Spoilers Avengers: Infinity War grade and discussion thread

Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by The Scrooge Doctor, Apr 23, 2018.

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How do you rate "Avengers: Infinity War"?

  1. A+

    22.4%
  2. A

    42.9%
  3. A-

    14.9%
  4. B+

    6.8%
  5. B

    7.5%
  6. B-

    1.9%
  7. C+

    1.2%
  8. C

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  9. C-

    0.6%
  10. D+

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  11. D

    1.9%
  12. D-

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  13. F

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. Captrek

    Captrek Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Based on JL, the one I’m looking forward to is Flash.

    Belatedly indeed. They’re going back to the 90’s for it, and DC still beat them by eighty years.
     
  2. TREK_GOD_1

    TREK_GOD_1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    True--all thanks to the essence of the films. Some cannot stand that the films were celebrated for said essence that finally brought a great, serious, adventurous Batman comic book movie to the screen.
     
  3. Anwar

    Anwar Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Because they weren't celebrated for that. They were celebrate for being creatively bankrupt and pretentious, right down to the music and the characters halting the film to give off operatic monologues for philosophies that are full of holes.
     
  4. JD

    JD Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    The Nolan Batman movies are great movies, but not really very good comic book movies. They're really not a very good representation of what the comic books are like. They're pretty much the most perfect examples of comic book movies that are ashamed of their source material you can find.
    As movies I love them and count them as some of my absolute favorites, but as adaptations they're not that great.
    I very much prefer the MCU movies, which are pretty much comic books brought to life.
     
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  5. Ovation

    Ovation Vice Admiral Admiral

    I’m sorry, but this “ashamed” label is drivel. The adaptation chose a particular style—and in and of itself, that choice is just as valid as any other. Making that choice in NO WAY indicates being “ashamed” of the source. If Nolan were ashamed, he simply wouldn’t have made any Batman movie. Why would he? It’s not like he was forced to make a Batman movie at gunpoint, or was coerced into it because his kid was a hostage.

    Not liking an adaptation is fine. Mischaracterizing the style of the adaptation is, frankly, puerile.
     
  6. JD

    JD Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    OK, maybe not ashamed, but he definitely didn't fully embrace the comics the way the MCU has.
     
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  7. LoChristmas

    LoChristmas I GAVE YOU MY HEART... Moderator

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    It embraced Batman: Year One and The Long Halloween pretty extensively as the two primary sources, with a few others inspiring various character traits and so forth. The more grounded, darker tone of the films and the reboot/origin story was a mandate from Warner Bros. who were trying to broaden the appeal of the films after the campiness of the Schumacher Batmans, and it predates hiring Nolan, so it's not really fair to lay the blame on him. They brought Nolan on because they knew what he could do and that's what they wanted from him.
     
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  8. TREK_GOD_1

    TREK_GOD_1 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    ^ Flawless reasoning.
    The "ashamed" line is an argument that there's only one way to make a comic adaptation, when the MCU's own Cap2 took the comic film in a far different direction, and for its effort, is considered one of the greatest of all superhero films, much like the Nolan Batman trilogy. There are clear reasons for that.

    True.
     
  9. Anwar

    Anwar Vice Admiral Admiral

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    TWS is really only considered that untouchable by the artsy-fartsy types who are...drumroll...ashamed of comics. To unashamed comic fans there are other CBMs that are on part with it that are wholly unashamed, like Guardians of the Galaxy or Infinity War. It comes down to whether or not you can stomach stuff like aliens, magic, costumes, the heroes actually being the lead instead of the villain, etc.

    And sadly, a lot of people still can't do that.

    To have a built-in audience and fanbase for his own story. This has happened before, with artsy-fartsy prima donnas having an idea and choosing to take over a pre-existing property to serve as a platform.
     
  10. Ovation

    Ovation Vice Admiral Admiral

    So what? Not every adaptation has to “fully embrace the comics” to be valid. (The rest of the post is a general point, not specific to you)

    One can be a fan of multiple approaches to adaptation simultaneously. I love the Nolan Batman films. Man of Steel is my favourite Superman film and, depending on my mood, my favourite superhero film. Winter Soldier is my favourite Captain America film. Buuutttt....

    I love the Guardians movies. The first Christopher Reeve Superman movie is awesome. I love Adam West’s Batman. I’m a big fan of the Ant-Man movies. I thoroughly enjoyed Doctor Strange. Had a great time watching Ragnorok. Can’t wait for Legends of Tomorrow to start again.

    So exactly how am I “ashamed” of comics? (And I haven’t even dwelt on the 7000+ comics in my possession, to which I add new ones each week)

    “Serious and grounded” are not a sign of shame—they’re an artistic choice. Don’t like that choice? Don’t watch the movie/show. Plenty of other things to watch out there. Also, don’t presume to know anyone’s state of mind if they say they like “serious and grounded” adaptations.
     
  11. JD

    JD Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    Just to make it clear, my comments about the Nolan movies were not meant to be a dig on them, like I said I absolutely love them and consider some of my favorite movies. For me, quality of adaptation and overall quality are two different things, and one doesn't always effect the other.
    I realize now that I shouldn't have framed it as right and wrong, like you said there really is nothing wrong with making a different creative choice than I would have preferred.
    I think I was just in a bad mood when I wrote those other posts.
     
  12. Mage

    Mage Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    So, I'm watching IW again here, and there's a line from Thanos that stood out for me. It always did and it always bugged me....

    He says, on Vormir, to Gamorra, "I ignored my destiny once". What did he mean with that??
     
  13. The Scrooge Doctor

    The Scrooge Doctor Bah humbug! Premium Member

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    Yeah, I think I asked the same question in my original review. So far, I haven't seen any explanation for that one.
     
  14. Starfury

    Starfury Commander Red Shirt

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    He still regrets that he never got around to read David Macks Destiny-Trilogy, even though he once had a week off, but decided to clean his armor instead.

    (he means titan. He suggested killing half the people randomly and dispassionately, but the leaders rejected his plan, and he didn't pull it off either)
     
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  15. Anwar

    Anwar Vice Admiral Admiral

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    He was probably talking about his homeworld and how he feels it's his fault what happened to his people.
     
  16. grendelsbayne

    grendelsbayne Commodore Commodore

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    Yeah, that's a pretty clear tie-in to what he said earlier about Titan. He offered a solution, they refused, and he allowed that to slide. Fast forward, now Titan looks like the wasteland we see in this movie. That's what he means by 'I ignored my destiny once'.
     
  17. Mage

    Mage Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Right, that's actually kinda obvious.....duh..... Thanks guys!
     
  18. theenglish

    theenglish Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    What would be an interesting twist is, if at the end of A4, the Avengers fix Thanos' snap and make things right, only to discover that there is ACTUALLY a greater threat on the way that could have been avoided if they had just let things be. Thanos solution would have saved the universe. Now the scene is set for the next big event in ten years time.
     
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  19. grendelsbayne

    grendelsbayne Commodore Commodore

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    An interesting thought. Do you have any ideas on what that bigger thing would be, though?

    In terms of Marvel comics, there aren't many options for going bigger than Thanos. Of the ones I can think of (Galactus/Dormammu), I'm not sure how there being half as many people in the universe would stop them.
     
  20. theenglish

    theenglish Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    No, I have no idea--I would love a version of Annihilation to be the next big event...but I don't know how having half the population in the universe would change that other than some species feeling that beings from our universe are becoming a threat.

    One other thing about Thanos "snap"--is he trying to wipe out half of all sentient beings, and if so how is sentient defined? Sentient beings are going to be quite varied in terms of intelligence. Are half of all animals wiped out as well? If it is half of all life then forests should be wiped out as well as insects, bacteria, etc.