Discussion in 'Science Fiction & Fantasy' started by Mage, Aug 7, 2018.
Jared and Jensen live in Texas from Supernatural
It's going to be very interesting. The timing sure coincides well with Crisis. Does that mean Oliver dies?
Question for the moderators--given that this year's Crisis on Infinite Earths is a combination of all four shows, and given the mass speculation that comes with it, should it get its own separate thread, like you do with big movies? Like the Arrowverse COIE Speculation Thread?
Let me put it this way, I think the odds just went up. I wonder with COIE will serve as a grand finale for Arrow. I mean if Oliver dies in COIE to save the multi-verse and the superheroes from all 4 shows are there, that could be one heck of an epic way to go out. I can already imagine it now: the Legends, Team Flash, Supergirl, Team Arrow all paying their respects to a casket with Oliver in it, with his bow and arrow laying on top. Get out of the tissue boxes.
A couple of things wrong with that for me. First, it really sucks to have such a downer ending for a character that a) is alive in the comics and b) the audience would have invested 8 years in. It would be a huge let down, on the level of Sam Beckett never went home, or the mother was dead all along.
Just as important, given that this IS a connected universe, not having his own series doesn't mean Oliver can't appear a couple of times a year on the other shows.
If this was me, I would use the shortened season to make COIE stronger.
I would end Arrow BEFORE COIE and cut the seasons of the other shows short. I would do the run of ten episodes, and make COIE beyond EPIC. Treat it like one show, with each episode slowly building on it, coming to a head. I don't think three episodes is enough to do this justice. What if they did a 12 episode miniseries, airing over 3 weeks? You could do so many things.
When that's done, the remaining shows deal with the aftermath and re-establish a post Crisis universe.
Imagine though if Oliver becomes the Supergirl of the comics crisis. He doesn't just die--his entire existence is forgotten by everyone. That's even worse.
Well, I do think that Arrow should wrap up its own story in the last 10 episodes. So it should still have its own series finale, separate from COIE. But we know the crossovers tend to be super epic. So COIE could be used to send Oliver out in one last blaze of glory, dying to save the entire multi-verse! And let's not forget that we saw Oliver make some kind of deal with the Monitor in the last crossover to save the lives of Barry and Kara. The show might have already given us a hint that Oliver is going to sacrifice himself in COIE for the good of all.
If you think about it, they can go anywhere with that promise.
For example, what if Oliver winds up in the "heavenly dimension" that Kal-L, his Lois, and Superboy Prime did? Forgotten.
It might also be interesting to use the COIE to recast. What if for example, Wally was a different actor?
I'm sad it's ending, but at least they are aware well in advance.
Oh buzz off. Why are you like this?
And what silly reason was that?
The team breaking time at the end of season one apparently made it impossible for any show in the Arrowverse to ever tell a coherent story in the timeline ever again. Or some such silly nonsense like that. Nevermind that the season1 cliffhanger of Legends was resolved inside of two minutes of the next season premiere.
I didn't like the way that Arrow and The Flash's narratives continued as if the Legends hadn't broken the very fabric of reality, yes, but to call my reaction "silly" is a matter of opinion.
There were ways that the producers could have prevented the perception that there was no point in caring about what was happening on Arrow and The Flash as a result of what happened on Legends, and it bothered me that they didn't bother to keep the coherency theyd spent so long building up.
Arrow and Flash didn't deserve to be "devalued" the way that they were, and it's unfortunate that that's what happened (IMO).
well calling it silly is being polite.
The simple reality of tv production means that factoring everytime the legends fuck up the timeline into Arrow and The Flash simply isn't going work from story telling point of view.
secondly as the legends fix everything up by the end of the episode so no-one is any the wiser.
The problem with what happened in regards to Legends of Tomorrow, Arrow, and The Flash is that both Flash and Arrow each had more than a month's worth of stories left when Legends completely broke reality and would not have returned to television for at least 6 to 7 months if not longer, and with each of the Earth-1-set series operating in real time, there was no way that those series continuing on without being affected by the Legends' breaking of reality could have ever been made to make sense.
You're taking this way too seriously.
Legends fixed reality/the timeline. From the perspective of those shows, it never happened.
So I'm not seeing the problem here.
How the heck were they "devalued"?
Oh, sweet Beebo, not this argument again.
It was ok. It kind of felt like your typical cliche ridden Arrow episode about Trust and stuff like that. There was some interesting stuff in there like Emiko killing Diaz, Dinah (She was looking awesome in the Canary outfit), and the stuff in the future. Looking forward to next weeks episode.
So we're just supposed to believe that 10 episodes (combined) of both Arrow and The Flash happened in the span of however long the Legends had to fix reality before the chaos they caused 'stuck'?
Yeah, I don't think so.
They were "devalued" because the fact that LoT S2 completely broke reality while Arrow and The Flash each still had 5 episodes to go in their respective seasons rendered what was happening in said series meaningless.
The problems caused by the conclusion of Legends' second season could have been easily fixed by holding off airing it until AFTER both Arrow and The Flash's seasons had finished.
People can be as dismissive of me as they want, but the whole ending of LoT Season 2 was so off-putting to me that it completely ruined my ability to watch and enjoy all 3 series going forward.
When good ol' Christopher reacts like this, you definitely are taking this seriously, DW.
DW...may I call you DW?...Yes, I will. One of the reason I cannot watch legends anymore is that the storyline is impossible to follow along with other arrowverse shows...not to mention I caught an single episode this season and I couldn't take the show seriously anymore.
This episode was clumsy in structure. First you had the police and the mayor chastising Team Arrow for not playing by the rules, then they agreed they'd try to make it work, then they just went back to using their usual Team Arrow methods and claiming it was suddenly legal somehow, and then the police were there and were fine with it and the mayor was repealing the anti-vigilante act. Huh? When and how did the police change their minds? What was the basis of the agreement they came to? It's like that famous "Then a miracle occurs" cartoon. They just paid lip service to the conflict and then swept it aside without explanation so they could get back to the status quo ante. That's surprisingly sloppy and lazy writing for this season.
Also, they seem to be forgetting that the original Black Canary/Laurel-1 wasn't a metahuman; her canary cry was a sonic device invented by Cisco Ramon. Couldn't Dinah use that in place of her own cry?
There was a quick line of dialogue from Oliver, I think, about if Team Arrow captures Midas, it will show the police that Team Arrrow's method work and then police will adapt to Arrow instead of forcing Arrow to adapt to the police. But yeah, the episode kinda glossed over the details. Presumably, the police learned that Team Arrow successfully found the chemicals and Midas, decided to go to the raid to lend a hand and help arrest Midas and seeing now that Team Arrow's methods work better, the mayor changed her mind.
Yeah, I would be surprised if Cisco does not build something for Dinah. I can't imagine that they will leave her character without her cry permanently.
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