I've tried to fix this up. What have I gotten wrong?
Constellation class
- Thread starter Bill Morris
- Start date
LOOKS good to me,but I am preety sure SOMEbody here will say otherwise. Oh is it just me or does the Stargazer look a wee bit SCRUNCHED up? I mean the top of the suaser section looks SWOLLEN! Almost like a borg cube sukerpunched it.
Not bad, a few things though.
1) I'm pretty sure the torpedo launchers should be at the extremes of the nacelle struts (where you have the orange strip on the upper one). The ones on the model don't precisely match those found on the refit Enterprise, but there do seem to be tube openings there.
2) The impulse engines shouldn't cross through the centerline, and should run vertically in the two 'blocks' to either side of the rear section. Also, according to an article written for the Star Trek: Magazine a few years back, the antimatter pods should be stored basically where you show the impulse engine now, because they can be ejected out the back. (That article also had a cross section from forward. It can be found on Ex Astris here, down the page a bit.)
3) I blinked at the launch date of 2291. It seems a little early for a ship with a registry of NCC-9754. Maybe more like 2305?
Other than that, very nice.
1) I'm pretty sure the torpedo launchers should be at the extremes of the nacelle struts (where you have the orange strip on the upper one). The ones on the model don't precisely match those found on the refit Enterprise, but there do seem to be tube openings there.
2) The impulse engines shouldn't cross through the centerline, and should run vertically in the two 'blocks' to either side of the rear section. Also, according to an article written for the Star Trek: Magazine a few years back, the antimatter pods should be stored basically where you show the impulse engine now, because they can be ejected out the back. (That article also had a cross section from forward. It can be found on Ex Astris here, down the page a bit.)
3) I blinked at the launch date of 2291. It seems a little early for a ship with a registry of NCC-9754. Maybe more like 2305?
Other than that, very nice.
Thanks, Praetor. I was guessing at the launch date. I'll make it 2305.
Here's a nice shot of a fliming model:
http://lcars24.com/const-imp.jpg
That seems to show the impulse engines on the center line but forward from where I had them, and the antimatter storage goes a little more aft than the warp core in special compartments that allow quick emergency ejection at the drop of a sombrero. And there seems to be a single warp core, part of which acts as a spare.
Here's the latest update of the image, with probably more left to change.
http://lcars24.com/constel4.png
Here's a nice shot of a fliming model:
http://lcars24.com/const-imp.jpg
That seems to show the impulse engines on the center line but forward from where I had them, and the antimatter storage goes a little more aft than the warp core in special compartments that allow quick emergency ejection at the drop of a sombrero. And there seems to be a single warp core, part of which acts as a spare.
Here's the latest update of the image, with probably more left to change.
http://lcars24.com/constel4.png
An update:
Better, I'd say. Still not sure about the impulse... I had always thought those were more hatches - there seems to be another one on the little pod at the bottom of the nacelle strut platform, but arguably that could be another impulse engine. For the MSD it may be the best compromise where you have them though. Also not sure about the forward launcher placement, but there are enough greeblies that I guess they could go there. It just seems odd to me on a Constitution-refit style saucer I guess.
But still, very nice
But still, very nice
Granted that most reference photos are fuzzy, but it seems to me that the junctions of the T-shaped engine pylons each hold the standard torpedo tube pair that we can see on the neck of a refitted Constitution or the pod of a Miranda. The assembly sits just below (or, in the lower pylon, above) the horizontal part of the T. The muzzles just aren't painted or lit particularly prominently - much like the impulse assemblies lack the lighting arrangment found in the original Constitution application.
http://www.stargazertwo.com/Images/Stargazer/valkyrie.jpg
In contrast, there's nothing in the saucer to indicate the presence of torp tubes there. There are just those three paired phaser emitters on each side, plus five single ones on the dorsal side - and supposedly at least one corresponding single emitter just below the bow because a single beam is fired from there in the "Peak Performance" mock fight.
The big square feature at the bow of the ship isn't painted or lit all that clearly, either - allowing us to select between two functions. Yeah, it could be a giant shuttlebay door. But the ship already has two doors per side for such a function. So the square could just as well be a deflector dish. We only see a total of three Constellation class ships in Star Trek, and the first two ("The Battle", "Peak Performance") are wrecks whose deflectors could justifiably be dark, while the bow of the third ("Redemption") is never seen.
Timo Saloniemi
Edit: Whoops, there's also a fourth Constellation briefly glimpsed: the Victory makes a bow-first appearance at the end of "Elementary, Dear Data", without a glowing bow. Then again, we know that TOS movie era deflectors don't glow much unless the ship is underway, while TNG era deflectors always have a very subdued glow...
http://www.stargazertwo.com/Images/Stargazer/valkyrie.jpg
In contrast, there's nothing in the saucer to indicate the presence of torp tubes there. There are just those three paired phaser emitters on each side, plus five single ones on the dorsal side - and supposedly at least one corresponding single emitter just below the bow because a single beam is fired from there in the "Peak Performance" mock fight.
The big square feature at the bow of the ship isn't painted or lit all that clearly, either - allowing us to select between two functions. Yeah, it could be a giant shuttlebay door. But the ship already has two doors per side for such a function. So the square could just as well be a deflector dish. We only see a total of three Constellation class ships in Star Trek, and the first two ("The Battle", "Peak Performance") are wrecks whose deflectors could justifiably be dark, while the bow of the third ("Redemption") is never seen.
Timo Saloniemi
Edit: Whoops, there's also a fourth Constellation briefly glimpsed: the Victory makes a bow-first appearance at the end of "Elementary, Dear Data", without a glowing bow. Then again, we know that TOS movie era deflectors don't glow much unless the ship is underway, while TNG era deflectors always have a very subdued glow...
Yeah, that demonstrates pretty well the torpedo thing: the "original" kitbash had its engine pylons made of Constitution neck pieces that had the torpedo decks in their usual places, while the full photographic model was somewhat differently shaped but still retained this feature without accentuating the torpedo muzzles.
Timo Saloniemi
Timo Saloniemi
Okay, I moved them like this. That should be reasonable, Picard's model nowithstanding.
Now, what about that auxillary bridge and what I have labeled sensory array in a thing shaped like a Tucker turret on the underside of the saucer?
And here's collection of photos of the filming models.
http://www.starfleetmodeler.com/Starships/Constellation Class/default.htm
Now, what about that auxillary bridge and what I have labeled sensory array in a thing shaped like a Tucker turret on the underside of the saucer?
And here's collection of photos of the filming models.
http://www.starfleetmodeler.com/Starships/Constellation Class/default.htm
I might suggest the "auxiliary bridge" is in fact the location of the warp core. For one, it would have an unobstructed vertical path for ejection, unlike in the case of a vertical core in the pylons. And its hatchlike elements could be how the fuel tanks are topped up. The drive plasma would fire up along the leading edge of the pylons, then.
The lance-like protrusion underneath the hull could be a sensor element - but it also shares something with the cylinders we see at the corners of Miranda class roll bars.
So perhaps a supergun, even though we never saw those cylinders act in a gunlike manner on the Mirandas. Or, as I'd prefer, this cylinder could be a miniature form of the front end of Kirk's ship: this could be the main deflector of the Constellation, just like the pods on the Miranda would be its main deflectors.
Also, the big bulges on the underside flanking this "lance" could be the fuel tanks of the ship. That is, instead of the neat multiple "canisters" inside the hull, this ship could have two large volumes basically similar to the tanks of the Galaxy.
Just wild suggestions. The ship appears just fine as it is in that latest MSD.
Timo Saloniemi
The lance-like protrusion underneath the hull could be a sensor element - but it also shares something with the cylinders we see at the corners of Miranda class roll bars.
So perhaps a supergun, even though we never saw those cylinders act in a gunlike manner on the Mirandas. Or, as I'd prefer, this cylinder could be a miniature form of the front end of Kirk's ship: this could be the main deflector of the Constellation, just like the pods on the Miranda would be its main deflectors.
Also, the big bulges on the underside flanking this "lance" could be the fuel tanks of the ship. That is, instead of the neat multiple "canisters" inside the hull, this ship could have two large volumes basically similar to the tanks of the Galaxy.
Just wild suggestions. The ship appears just fine as it is in that latest MSD.
Timo Saloniemi
It'd be pretty easy to miss the torpedo tubes from the refit models which were used to build it, though that's partly because they'd only seem capable of covering the ship's aft arc.
That's a nice idea, but that would also lead to a LOT of power transfer conduits. Still, other ships seem to have a lot of PTC, and perhaps the main part of the core with the dilithium chamber can be ejected after the antimatter pods anyway, leaving behind just PTCs? Alternatively, it could be some type of dedicated astrometrics-type 'observatory.'
I think Rick Sternbach wrote in his writeup for the Star Trek Magazine that it was a long-range 'sensor gun' more or less like you say it's analagous to the main sensor on the Constitution. The main deflector could still be kept where it is.
You know, those have always bothered me. I'd say they're either deuterium tanks or the Starfleet ship equivalent of 'radar domes.'
Agreed.
I had a vision from the wormhole aliens, telling me I had gone astray . . .
. . . and must walk a different path.
. . . and must walk a different path.
Hmm... I'd still argue that the torpedo tubes indicated by the model are all pointing forward from the pylon junctures, as per the reuse of Constitution-refit neck elements, and that this ship lacks aft torpedo tubes since there aren't suitable surface features for them. Or if there's an aft tube or a pair of them, it would go between the impulse engines where there are some greeblies on the desktop model and a greebled cover plate for the motion control arm in the photographic model.
Also, the warp core should probably have a central reaction chamber thingamabob, as portrayed in "Peak Performance", rather than a featureless straight shaft. Okay, so the Hathaway might have had a reactor refit, as many of her consoles also looked more modern than those of the Stargazer. But in that case, the reactor in this MSD might be made more "TMP'ish" still.
Timo Saloniemi
Also, the warp core should probably have a central reaction chamber thingamabob, as portrayed in "Peak Performance", rather than a featureless straight shaft. Okay, so the Hathaway might have had a reactor refit, as many of her consoles also looked more modern than those of the Stargazer. But in that case, the reactor in this MSD might be made more "TMP'ish" still.
Timo Saloniemi
Thanks, Timo. This shot of one of the filming models shows a door at the rear for the strut between the top two nacelles that I assumed was for a probe\torpedo launcher. Am I wrong about that?
http://lcars24.com/const-imp.jpg
I also mistakenly took other features on this model for the impulse engines before seeing th error of my ways.
About the intermix chamber and adjacent equipment, I thought I was moving that away from the impluse engines just to make it easy on the viewer but ended up not putting it in the new location. I'll fix that. Thanks for spotting my error.
Thanks, Praetor. Locating the anitmatter pods between the two sets of impulse engines depicted sounds good. I think I'll do that.
The reason I shortened the core was for conformity with this aft cutaway published in Star Trek: The Magazine, which I could perhaps just as easily ignore, since it's not really canon.
http://lcars24.com/constcut.jpg
Those are actually the bottom nacelles... The ship is mounted upside down in that picture!
Okay, that could be a door covering a torpedo tube - especially when the torpedo decks on the pylon junctures also have doors (or, in reality, don't have the muzzle bits glued on). Or, if we want to get fancy, it could be a door for a trailing sensor array...
Timo Saloniemi
I may be wrong (and maybe Timo wants to have a look to see what he thinks, or maybe we could conjur up Rick Sternbach) but I think that's a Shane Johnson/'Mr. Scott's Guide' style computer core coming up from the 'processors' at the bottom to connect to the underside of the bridge.
At least that's always what I thought since it wasn't explicitly labelled 'intermix chamber' and seemed to flow into the part labeled 'computer core.' It never entered my mind that it might be the warp core but now I'm having my doubts.
And that mystery door... that I just can't figure what would be most logical for it to be.
Here and here are great links from Doug Drexler's blog where the Constellation/Stargazer is discussed a bit, particularly the differences between Picard's model and the filming model.
Similar threads
