Poll Are You Satisfied? (Season Finale Spoilers)

[sbk1234]

How famous was the Enterprise at this point in-universe? Burnham followed in the tradition of saying "It's the Enterprise" with reverence, but is it justified at this point in the timeline? ...Or maybe she said it that way because her "brother" is likely on board?

Hey now, only the poison came in a spray-bottle. We don't know what kind of super-futuristic bottle the milk originally came in.

Maybe they get the milk straight from the tap, like Luke Skywalker?

 

[WarpFactorZ]

How famous was the Enterprise at this point in-universe? Burnham followed in the tradition of saying "It's the Enterprise" with reverence, but is it justified at this point in the timeline? ...Or maybe she said it that way because her "brother" is likely on board?

Probably a little of both. We know Pike is on a list of highly-decorated captains. Also, Burnham has mentioned the Enterprise specifically as something to shoot for, career-wise. So, it must be fairly renowned in Starfleet circles.

On the other hand, when she says "It's the USS Enterprise!", she specifically glances at Sarek, indicating her focus is not so much the ship, but Spock.

 

[Rahul]

At this point the Connie is the odd one out there, like 90% of Federation/Earth ships have had the glow.

Someone said in another thread that apparently they wanted it to glow in TOS, but couldn't.

Well, yeah. But the connie is literally the most famous Trek ships of them all, and THE one everyone thinks of when they hear 'Star Trek'. And she didn't have it. Neither did the movie-refit (except when she's going to warp). Even JJ Abrams didn't add it in his movies. IMO the "blue glow" of the nacelle is the single most element making all TNG-era starships look like christmas decoration instead of "real" starships. The Discovery actually found a nice middle-ground by having the blue glow be such a thin line. They stayed remarkably close to the original Enterprise on Discovery, and I like it. But i think pretty much every thing they did change (reduced height, new nacelle struts) was unnecessary at best.

Whatever happens to the Disco-Enterprise - and how much they try to change her in retrospect - it's NEVER going to replace the "original" one. Neither in Trek continuity, nor in pop-cultural memory. So every change they made here is not actually a "change" of the original design. But rather a Discovery-specific deviation that will forever be ignored in any other medium outside of DIS.

 

[XCV330]

IMO the "blue glow" of the nacelle is the single most element making all TNG-era starships look like christmas decoration instead of "real" starships.

Please point me to one of these real starships. I'm ready to buy a ticket.

 

[Hythlodeus]

Please point me to one of these real starships. I'm ready to buy a ticket.

wait, I think I have Elon Musk's phone number lying around somewhere...

 

[Longinus]

Whilst I don't mind adding the glow to the Connie, I've always thought that having both bussard glowing red and the warp grilles glowing blue is a tad too much. Having one or another is fine. Or just having the warp grille glow only when the ship is in the warp. I think that the TOS film era ship in TNG with the blue glow but not the red looked nice.

 

[Rahul]

Whilst I don't mind adding the glow to the Connie, I've always thought that having both bussard glowing red and the warp grilles glowing blue is a tad too much. Having one or another is fine. Or just having the warp grille glow only when the ship is in the warp. I think that the TOS film era ship in TNG with the blue glow but not the red looked nice.

Thank you!
That's pretty much it: I both like the TOS-connie's orange bussard collectors. And the blue warp glow of the refit. But BOTH was IMO too much (it's the one! design element I don't like on the Ent-D, and was happy it was toned way down on the Voyager). That's when it becomes toy-like. IMO on the Discovery - when both have the same color - it also kinda' works. But I won't become a fan of the red/blue-nacelle design, ever.

 

[fireproof78]

But rather a Discovery-specific deviation that will forever be ignored in any other medium outside of DIS.

And yet, we are still here complaining about it.

 

[Arvis Taljik]

Yep...100% agree.

The producers/Witers have been VERY DISINGENUOUS (and they were all saying: "Hey, we're TOS fans too...trust us..iot all works out in the end...")
^^^
I have no issue with it being a reboot either. If the staff had just said this up front at the start of the series, I'd love the reveal they did, but after months of "No...really, it's the 'Prime Universe' TOS fan know and love..." No - in that context with rthe BS statements they've been making to TOS fans from day one, the reveal sucked.

And GOOD/MODERN effects can be done showing the ship in its Classic form (as both DS9 and ENT and even TOS Remastered have proved over the years) - but again, this production staff are just disingenuous in their treatment of TOS era fans.

No amount of lighting changes nor special effects will make the TOS Enterprise, especially the interior, look like it's from anywhere other than 1960's sci-fi.

I enjoy the redesign on the Enterprise AND I do so while fully acknowldging and respecting TOS' place in the history of Trek and mainstream sci-fi as a whole.

We are not in 1965. We will never be in 1965 again, you know, because time doesn't flow backwards and all that. The updates were just enough to bring the ship up to modern standards and in-line with Discovery's established look WITHOUT over-blowing the entire ship as was done with the JJprise. The DSC Enterprise retains all the major design elements of the TOS ship, borrows the angled pylons from the Refit along with the bridge window consistent with Discovery's production style and combines them in such a was as to make the designs mesh together MUCH better than they would have otherwise.

On the topic of Crossfield-class age vs Constitution-class age, the lower registry numbers of the Crossfield-class ships should be enough evidence that the CLASS as a whole is older. Even if the Discovery and Glenn were built early in the war, the class itself has been around longer. Even all the ships in the Battle of the Binary Star have registry numbers that put them in "older" slots than the Constitution-class. So to say that the Connie doesn't fit Discovery's design ethic actually WORKS in its favor. As a class it is newer than pretty much every CLASS of ship we've seen so far, so that fits just fine by me.

 

[Longinus]

Registries mean nothing.

 

[Tuskin38]

On the topic of Crossfield-class age vs Constitution-class age, the lower registry numbers of the Crossfield-class ships should be enough evidence that the CLASS as a whole is older.

It really isn't. Registries are not consistent in Trek.

 

[Ar-Pharazon]

It really isn't. Registries are not consistent in Trek.

They always have been in the sense that lower #'s were older ships. They haven't always been consistent in the "NCC-17xx's were always Connies" way.

 

[Longinus]

They always have been in the sense that lower #'s were older ships. They haven't always been consistent in the "NCC-17xx's were always Connies" way.

No.

 

[Tuskin38]

They always have been in the sense that lower #'s were older ships.

The Grissom didn't look that old.

 

[AlanC9]

IMO the "blue glow" of the nacelle is the single most element making all TNG-era starships look like christmas decoration instead of "real" starships.

An orange glow is better than a blue glow? I don't see a reason to have a strong color preference here.

Whatever happens to the Disco-Enterprise - and how much they try to change her in retrospect - it's NEVER going to replace the "original" one. Neither in Trek continuity, nor in pop-cultural memory. So every change they made here is not actually a "change" of the original design. But rather a Discovery-specific deviation that will forever be ignored in any other medium outside of DIS.

Sure, but only because Connies aren't going to appear in any other medium. Or if they do, they'll be redesigned again.

 

[Rahul]

And yet, we are still here complaining about it.

Well, yeah. Art is subjective. I am okay with the changes to the connie. As a DIS show-specific variant. In fact, from a pure design perspective, I really fucking like that new design. But that doesn't hold true for everybody.

I think, part of the dissatisfaction is that they changed her at all. Because it is in stark contrast to how "canon" was treated throughout 800+ hours of previous Star Trek, and that, until now, the original connie was one of the few, universally, unchangable sacrosanct icons of the franchise (and IMO still is - again, the next series after DIS will either change her again, or go back to the original design).

I think there's also the same miscalculation that went on with some characters:
Why did it have to be the Enterprise? It really could have been ANY other constitution-class starship, and nobody would complain. The same way why did it had to be Sarek? Burnhams' adoptive dad could have been any other Vulcan, and both the series would have had more freedom to tell her own story, and fans would be equally more happy.

 

[Butters]

I’m just chuffed they said “The Enterprise”, and not “it’s Enterprise”. Let’s nip that nonsense in the bud right now.

 

[Rahul]

An orange glow is better than a blue glow? I don't see a reason to have a strong color preference here.

Naw man, read that again. It's not about the color itself. It's about the combination of colors. Having only one(!) glowy thing on a nacelle (the connie) is okay. Having multiple glowy things who's colors fit with each other - also okay (see the Discovery herself). Having the majority of your engine being illuminated like a christmas tree with wildly different colors (red+blue) = does not look very good.

Sure, but only because Connies aren't going to appear in any other medium. Or if they do, they'll be redesigned again.

Yeah, no. The Connie has, as of now, appeared in EVERY Star Trek iteration - even the JJ movies (although in a deleted scene) almost unchanged. And she will again. As long as there is Star Trek, the original Connie will appear in one form or another (and be it only a model or a picture). And they will ALWAYS reference the original one - the 60s studio model - and never any of the newer re-designs... Just look how fast everyone forgot about the JJprise. Already vanished as if she never existed. The DIS-Enterprise awaits the same fate.

The original one, though? Will always make re-appereances/cameos for the fans.

 

[Hythlodeus]

why did it had to be Sarek?

because he already was estabished at having a history of various experiments in Human/Vulcan relations and that fit nicely into Burnhams background. Other than that, his diplomatic past with the Klingons as established in the TNG episode "Sarek" fits perfectly into the story they wanted to tell. From the continuity point of view, he was responsible for negotiating the final “Treaty of Alliance” between the Klingons and the Federation, sometime between 2344 and 2357. He had to start somewhere and the Klingon War was the best place for that.
Using Sarek made the most sense from a writer's point of view

 

[You Can't Know]

It looked fine to me. Better than I expected! Better than the Discovery looks.