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Are there any fan-favorite/well liked Characters (from any Trek) that you just can't stand?

I guess I'm a weird guy. Dull doesn't bother me.

I guess I figure art and entertainment are supposed to provoke a reaction: excitement, emotion, fear, suspense, sadness, laughter, pathos, etc. And it helps if the characters are vivid and colorful and engaging.

I also have a pet theory that, when it comes to SFF, characters need to have big personalities to stand out against all the futuristic settings and spectacle and technobabble.


And as for Saavik . . . as played by Alley, she definitely has attitude and a certain spikiness to her.
 
I guess I figure art and entertainment are supposed to provoke a reaction: excitement, emotion, fear, suspense, sadness, laughter, pathos, etc. And it helps if the characters are vivid and colorful and engaging.

I also have a pet theory that, when it comes to SFF, characters need to have big personalities to stand out against all the futuristic settings and spectacle and technobabble.
I don't want a reaction I guess..I'm more interested in investment.
 
Different priorities, I guess. There's probably a reason my most popular Trek novels are about Q and Khan.

Left to my own devices, I like writing about about big, splashy, colorful characters -- and have a weak spot for larger-than-life villains.

No surprise that TOS is also my favorite Trek series. It has a certain pulpy, occasionally melodramatic passion and energy that the latter-day series sometime seem to shy away from.
 
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Different priorities, I guess. There's probably a reason my most popular Trek novels are about Q and Khan.

Left to my own devices, I like writing about about big, splashy, colorful characters -- and have a weak spot for larger-than-life villains.

No surprise that TOS is also my favorite Trek series. It has a certain pulpy, occasionally melodramatic passion and energy that the latter-day series sometime seem to shy away from.
TOS is my favorite but that's because I have an investment in the characters already, specifically Spock.

Khan and Q are at the bottom of my list for the most part.
 
TOS is my favorite but that's because I have an investment in the characters already, specifically Spock.

Khan and Q are at the bottom of my list for the most part.

See, I think they pop off the screen -- and they were great fun to write for. Q's snark and attitude plays off nicely against the overall earnestness of the TNG crew, while Khan is a charismatic antagonist in the mode of Doctor Doom or a good Bond villain.

Nothing personal, btw. I just find the whole topic of why people like or dislike certain kinds of characters and plots interesting. And, in general, I tend to push back against the idea that characters have to be likable or, worse yet, admirable to be engaging.

There's a reason Dracula is not titled Jonathan Harker . . . . :)
 
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I also have a pet theory that, when it comes to SFF, characters need to have big personalities to stand out against all the futuristic settings and spectacle and technobabble.
I think this depends on the type of SFF involved. Space opera absolutely needs big personalities; but a version of THX-1138 where THX had a big broad personality would be a very different film indeed (though admittedly, there’s another character that does have one…).
 
Nothing personal, btw. I just find the whole topic of why people like or dislike certain kinds of characters and plots interesting. And, in general, I tend to push back against the idea that characters have to be likable or, worse yet, admirable to be engaging.
They do not.

Admirable is not what I find interesting or engaging. I find it very disturbing when I see patterns in people liking organized crime, as I did with my friends. It created a distaste for those types of characters for me, and as I became less enthralled with escapism the appeal faded.

I'm sure they are very interesting and exciting to write. As I grow older, I became less enthusiastic with these characters.
 
He regularly expresses skepticism or outright hostility toward advanced technology and artificial intelligence—odd for someone practicing medicine in the 23rd century.

No rational mind would ever blindly accept AI as if it is some flawless wonlder of the age never to be doubted or questioned. Allow me to introduce you to Nomad, Landru, the M-5, Vaal, and so on. Not the greatest record and many innocent individuals died interacting with each.

McCoy occasionally makes decisions that would violate contemporary medical ethics—such as treating patients without consent

I suppose McCoy should have waited for the Horta to give her consent before he saved her life. Perhaps he should have waited for Joe Tormolen to wake up from his self-inflicted stab wound before treating him? Sound medical approach...? Maybe he should have said, "Jim, I can't operate on Spock's flintlock wound! I don't have his consent!!" Apply the same to the Denevan neural parasites' tendrils which intertwined itself in Spock's nervous system. I guess McCoy crossed a line there, right?

Nope.

In reality, every day, people are treated without consent. It is often necessary in the...I don't know...job of improving or saving lives, especially when working against time.

experimenting with untested treatments

Do I really need to go there? What part of real world medicine did not--in one way or another--do exactly what you're talking about?

3. Bones is often seen jabbing people with hyposprays without warning or explanation. While it makes for quick TV scenes, it could be seen as hasty and not compassionate.

Warning? Count how many times he used it against a person's will--and one who did not need the treatment.

4. He frequently challenges Captain Kirk in emotionally charged ways, sometimes undermining the chain of command. While his moral compass is admirable, this behavior can be disruptive during critical missions.

"Challenging" Kirk was part of his job, and Kirk--more often than not--leaned on / listened to McCoy's advice, as he was not only one of Kirk's best friends, but served as a psychologist / counselor before the job officially existed on starships on Star Trek. It is no wonder Kirk's final message (as seen in "The Tholian Web") had Kirk giving Spock a suggestion which helped him out in his own command:

"Use every scrap of knowledge and logic you have to save the ship. But temper your judgment with intuitive insight. I believe you have those qualities, but if you can't find them in yourself, seek out McCoy. Ask his advice. And if you find it sound, take it."

Further, the relationships that see challenges and strains are far more realistic than the throne-occupying types such as Picard and his "Ambition? What''s that? I'm planting my butt right here!" lackey Riker.

5.His Racism towards Vulcans has always rubbed me the wrong way. McCoy frequently makes sarcastic or demeaning remarks about Spock’s Vulcan heritage. This could be seen as unprofessional and culturally insensitive, even if it's supposed to be friendly banter.

I've pointed out the following in other threads, but I'm calling BS on McCoy being a racist (in any way bearing similarities to real world racism which i've personally experienced throughout my life), but Spock relentlessly insulted the entire human race throughout all three seasons of TOS in a manner most would see as undeniably racist. However, because Spock is the "outsider" amongst humans, some observers develop politically selective glasses through which the series is analyzed. Spock was rarely searching for answers based on false assumptions about humans. He damned humans and barely tolerated them save for a few.

6. There are a few episodes where Bones misdiagnoses or fails to catch something until it's nearly too late. For example, he sometimes doesn't detect alien influences or diseases until things escalate dangerously.

Plots need danger, not 5-minite grocery store clinic solutions.
 
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I think this depends on the type of SFF involved. Space opera absolutely needs big personalities; but a version of THX-1138 where THX had a big broad personality would be a very different film indeed (though admittedly, there’s another character that does have one…).

I was thinking more in terms of 1950s SF movies like This Island Earth or The Monolith Monsters where the bland human characters kinda get lost against all the SF spectacle.

By contrast, look at what is very possibly my favorite SF movie, the original Planet of the Apes, where Taylor arguably needed to have a big personality in order not to get upstaged by the Apes. And that's what you get when you cast Charlton Heston! :)

And indeed the Apes themselve needed to have engaging, vivid personalities in order to emote through all that latex. Hence, the likes of Zira, Dr. Zaius, etc.
 
2001: A Space Odyssey is what jumps to mind when I think of the human characters getting lost in the spectacle. Kubrick knew what he wanted though.
 
I guess I figure art and entertainment are supposed to provoke a reaction: excitement, emotion, fear, suspense, sadness, laughter, pathos, etc. And it helps if the characters are vivid and colorful and engaging.

I also have a pet theory that, when it comes to SFF, characters need to have big personalities to stand out against all the futuristic settings and spectacle and technobabble.


And as for Saavik . . . as played by Alley, she definitely has attitude and a certain spikiness to her.
So what do you think about a film like 2001: A Space Odyssey, which is generally considered a classic of science fiction? It's characters are quite deliberately portrayed as rather dull and bland. It was a deliberate choice by Kubrick to make a point.
 
I think this depends on the type of SFF involved. Space opera absolutely needs big personalities; but a version of THX-1138 where THX had a big broad personality would be a very different film indeed (though admittedly, there’s another character that does have one…).
And that's perhaps where I diverge from some others. To me, Trek at its best is not space opera. Space opera is Star Wars. Yes, Trek can do space opera and do it well -- see TWOK -- but it does lots of things that are not space opera and I much prefer those.

I was thinking more in terms of 1950s SF movies like This Island Earth or The Monolith Monsters where the bland human characters kinda get lost against all the SF spectacle.
This Island Earth is much better when wrapped in a MST3K framework.I love Mystery Science Theater 3000: The Movie.
 
So what do you think about a film like 2001: A Space Odyssey, which is generally considered a classic of science fiction? It's characters are quite deliberately portrayed as rather dull and bland. It was a deliberate choice by Kubrick to make a point.

2001 is a special case, I concede. The sheer sweep of its scope, going from the dawn of man to the next stage of post-human evolutions, inevitably dwarfs any individual characters -- except maybe HAL.

That being said, when it comes to the big SF movies of 1968, I prefer Planet of the Apes to 2001.

(Never mind The Green Slime and Barbarella, although I'll cop to having a weak spot for the latter and once watched it twice in one night when my college SFF club screened it as a fund-raiser.)
 
Can't stand? Hmm. No, I really can't think of any that I just can't stand, especially ones who are beloved.

However, there are some characters whose opinions I've changed on over time. Picard stands out. As I've gotten older, I've realized Phillipa Louvois was right. Picard really is a pompous ass.

Thank you for saying that..... Now I don't have to and brave the pitchforks hahaha

I liked Picard in early TNG but as the seasons went on my like slowly shifted where by the end of TNG, well I was glad kind of.

Seven Of Nine. Didn't care for her in Voyager but did like her in Picard go figure.

Julian Bashir couldn't warm up to his character at all.
 
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This Island Earth is much better when wrapped in a MST3K framework.I love Mystery Science Theater 3000: The Movie.
While I like MST3K in general, I have to disagree about this one. This Island Earth was a pretty good sf film on its own; it didn’t deserve to be mocked. So MST3KTM (whew) only proved that in fact, any film can be MSTed, if not especially well — instead of making clever reference or context jokes as usual, just randomly pretend this or that character is saying that they farted or something — but not that they should be.
 
While I like MST3K in general, I have to disagree about this one. This Island Earth was a pretty good sf film on its own; it didn’t deserve to be mocked. So MST3KTM (whew) only proved that in fact, any film can be MSTed, if not especially well — instead of making clever reference or context jokes as usual, just randomly pretend this or that character is saying that they farted or something — but not that they should be.
This Island Earth is a decent film, but I don't think only bad films can be effectively given the MST treatment. Most of the time, they got bad films because that's what their budget could afford. Doing it in a movie format and This Island Earth being a property of Universal, where they were making their movie, made it possible to get a better film. If you look at Rifftax, which I consider the successor to MST3K, they mock lots of good films and do it well. Heck, they have a riff of Wrath of Khan that is excellent.

The humor in MST3K:TM is not as sophisticated as some of the humor in the TV series because Universal wanted them to dumb it down a bit for movie audiences. But it is still one of my favorite MST efforts. I think there's lots of great stuff in there.
 
Was the MST one where they make fun of the Interositor?
Yes! That's the one! It also includes this:

[as Tom Servo reads the opening credits]
SERVO: Okay, let's see here... Shatner, Shatner... no, doesn't look like he's in this one; we're safe.

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