Chivalry: It's dead, Jim.

[Tiberius Jim]

I'm posting this from aboard my morning BART (Bay Area Rapid Transit) train on my wat to school in San Francisco. Morning trains are always very full, as most people are on their way to work at this time. I get on at the first stop though, so depending on when I get on there are usually seats available. However, I usually elect to stand in one of the open areas and lean against a wall. I'll be sitting in glass all day, and there's sure to be a woman or an elderly person who I'd gladly give my seat up to so it's just easier to stand to begin with. Call me old fashioned, but I always feel like a dick if I'm sitting and a lady or older person is forced to stand.

Not everyone seems to share this feeling. Just 10 minutes ago, a man and a woman got on the train. Both parties appear to be very able bodied, probably in their 40s. There was one seat open on this car. The man looked at the woman, looked at the seat...and sat down like he was playing a game of musical chairs and the penalty of losing was death. The lady is now standing over by one of the doors, around about 5 other guys sitting.

So am I alone here? Is it no longer seen as the right thing to do to give up a seat for a woman? Or is it politically incorrect and am I somehow implying that women are "too weak" to stand up on a train? Is that why these guys don't give their seats; a fear of offending someone? Or are they just lazy and inconsiderate?

 

[Michael Chris]

For the most part I think it's laziness. However, I have been guilty of this when I am absolutely exhausted.

 

[John Picard]

I'm posting this from aboard my morning BART (Bay Area Rapid Transit) train on my wat to school in San Francisco. Morning trains are always very full, as most people are on their way to work at this time. I get on at the first stop though, so depending on when I get on there are usually seats available. However, I usually elect to stand in one of the open areas and lean against a wall. I'll be sitting in glass all day, and there's sure to be a woman or an elderly person who I'd gladly give my seat up to so it's just easier to stand to begin with. Call me old fashioned, but I always feel like a dick if I'm sitting and a lady or older person is forced to stand.

Not everyone seems to share this feeling. Just 10 minutes ago, a man and a woman got on the train. Both parties appear to be very able bodied, probably in their 40s. There was one seat open on this car. The man looked at the woman, looked at the seat...and sat down like he was playing a game of musical chairs and the penalty of losing was death. The lady is now standing over by one of the doors, around about 5 other guys sitting.

So am I alone here? Is it no longer seen as the right thing to do to give up a seat for a woman? Or is it politically incorrect and am I somehow implying that women are "too weak" to stand up on a train? Is that why these guys don't give their seats; a fear of offending someone? Or are they just lazy and inconsiderate?

You are not alone.

I always defer a seat to a lady, the elderly, and the infirmed.

 

[shrantastic]

I'm posting this from aboard my morning BART (Bay Area Rapid Transit) train on my wat to school in San Francisco. Morning trains are always very full, as most people are on their way to work at this time. I get on at the first stop though, so depending on when I get on there are usually seats available. However, I usually elect to stand in one of the open areas and lean against a wall. I'll be sitting in glass all day, and there's sure to be a woman or an elderly person who I'd gladly give my seat up to so it's just easier to stand to begin with. Call me old fashioned, but I always feel like a dick if I'm sitting and a lady or older person is forced to stand.

Not everyone seems to share this feeling. Just 10 minutes ago, a man and a woman got on the train. Both parties appear to be very able bodied, probably in their 40s. There was one seat open on this car. The man looked at the woman, looked at the seat...and sat down like he was playing a game of musical chairs and the penalty of losing was death. The lady is now standing over by one of the doors, around about 5 other guys sitting.

So am I alone here? Is it no longer seen as the right thing to do to give up a seat for a woman? Or is it politically incorrect and am I somehow implying that women are "too weak" to stand up on a train? Is that why these guys don't give their seats; a fear of offending someone? Or are they just lazy and inconsiderate?

Look at her feet- if she's wearing high heels, offer her the seat. Sneakers, let it ride. Loafers you can pro-rate.

Seriously though, standing won't kill me (unless I'm carrying a ton of stuff). Offering your seat is a very considerate gesture, and I would not be offended or weirded out by it.

 

[TheLonelySquire]

I'm posting this from aboard my morning BART (Bay Area Rapid Transit) train on my wat to school in San Francisco. Morning trains are always very full, as most people are on their way to work at this time. I get on at the first stop though, so depending on when I get on there are usually seats available. However, I usually elect to stand in one of the open areas and lean against a wall. I'll be sitting in glass all day, and there's sure to be a woman or an elderly person who I'd gladly give my seat up to so it's just easier to stand to begin with. Call me old fashioned, but I always feel like a dick if I'm sitting and a lady or older person is forced to stand.

Not everyone seems to share this feeling. Just 10 minutes ago, a man and a woman got on the train. Both parties appear to be very able bodied, probably in their 40s. There was one seat open on this car. The man looked at the woman, looked at the seat...and sat down like he was playing a game of musical chairs and the penalty of losing was death. The lady is now standing over by one of the doors, around about 5 other guys sitting.

So am I alone here? Is it no longer seen as the right thing to do to give up a seat for a woman? Or is it politically incorrect and am I somehow implying that women are "too weak" to stand up on a train? Is that why these guys don't give their seats; a fear of offending someone? Or are they just lazy and inconsiderate?

It's not the PC thing to do but it IS the RIGHT thing to do.

 

[DanTheGrey]

I usually won't sit down if the bus is getting crowded, unless there are seats towards the back. If I'm past the back door of the bus I don't bother getting up because all of the priority seating is at the front of the bus and usually people stack up at the front of the bus when it comes to standing rather than shuffling back.

I have seen where there is this gaggle of 40somethingish women that take up one side of the front corner of the bus because of the L shape of the seats and I have never seen one of them get up to let someone else take a seat ever, even when you have elderly people with canes getting on while they're all sitting there oblivious.

 

[Hermiod]

Did the man pay the same price for his ticket ? If so, he's entitled to the same opportunity to take a seat as the woman. Your ticket entitles you to carriage, not comfort.

Unless men get a discomfort discount, why should an able-bodied woman take precedence ?

Two stops in to my Tube journey every morning, I see the same woman barge her way on to the train through the people trying to get off. When she, as often happens, doesn't get a seat because they were all already taken she goes and stands right in front of people she knows will regularly get off within a couple of stops.

 

[The Lady Eve]

I would never want a man to give up his seat for me; I'm in good shape and why the hell should he? That said, I get pissed off (at both sexes) when they fail to offer their seats to the elderly, obviously ill people or pregnant women.

 

[Vulcan Princess]

I used to commute on BART from Fremont to San Francisco. I would generally get a seat on the morning commute because I got on at the first stop. However, I would give up my seat for someone who was elderly or disabled.

On the way home, I almost never got a seat until near the end of the line, and it didn't really bother me. I don't deserve any special privileges based on my gender. First come, first served. The men have just as much a right to the seats as I do.

(Honestly, though, I wonder about the cleanliness of those seats. Sometimes standing is better...)

 

[JonathonWally]

Look at her feet- if she's wearing high heels, offer her the seat. Sneakers, let it ride. Loafers you can pro-rate.

Um, no one forced her to wear the high heels. It's first come first serve to a seat.

Elderly or infirmed man or woman, sure, I'll give them my seat. Just for being a woman though? No.

 

[Jan]

I would never want a man to give up his seat for me; I'm in good shape and why the hell should he? That said, I get pissed off (at both sexes) when they fail to offer their seats to the elderly, obviously ill people or pregnant women.

Agreed, though it's seldom I'm on public transportation. By the same token I'm always very appreciative when somebody would offer me their seat in deference to my grey hair even if I don't take them up on it.

Jan

 

[SGx]

Haha. I offered my seat to a pregnant woman once, she was really offended. Turned out she wasn't pregnant =/

 

[nevermore]

Look at her feet- if she's wearing high heels, offer her the seat. Sneakers, let it ride. Loafers you can pro-rate.

Um, no one forced her to wear the high heels. It's first come first serve to a seat.

Elderly or infirmed man or woman, sure, I'll give them my seat. Just for being a woman though? No.

This. I neither need nor want special treatment simply by virtue of my gender. And I sure as hell don't think people should be rewarded for wearing impractical shoes.

 

[Trekker4747]

I'm posting this from aboard my morning BART (Bay Area Rapid Transit) train on my wat to school in San Francisco. Morning trains are always very full, as most people are on their way to work at this time. I get on at the first stop though, so depending on when I get on there are usually seats available. However, I usually elect to stand in one of the open areas and lean against a wall. I'll be sitting in glass all day, and there's sure to be a woman or an elderly person who I'd gladly give my seat up to so it's just easier to stand to begin with. Call me old fashioned, but I always feel like a dick if I'm sitting and a lady or older person is forced to stand.

Not everyone seems to share this feeling. Just 10 minutes ago, a man and a woman got on the train. Both parties appear to be very able bodied, probably in their 40s. There was one seat open on this car. The man looked at the woman, looked at the seat...and sat down like he was playing a game of musical chairs and the penalty of losing was death. The lady is now standing over by one of the doors, around about 5 other guys sitting.

So am I alone here? Is it no longer seen as the right thing to do to give up a seat for a woman? Or is it politically incorrect and am I somehow implying that women are "too weak" to stand up on a train? Is that why these guys don't give their seats; a fear of offending someone? Or are they just lazy and inconsiderate?

It's not the PC thing to do but it IS the RIGHT thing to do.

Yep. Women are so weak they can't simply stand for a few minutes.

If the person is able bodied they can stand. If they're infirm, pregnant, elderly, maybe have a lot of packages, sure, give the person the seat.

But an able-bodied adult? They can stand.

 

[Mr. Laser Beam]

Chivalry isn't dead. I've just been in New York, and I've seen several instances of New Yorkers giving up their seats for people who really need it. Even on really crowded trains like the Lexington Avenue lines (4, 5 and 6).

You wander into the right field bleachers at Yankee Stadium with Red Sox gear on, though...that's another story.

 

[MANT!]

Perhaps it's the way I was taught but I always offer a woman the seat, even if I'm loaded down, it's up to her if she accepts. Most women actually don't, but every now and again, I get a thank you however, I insist that the eldery or infirm get the seat I have.

It just feels right to me.

 

[TheBrew]

There is nothing wrong with offering a woman your seat.

There is nothing wrong with not doing the same.

Maybe the guy was going to SFO... I know I would want to sit the whole way.

 

[Captain Shaw]

I would give up my seat for a elderly person but i do not except a person to give up there seat for me just because i am a women.

 

[Trekker4747]

I would give up my seat for a elderly person but i do not except a person to give up there seat for me just because i am a women.

Multiple Personality Disorder?

 

[kimc]

Look at her feet- if she's wearing high heels, offer her the seat. Sneakers, let it ride. Loafers you can pro-rate.

Seriously though, standing won't kill me (unless I'm carrying a ton of stuff). Offering your seat is a very considerate gesture, and I would not be offended or weirded out by it.

I agree. It's also a very sexy gesture for those guys who wish to be appealing to the opposite sex and again very appreciated by those of us in heels.

However, heels or not I would surrender my seat to an elderly or handicapped person.