  1. The Rock

    The Rock Captain Captain

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    In some scenes in Insurrection, we see Anij apparently slow down time with her mind (like the scene with the hummingbird)........or does she? If so, do all Bak'u have this ability?

    Or are those scenes meant to illustrate that they just have superb clarity and can "see" things normal humans can't (like each individual flapping of a hummingbird's wings)?

    I was always confused by those scenes.
     
  2. Damian

    Damian Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I think it's number 2, that their clarity allowed them to 'slow' down time in their mind.
     
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  3. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    In either case, using this ability when the cave collapses makes no sense at all. If time goes more slowly for Picard and Anij, their rescue is farther off. And if they perceive this passing time with greater intensity, they are also burning more of their body sugars with more of the cave oxygen than they otherwise would.

    The one benefit might be that if Anij makes Picard hallucinate intensely about pretty patterns of falling dust, perhaps Picard refrains from trying to dig them out and thus protects them from the oxygen consumption of muscular labor, or the potential total collapsing of the cave from the fruitless efforts.

    Timo Saloniei
     
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  4. Tosk

    Tosk Vice Admiral Admiral

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    They don't slow time, Anij explains that you learn to "live in a moment", so if Picard and Anij do that in the cave, just because they concentrate on one moment it doesn't mean the rescue team do. Think of it like letting your mind wander, losing track of time. "Oh gosh, you're here already? Feels like it was just moments ago I called for you..."
     
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  5. Damian

    Damian Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I think Tosk hit it pretty well. It's probably similar to suspended animation, you slow your body functions down, that sort of thing. Mind over matter.
     
  6. Spot261

    Spot261 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I'll reply to this last week
     
  7. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    But the practical effect here would be the exact opposite. "I have let my mind wander for WEEKS now - what kept you?" "Umm, Sir, you called us two minutes and fifteen seconds ago."

    Making the most of the moment sounds like drawing painful attention to the passage of time, rather than losing track of it. Sure, the ability to adjust subjective perception of time could be used the opposite way as well, making time fly for the captives. But portraying this to the audience by showing the same "all surroundings slow to a crawl" effect they did with the hummingbird sends the exact wrong message. "We're in Hell, and now we're having more of it!"

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  8. Smellmet

    Smellmet Commodore Commodore

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    But this 'ability' seems to affect Picard too - he even says 'how are you doing this' so it comes across like they're slowing time. If it was something that they could do within themselves then surely Picard wouldn't be affected?

    I never really understood what was going on in these scenes, or what purpose they even served to the story.
     
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  9. Tosk

    Tosk Vice Admiral Admiral

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    We'll just have to agree to disagree.
     
  10. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    ...I guess so. But disagree with what we see? With it taking ages for dust to fall to the floor, thus it necessarily taking even longer ages for Riker to blast or dig his way through?

    I can easily see Picard having a swell time thanks to Anij's mental help (it must be psychic somehow, something she can project in classic Trek telepathy style, unless it's something the Briar Patch projects on all those within it as long as they care to pay attention). But I have to see that with my mind's eye, when my regular pair is feeding me the exact opposite information.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  11. Tosk

    Tosk Vice Admiral Admiral

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    At the risk of seeming like I'm continuing to argue (I'm not, just presenting my view of it) my point was that it's not literally slowing down time, it's their perception of it. They focus on one moment mentally while regular time flows on around them. A sort of controlled reverie, if you'll allow for a mild oxymoron. A stretched moment for them, more time has passed for others.

    If they were really slowing down time, where would that end? Does the whole galaxy slow down every time one of them decides to have a moment?
     
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  12. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I'm not disagreeing with any of that. Time flows; Anij and Picard just enjoy it with greater particularity, so it seems to slow down for them.

    But no. LESS time has passed for others while Anij and Picard are stuck in their precious moment. The world speeds ahead while the two dream.

    What necessarily logically follows is that Anij and Picard have to wait for their rescue for a longer time. At the very least in the sense of it feeling longer for them.

    ...But probably also and alarmingly in the sense that in order to perceive, they have to live - their brains must be working harder to see with greater clarity, so they are expending their resources more quickly and risk dying for it.

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  13. Tosk

    Tosk Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Yeah, we either disagree or are just fundamentally misunderstanding the other's point. No biggie.

    There's nothing to suggest that in the film. To quote Anij..."Nothing more complicated than perception. [...] It took us centuries to learn that it doesn't have to take centuries to learn it."
     
  14. Timo

    Timo Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Running isn't complicated, either. But it consumes more of your resources than walking, per unit of time. Seeing with greater clarity ought to be a greater strain by simple physiology, is my point there.

    But pretending to be seeing with greater clarity oughtn't. And perhaps they are doing that. Certainly no biggie.

    I'm just disappointed at the movie showing stuff that shouldn't help the heroes when it could also have shown stuff that instinctively ought to help. But speeding up the dustfall and stuff would admittedly look just comical. :(

    Timo Saloniemi
     
  15. Spot261

    Spot261 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Why?
     
  16. Ryan Thomas Riddle

    Ryan Thomas Riddle Vice Admiral Admiral

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  17. Kor

    Kor Admiral Admiral

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    It was an attempt at profundity that fell flat, like most movie depictions of anything philosophical.

    Kor
     
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  18. Spot261

    Spot261 Vice Admiral Admiral

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    To be honest that's exactly how I saw it, apart from the whole "How did you do that?" thing.....
     
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  19. Damian

    Damian Fleet Captain Fleet Captain

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    I think part of the reason wasn't to 'slow down time' per se. What I always saw in that scene was that they were trying to slow Anij's spiral to death long enough for help to arrive so she could be saved. Slow down her life signs maybe is a better way to put it, so she could 'stay in the moment' just prior to death until Dr Crusher could save her.
     
  20. BillJ

    BillJ Fleet Admiral Premium Member

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    Meth.
     
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