Spoilers Arrow - Season 4

[Guy Gardener]

Thea is a waste of flesh Trustifarian.

If Speedy's not Ninja girl, she's a liability.

Laurel had a life hard won to flush down the toilet if her "hobby" was discovered.

 

[Reverend]

Season 5: Echo Kellum promoted to series regular - http://tvline.com/2016/04/04/arrow-season-5-echo-kellum-series-regular-curtis

Well isn't that just terrific news!
(Sorry, couldn't help myself!)

 

[Commander Richard]

Well, it happened.

 

[Commander Richard]

^ Yes, I'm telling you that

Spoiler

The show that writes its Starling City residents as such morons that they actually believed Roy's declaration that he was the Arrow after Oliver was identified to be the guy, despite being obviously much shorter than the Arrow, and the show that now lets Oliver run for mayor with Darkh not knowing he's the Arrow, yes, I'm telling you the show that recently featured reincarnated hawk-people from Ancient Egyptian times is exactly that goofy to put "The Black Canary" on Laurel's grave.

Anyhow, Guggenheim pretty much confirms the leak here. He wouldn't be defending "their take on the Green Arrow mythos" if it wasn't a key character like Laurel, because he wouldn't have to.

It's Laurel, folks.



... And IMO, it's the right call. I don't care about the comics; she should never have become the second Black Canary after Sara (who deserved a better death in the first place than as a semi-random pawn in one of Malcolm's schemes) in the first place. She could have served Team Arrow on the legal side as a DA, sure, but her suiting up regularly was just lame, as is Thea's doing the same.

I disagree about Thea. It was great to see her not only turn her life around, but do so in such a profound way. Spoiled rich girl to martial arts superhero. The character had nowhere else to go really. She didn't do much in season 2.

And I'm in the minority but I'll miss you know who. I'd like to know the story behind this decision.

Spoiler

That's assuming that they won't pull some twist and bring her back.

 

[Dick Whitman]

I knew of the leaked spoiler a head of watching. But if I did not I think I would have seen it coming THIS episode. It was so forced and manufactured a scenario. Regardless of options of the character or actress I hope people see how forced this has all been. Plus they had to add to the long history of badly treating female heroes as plot devices.

 

[Commander Richard]

I accidentally spoiled myself too but when I saw you know who recovering, I was hopeful that it wasn't true.

 

[Christopher]

All episode long, I was trying to decide whether it would be Laurel or Andy who got killed off, or possibly Captain Lance. They did a decent job of making it unclear who would be the victim (for those of us who avoided the spoilers). There were even moments when it looked like it might be Thea.

Here's the thing, though.

Spoiler: Speculation

Laurel asked Oliver to do something for her, and then we cut away without hearing what she asked, and then we saw the crash team rushing into her room. There's a gap in the sequence that was inserted deliberately, and that means something's being hidden from us. So I'm conviced that Laurel's death is a fake-out. She asked Oliver to help her fake her death for some reason, and he used some sort of mojo he picked up in the flashbacks to stop her heart.

It did seem to me that Oliver didn't look as shocked or grief-stricken as the others. He looked distraught when he was alone in the corridor, but that could just be his distress at having to let the others think Laurel's dead, and at the prospect of having to tell Quentin. True, it could just be his natural reserve, but I don't think so.

I don't know why she'd fake her death, though. Maybe it's because Darhk would come after her again if he knew she'd lived, or come after Quentin.

In the flashbacks, I think we now know how Oliver ended up in Russia. I guess that'll be the focus of next season's flashbacks.

 

[Commander Richard]

^ I noticed the request too. I can get onboard with that speculation.

 

[Thestral]

I really like that speculation, because otherwise Nope Nope So Much Nope.

Spoiler: Ugh

What a pointless way to kill off Laurel, a complete waste of a character that I didn't care about for years but has come around to be IMO a valuable part of the team. Just as stupid and contrived as the Oliver/Felicity drama but (unless that speculation is true, which seems reasonable!) permanent.

 

[Mr Light]

I really doubt that

Spoiler

she's dead. They did that super obvious cut away when she makes him promise to do something.... like fake her death, maybe? I'm guessing she's letting her civilian identity die so she can Black Canary full time. I'm very surprised the episode didn't end with a flashfoward showing her tombstone... which makes me think she's NOT the grave they're visiting there. There's still another death coming.

I also found it a little weird to show she's been madly in love with Oliver all these years. I just recently rewatched the entire series on Netflix and I just don't see it.

 

[Commander Richard]

Here's an interview with the cast and show-runner about tonight's episode. Lot's of answers about you know who.

Read it!

 

[Gaith]

I disagree about Thea. It was great to see her not only turn her life around, but do so in such a profound way. Spoiled rich girl to martial arts superhero. The character had nowhere else to go really. She didn't do much in season 2.

She became a successful entrepreneur, which was enough for me. Every new vigilante they add, whether to Team Arrow specifically or just Starling City generally, detracts from Ollie's prominence.

Now, I do like how she left home to team up with Merlyn at the end of S2. She could've gone total villain, or chaotic neutral, or maybe been recruited to ARGUS, and willingly become as dangerous and ruthless as Waller, leaving the main cast but showing up from time to time a la Nyssa. Becoming Red Arrow 2.0 was a particularly lazy and unnecessary way to keep her around as a regular, and I still don't much like it.

 

[Commander Richard]

^ That would have been good too and I did think that they might go there but even then I think that she'd have to redeem herself eventually.

 

[Xerxes82]

Wow. This show used to be good. Or at least entertaining. Since at least the midseason break, and probably before, it's been utterly terrible.

Spoiler

Did anyone else feel like the writer's had the actor playing Darkh simply improvise which character they killed off? I mean, sure they had giant neon signs all episode screaming "IT'S LAUREL!", but the actual fight at the end was so poorly conceived, and the entire set up so stupid it felt like the had no script beyond "Darkh catches everybody." He could have killed Ollie, ended the entire threat. He could have killed all of them, ended the entire threat. But instead it's like he picked one at random.

On the upside, this will be my final episode of Arrow. I've been done with it for a while, but I still watch because my girlfriend has enjoyed it. But this episode is finally so bad as to drive her away from it. So, freedom from terrible television for me!

I just hope The Flash doesn't start falling victim to the same awful, cliched writing. I still enjoy that show. At least for now.

 

[Dick Whitman]

In the future this show will be best remembered for allowing a superior show, The Flash, to happen. I used to really like this show. Its been down hill since the weak defeat of Deathstroke at the end of Season 2.

 

[Mr Light]

I don't get all the doom saying. I'm enjoying the show this year more than ever.

 

[Christopher]

Here's an interview with the cast and show-runner about tonight's episode. Lot's of answers about you know who.

Read it!

Okay... They specifically address my hypothesis and rule it out. They could be blowing smoke, but they make a good point that they've done the fake-out route before. For now, I guess, we should accept that this death is a done deal.

Becoming Red Arrow 2.0 was a particularly lazy and unnecessary way to keep her around as a regular, and I still don't much like it.

She does look pretty great in the costume, though. And really, given that her nickname was established as Speedy way back in the pilot, it's not exactly an unnatural outcome.

 

[Thestral]

Plus GA has a history of having a female sidekick in the comics, plus the tradition of a sidekick with a former drug problem (if Roy Harper in the comics.)

Read that interview and... ugh. Not helpful. Still stupid.

Spoiler

It wouldn't even be so bad, maybe, if not for the whole "Darhk could have killed everyone but for some reason just Laurel." And going about about the shippers and their point of view... as if that's really what will upset people about it. Maybe we can get Sara back on the show and have her be Black Canary (using Laurel's costume instead of her old Canary costume, and not the wig). Maybe?

 

[DigificWriter]

I don't really understand why they made this particular decision, but I don't buy the notion that they went into the season not having already made it, and can't really bring myself to condone blaming them for doing it for "petty" reasons.

 

[Gaith]

^ As the producers have said, they've killed off a major character per season so far, and with four full-time in-field members (i.e., not counting Felicity or guests such as Barry, Sara, Roy, or Ray), Team Arrow's just too darn big.