Sorry, but no. That's not what he was talking about when he said "control." It was in response to a very specific question about what the government would have to gain by giving its constituents cancer:
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The Ontario government announced today that booster shots will be available for anyone 18 and over as of January 4. It looks like I'll hit my minimum 168 days just a few days before that, so the timing works out fairly well for me! 
Tasmania is finally opening our borders to fully vaccinated mainland Australians on the 15th December. About 90% of our population over 12 is fully vaccinated.
We have not had any community transfer of Covid for around 18 months and only a few cases in quarantine. The government and the hospitals have been preparing for this opening for several months. We have a 6 months supply of PPE , more than 200 beds available for Covid patients and 114 ICU beds.
There is a system in place for home remote monitoring by using smart devices, which include home pulse and oxygen monitors for those patients who have mild symptoms.
I think that few places in the world have been as well prepared for an upcoming second wave of Covid-19.
We have not had any community transfer of Covid for around 18 months and only a few cases in quarantine. The government and the hospitals have been preparing for this opening for several months. We have a 6 months supply of PPE , more than 200 beds available for Covid patients and 114 ICU beds.
There is a system in place for home remote monitoring by using smart devices, which include home pulse and oxygen monitors for those patients who have mild symptoms.
I think that few places in the world have been as well prepared for an upcoming second wave of Covid-19.
Ahh, I see now I misread it.
My eyes aren't the best at the moment. Dealing with an eye condition.
Ahh, I see now I misread it.
Gotcha, Owain - I've misread things, too, when I had new glasses & contacts ! All is well
As for the anti-vaxxers "control" thing, I'm neither entertaining nor understanding their batshit-crazy stance - how in the world does harming themselves equate to "control" ?
I mean, there's the freedom, of course, to die - isolated, alone, and in excruciating pain - and, honestly, I'd be fine with that, but their "freedom" means infecting others, and I'm NOT fine with that...
Just watch any of the ICU "I Was Wrong !" and "I Regret My Decisions..." videos on Youtube - there are hundreds and hundreds of them - and then follow the trail to the inevitable begging via GoFundMe to cover their funeral costs.
Sorry/Not Sorry, Typhoid Larry, but people who have been adhering to Covid safety protocols since the beginning just don't give a damn
Yes, that's what "entertain" means in that context.
https://www.oxfordlearnersdictionaries.com/us/definition/english/entertain
Careful you don't leave yourself so open-minded that logic and reason wander out the door, and Holocaust Deniers and QAnon insurrections and the like take up residence, because if you're willing to lend credence to this deep state anti-vaxxer bullshit, you're already in the same neighborhood. And once the people they support gain unconditional power like in an attempted coup, they don't care about allowing the open-mindedness or very identity of others they don't like to be legally protected, so you could be shooting yourself in the foot.
So, just out of curiosity, since Donald Trump was the head of government when the COVID-19 vaccines were first commissioned, how is he not a part of "Operation Control the Population by Giving them Cancer Through Covid Vaccines"? The alleged deep state can only do so much outside his and Congress' purview. If he's in on it then why are the same people putting forth these conspiracies supporting his return to power?
Where is the rise in cancer cases that should roughly parallel the increase in the number of people receiving the mRNA vaccine? There should be an incredible spike in new cancer cases over the yearly average since the vaccines have been delivered en masse to the public, but none has materialized.
How exactly would this program be advantageous to the government anyway? You'd be killing off or temporarily/permanently disabling a huge portion of your voting base, workforce, and consumer base, thus devastating the economy and causing you to have less political support (which again, only works for people supporting a coup where they could get unconditional and unilateral power). You'd be committing the federal and state governments to trillions of dollars in expenditures for cancer treatments through Medicare and Medicaid. You'd be placing the mostly elderly (on both sides) and mostly vaccinated Congress in greater danger since they'd have less chance of survival from cancer than younger people would. Are they looking to kill themselves or the politicians they support off?
Where's the evidence from reputable sources? I can produce documentation from specialists in cancer research and vaccines that this is nonsense. Where's the proof from them?
https://www.mskcc.org/coronavirus/myths-about-covid-19-vaccines
Open-mindedness as a philosophy is a good one, but it must always be tempered by responsible skepticism and a good BS filter. And I'd argue that actual good faith open-mindedness is the furthest thing from what these politically motivated anti-vaxxers actually want. For them, their calls for "open-mindedness" are merely a means to an end to get their foot in the door, after which they slam it shut on anyone who doesn't conform to their particular (and often bigoted) standards.
If anyone has a genuine reason to be skeptical of the government offering vaccines, it's black people, on account of the Tuskegee Experiments and other abuses of power, but they're not the ones offering the biggest opposition to the Covid vaccines. It's mostly cisgendered, heterosexual, white people who have never had to face institutional bigotry from law enforcement, schools, businesses, government, or medical care in their lives who are the main driving force behind this anti-vaxxer movement, so I have little sympathy for them. Their opposition is rooted in nothing deeper then "stickin' it to the Libs", mindless cultism, and selfishness.
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No worries.Ahh, I see now I misread it.
I won't.
Gotcha, Owain - I've misread things, too, when I had new glasses & contacts ! All is well
Yeah, mine is kind of beyond that at this point, but thankfully only temporary. I've always worn glasses, but this makes it worse. Somehow got a blister in the back of my eye due to a buildup of fluid, which lifts the retina causing distortion and changes in focal point. It's a rare enough condition that they don't really know what causes it, and the only thing to do is wait 3-6 months for it to heal. I've kind of had to learn how to find ways to deal with it, but reading things like a screen can take me twice as long. It's a weird feeling because everything feels so separated if that makes any sense.
Oh, no ! I'm so sorry !
Sending hugs, Owain, and I'm hoping for your quick and complete return to health
so today my football team (soccer) has several players missing because of covid, some of whom was because in the UK if you have not been vaccinated then you have to isolate if you are a contact.
while I have no issue with people choosing not to be vaccinated I hope they have had their pay docked because they have not taken every step possible to ensure they are available for work
while I have no issue with people choosing not to be vaccinated I hope they have had their pay docked because they have not taken every step possible to ensure they are available for work
Just seen, concerning the Pfizer/Omicron variant...
The new coronavirus variant, called omicron, was first identified in South Africa only about a month ago and is already spreading quickly in Europe and North America. It has an exceptionally high number of mutations, and those mutations appear to make it more transmissible than the delta variant.
Now scientists in South Africa have just released the first data looking at how well the vaccines will work against the omicron variant. And the news is mixed.
The study comes from researchers at South Africa's largest private health insurer, called Discovery Health, and the South African Medical Research Council. In the study, described at a press briefing on Tuesday, scientists analyzed data from 78,000 people likely infected with omicron. Nearly half of them had received two doses of the Pfizer vaccine.
The study focused on the Pfizer vaccine. The Moderna shot isn't available in South Africa. In general, though, the two vaccines have behaved quite similarly against new variants, with the Moderna vaccine slightly more effective.
In the population in the South African study, the Pfizer vaccine's effectiveness against infection dropped down to about 30% for the omicron variant, compared with about 80% against the variant before omicron, the scientists reported.
That means the Pfizer vaccine reduces a person's risk of getting infected by about 30% compared to somebody who's not immunized.
By comparison, in the delta surge that began this summer in the U.S., the mRNA vaccines — Pfizer and Moderna — had an effectiveness of about 60% to 70% against infection, several studies have found.
With 30% effectiveness, there will be very many breakthrough infections.
But this new study does offer really good news when it comes to vaccine protection against severe disease: That dropped a bit but not nearly as much as protection against infection.
https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsa...tion-may-drop-to-30-but-does-cut-severe-disea
The new coronavirus variant, called omicron, was first identified in South Africa only about a month ago and is already spreading quickly in Europe and North America. It has an exceptionally high number of mutations, and those mutations appear to make it more transmissible than the delta variant.
Now scientists in South Africa have just released the first data looking at how well the vaccines will work against the omicron variant. And the news is mixed.
The study comes from researchers at South Africa's largest private health insurer, called Discovery Health, and the South African Medical Research Council. In the study, described at a press briefing on Tuesday, scientists analyzed data from 78,000 people likely infected with omicron. Nearly half of them had received two doses of the Pfizer vaccine.
The study focused on the Pfizer vaccine. The Moderna shot isn't available in South Africa. In general, though, the two vaccines have behaved quite similarly against new variants, with the Moderna vaccine slightly more effective.
In the population in the South African study, the Pfizer vaccine's effectiveness against infection dropped down to about 30% for the omicron variant, compared with about 80% against the variant before omicron, the scientists reported.
That means the Pfizer vaccine reduces a person's risk of getting infected by about 30% compared to somebody who's not immunized.
By comparison, in the delta surge that began this summer in the U.S., the mRNA vaccines — Pfizer and Moderna — had an effectiveness of about 60% to 70% against infection, several studies have found.
With 30% effectiveness, there will be very many breakthrough infections.
But this new study does offer really good news when it comes to vaccine protection against severe disease: That dropped a bit but not nearly as much as protection against infection.
https://www.npr.org/sections/goatsa...tion-may-drop-to-30-but-does-cut-severe-disea
I've had cold symptoms since yesterday and it hurts when I cough but a covid test today was negative. I have sore joints and a runny nose but don't have a headache and not needed Lemsips yet. Hoping a few hot toddies and an early night under every blanket I can find will help.
Can premium members delete their own posts?
Sending virtual tea, hugs, and another warm blanket for you, Malica !
So glad it's not Covid - hope you are well soon
I think anyone can, Shapeshifter - I've deleted a few of my own when I'd accidentally posted something in the wrong thread, so I don't think it's a matter of being a premium member or not.
At the very bottom of a post is your option to delete like this - Westie1701, 3 minutes ago Edit Delete Report
Hopefully it's nothing serious, and you're feeling better soon!
If you can't, just PM me a link to the post in question and I can do it for you (as long as it's in this forum).
Some interesting (yet scary) information released by the Ontario Science Advisory Table:
@shapeshifter already mentioned the drop in effectiveness against infection by Omicron with two Pfizer doses. The good news is that after a third dose, the effectiveness goes back up to around 75%.
Unfortunately for people who were double dosed with AstraZeneca, according to the UK Health Security Agency, preliminary data shows the effectiveness against symptomatic infection may be close to 0% against Omicron.
My local health unit has already declared that Omicron is the dominant strain in our region as of Monday. Kingston is currently having a large Omicron-fueled outbreak; their case counts have increased 191% since last week. If no further public health restrictions are added in the meantime, Omicron is projected to entirely supplant Delta in Ontario by Christmas.
- Ontario had 1500 new cases announced on Monday the 13th, up 73% from the Monday prior
- Cases of the Omicron variant are doubling every three days
- Omicron's effective reproduction number (R) is currently tracking at 4.01, versus 1.09 for Delta
- Omicron is expected to become the dominant strain in Ontario by the end of this week
@shapeshifter already mentioned the drop in effectiveness against infection by Omicron with two Pfizer doses. The good news is that after a third dose, the effectiveness goes back up to around 75%.
Unfortunately for people who were double dosed with AstraZeneca, according to the UK Health Security Agency, preliminary data shows the effectiveness against symptomatic infection may be close to 0% against Omicron.
My local health unit has already declared that Omicron is the dominant strain in our region as of Monday. Kingston is currently having a large Omicron-fueled outbreak; their case counts have increased 191% since last week. If no further public health restrictions are added in the meantime, Omicron is projected to entirely supplant Delta in Ontario by Christmas.
Thank you. I figured out what happened. I posted the contents of post 1734 above in two places, (17051) the differing responses to each blew my mind.
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