Can't Stomach Blu-Ray

[hamudm]

The marginal increase on the existing disc format does not inspire me to get on board.

If you say so! The difference in pixel density in 480p and 1080p is a lot more then marginal. If it personally isn't worth it to you, then sure, but the increase in resolution is comparable... from 375x250 (approx) in VHS to 720x480 for DVD to 1920x1080 for Blu-Ray. DVD is a little under 4 times the pixel density of VHS and Blu-Ray is a little over 4 times the pixel density of DVD. With good hardware, the difference between all three of these formats should be obvious.

I'm not a tech hound so your numbers mean nothing to me.
I do say its marginal so thank you for agreeing with me.

Call me when the next format change happens where I can really see that big leap.

No offense intended, but I think you should invest in glasses in a hearing aid in lieu of a home theatre if the difference isn't astounding and obvious given decent equipment and a well-mastered blu-ray!

 

[Harvey]

It really isn't a big enough leap to become a mass format.

Yes, it is. And it's happening right now. Go into any Blockbuster or Hollywood and watch as their blu-ray section gets larger and larger, week after week. Six months ago when I got my blu-ray there were almost no movies available for rent -- Hollywood has like two shelves. Now you can rent hundreds of movies. I don't recall DVDs growing this fast.

Then you have a short memory. I rememer DVD exploding in a way that VHS never interested me or my family.

But still, in one more year Blu-Ray will begin to significantly supplant DVD. You can see Blu-Ray exclusive features, and some films (like the Watchmen Director's Cut) going exclusive to the format (at least, I think it's a Blu exclusive), but the majority of discs are going out side by side with regular DVD releases. Watch for that to change and it'll be time to upgrade...

 

[Captain Craig]

I'm not a tech hound so your numbers mean nothing to me.
I do say its marginal so thank you for agreeing with me.

Call me when the next format change happens where I can really see that big leap.

Then I'll put it simply for you: the increase in quality from VHS to DVD is slightly less then the increase from DVD to Blu-Ray. Therefore, calling it marginal is wrong.

If you don't care, then great, more power to you. But if you think the difference is marginal, then you're wrong.

I can accept that in "technical terms" perhaps there is a big difference. I'll agree that for you tech hounds those numeric differences are impressive and considered "big improvement".

I see the displays at Best Buy where the Blu-Ray is playing on the latest HD TV and has the best sound hooked up. When its there on display I look at it and think marginal increase, not worth my money. It visually and audibily does not impressive me enough. Maybe I should say 'yet' cause as noted filmmakers/tv makers aren't shooting in consideration for Blu-Ray to really shine.

When Blu-Ray players come down I may get one, in 2-4yrs, cause they play my DVD's anyway, right? Not that I'll be buying Blu-Ray but because that player most likely will be dominating the shelf, maybe.

DVD as it is now will be on shelves for another 10yrs. I postulate that as quick as technology as been evolving that Blu-Ray will be 'old' tech by the time the disc format is retired for something else in 2020.

No offense intended, but I think you should invest in glasses in a hearing aid in lieu of a home theatre if the difference isn't astounding and obvious given decent equipment and a well-mastered blu-ray!

None taken. I think some are just more easily impressed and/or eager to upgrade just because.

 

[Aragorn]

Once we have holodecks where guys can have orgies with Jessica Alba, Kate Beckinsale and Megan Fox whenever they want, no one will care about Blu-ray or DVD anymore.

 

[Arrqh]

I can accept that in "technical terms" perhaps there is a big difference. I'll agree that for you tech hounds those numeric differences are impressive and considered "big improvement".

Denigrating it as only being noticeably to "tech hounds" is equally inaccurate. The perceptual difference is significant enough for the average person to be able to see more then a marginal increase. Whether a person cares is, of course, another matter entirely.

I see the displays at Best Buy where the Blu-Ray is playing on the latest HD TV and has the best sound hooked up. When its there on display I look at it and think marginal increase, not worth my money. It visually and audibily does not impressive me enough. Maybe I should say 'yet' cause as noted filmmakers/tv makers aren't shooting in consideration for Blu-Ray to really shine.

Well perhaps that's your problem then... stores like Best Buy frequently don't setup their hardware very well, a problem common in most of the large chain stores. You can keep using the word marginal but as has already been pointed out to do so is inaccurate. Different people of course have different priorities and if visual quality isn't you're thing, then that's fine. There's no problem there. Heck, that's why I have a nice and large 1080p TV but no sound system... I personally care a lot more about visual quality then sound. But for you to try and describe the quality difference as not being very high in objective terms because of your personal preference, well that's just wrong. So if it isn't important to you, then more power to you, it's no skin off my nose. But if you continue to try and talk in objective terms then, no, using the descriptor "marginal" is objectively wrong. Because it is a fact that the quality difference when going from DVD to Blu-Ray is larger then the quality difference when going from VHS to DVD.

As for filmmakers/tv makers, that's already been discussed in this thread. Film, on average, has a perceptual quality much closer to Blu-Ray then DVD... and in fact is slightly higher then Blu-Ray in most cases. The only time a film would not look better on Blu-Ray is a poorly restored print or if noise reduction has been too aggressively applied. TV that's filmed for presentation in HDTV will without a doubt be best viewed on Blu-Ray as opposed to DVD.

But again, if you don't care, then you don't care. That's fine! But that doesn't change the objective benefits of the format.

 

[Out Of My Vulcan Mind]

In my experience upgrading to Blu-ray and/or upscaled DVD becomes essential if you upgrade to a sizable LCD television. Regular DVD looks fine on smaller sets, but it looks crappy on a 40-inch HD LCD. It loses depth and looks more like video than film. But if you run a regular DVD through a Blu-ray player with good upscaling then it looks very good indeed. Not quite as good as Blu-ray itself of course, but very good nonetheless.

 

[Amaris]

In my experience upgrading to Blu-ray and/or upscaled DVD becomes essential if you upgrade to a sizable LCD television. Regular DVD looks fine on smaller sets, but it looks crappy on a 40-inch HD LCD. It loses depth and looks more like video than film. But if you run a regular DVD through a Blu-ray player with good upscaling then it looks very good indeed. Not quite as good as Blu-ray itself of course, but very good nonetheless.

Actually, I can say that regular DVD does not look so good on smaller HD LCD sets. I have a 23" LCD HDTV 720p, and DVD looks terrible on it. Even upconverted DVDs on an "upconverting" DVD player looks terrible. The pixelation, jagginess and blurriness of the film quality makes it difficult for me to watch. When I got my Blu-ray player and hooked it up, played my DVDs in it, I was shocked at the quality. They looked great! So I put in a Blu-ray disc, in this case, Serenity, and I just about shit my pants, if you'll pardon the colloquialism, the quality was superb, the images sharp and crisp, the colors were bold and vibrant, and even on those tiny little LCD speakers, I could hear a higher quality of sound, things I missed when watching the DVD. There is a marked difference, and you can tell it even on a 23" inch 720p, so I can only imagine how it would look on a full 1080p 42+" HDTV!

J.

 

[Arrqh]

If you really want to see the difference, all you need is your computer assuming you have a high enough resolution. Go to Apple's movie trailer site and go get the Trek 11 trailer in 480p, 720p and 1080p. Because that's almost exactly what we're talking about here. I'm on my 13" MPB right now which has a resolution high enough to do 720p and even here there's a clear difference between 480p and 720p. On my 24" desktop monitor 1080p content looks great... the difference between 720p and 1080p is less startling, but between 480p and 1080p it's unmistakable.

Of course it's just as unmistakable on my 46" 1080p set. Plus then I get to sit on the couch

 

[Out Of My Vulcan Mind]

That's interesting that regular DVD looks bad on smaller LCDs. My 40-inch LCD is the first LCD I ever bought. My previous smaller sets were CRTs, which DVD looked all right on. And I agree that you need a Blu-ray player to properly upscale DVDs. I've seen DVD players that supposedly upscale and they don't do a good job of it at all. Maybe there are models that do, but I've yet to see one. On the other hand, I'm very happy with my Blu-ray player's upscaling. The only DVD I've come across in my collection so far that doesn't upscale well is The Lost World: Jurassic Park. Even upscaled the image lacks depth.

 

[Amaris]

If you really want to see the difference, all you need is your computer assuming you have a high enough resolution. Go to Apple's movie trailer site and go get the Trek 11 trailer in 480p, 720p and 1080p. Because that's almost exactly what we're talking about here. I'm on my 13" MPB right now which has a resolution high enough to do 720p and even here there's a clear difference between 480p and 720p. On my 24" desktop monitor 1080p content looks great... the difference between 720p and 1080p is less startling, but between 480p and 1080p it's unmistakable.

Of course it's just as unmistakable on my 46" 1080p set. Plus then I get to sit on the couch

Sometimes I forget my monitor is actually an HD LCD. It's a 17" Apple Flat panel unibody (iMac). It's capable of the 720p resolution. I'm waiting another year (and when I have a nice full time job) to get a big 1080p TV. The prices are dropping like a rock. What you could buy a 42" 720p a year ago, you can buy a 46" 1080p now. So I'm hoping a bit more of a drop between now and next year.

That's interesting that regular DVD looks bad on smaller LCDs. My 40-inch LCD is the first LCD I ever bought. My previous smaller sets were CRTs, which DVD looked all right on. And I agree that you need a Blu-ray player to properly upscale DVDs. I've seen DVD players that supposedly upscale and they don't do a good job of it at all. Maybe there are models that do, but I've yet to see one. On the other hand, I'm very happy with my Blu-ray player's upscaling. The only DVD I've come across in my collection so far that doesn't upscale well is The Lost World: Jurassic Park. Even upscaled the image lacks depth.

Oppo is the best hands down, but for the price of an Oppo DVD upscaler, you can buy a full fledged Blu-ray player. As for me, I love Star Trek V and have it on DVD. With the Blu-ray player, the El Capitan scenes at the beginning look far more beautiful. I am so tempted to buy the Blu-ray movie set but I need a little more prodding. I can't justify it yet. Then again, I haven't seen samples of the Blu-ray original Trek movie updates.

J.

 

[Herkimer Jitty]

Blu-Ray looks goddamned amazing. The only Blu-Ray movie so far that hasn't fucked my eye sockets out until I was writihing in ecstasy has been The French Connection - it seemed to have a distorted-as-shit transfer. Shame.

 

[Amaris]

Does anyone have any screenshots or a link to them of the Blu-Ray editions of the original Star Trek movies? I want them, but I need to justify it, since I have them all on DVD.


J.

 

[Herkimer Jitty]

Boom, baby.

 

[Amaris]

Boom, baby.

Thank you, sir!
And to sum up my thoughts after viewing said link, "WANT!"


J.

 

[Aragorn]

^ Even though it's not the TMP director's cut?

The TNG movie box set is coming out later this year.

Also, if anyone cares, the Deep Discount and DVD Planet 25% off sales end this weekend, so that's one way you can pick up some Blu-rays for cheap.

 

[Amaris]

^ Even though it's not the TMP director's cut?

Even without it, yes. I would love it for Star Trek V alone.

The TNG movie box set is coming out later this year.

Also, if anyone cares, the Deep Discount and DVD Planet 25% off sales end this weekend, so that's one way you can pick up some Blu-rays for cheap.

Amazon's got them for $66 a box set.
I wonder if DD and DP are cheaper.


J.

 

[Capt. Vulcan]

Wow, I just found out that blu-ray computer drives are under 100 bucks these days. Only really helps if you watch movies on your computer or you output to your hdtv, but still, it's getting pretty cheap. In fact blu-ray burners are under 300, although the media costs 5 bucks a disk at the cheapest.

 

[Aragorn]

Deep Discount is selling the TOS complete movie series on Blu for pretty much the same price as Amazon. So the 25% off coupon is a good deal if you're willing to wait (it's currently backordered there).

On a side note, who would just want the Trek II-IV trilogy box set?

 

[Skywalker]

The Watchmen Director's Cut was the first Blu-ray I've ever watched.

Sold.

 

[Trubinator]

DVD is definitely showing its age right now. I'm even noticing those little visual deficiencies on my 20 inch Samsung LCD monitor these days, so I think they'll be REALLY evident on the 40 or 42 inch LCD tv I'm looking to buy soonish.