And boy, I'd love to know how Nero's screwing with the timeline changed Sulu from Japanese to Korean!
And to think, all this time I thought Sulu was American.
Any other TOSers give up post-Abrams?
- Thread starter jayrath
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And to think, all this time I thought Sulu was American.
And Kirk and Scotty are Canadians.And boy, I'd love to know how Nero's screwing with the timeline changed Sulu from Japanese to Korean!
And to think, all this time I thought Sulu was American.
An aside:
This has been pointed out before on this board and yet the unironic use of 'TOSer' as a fan of the original show continues to crop up.
I mean it's not like we see a lot of 'TNGer' usage, nor 'ENTer' and understandably many 'VOYer' (voyeurs might have an interest in tossers, now that I think of it.)
It's British slang. Means someone who masturbates; synonym with wanker. Invariably an insult.
This has been pointed out before on this board and yet the unironic use of 'TOSer' as a fan of the original show continues to crop up.
I mean it's not like we see a lot of 'TNGer' usage, nor 'ENTer' and understandably many 'VOYer' (voyeurs might have an interest in tossers, now that I think of it.)
Absolutely not. I'm willing to give Abrams some time here. Let his first Trek film set a tone, and see where it goes from there. Anybody notice how Kirk is always wearing the black shirt until the final scene, and then we see him in the gold tunic? To me, that's where it's going to start. I'm actually optimistic for the future of Trek, and once I saw that the past was treated respectfully in the movie (the destruction of Vulcan notwithstanding), I must echo Spock in The Undiscovered Country: let's have faith that Trek will unfold as it should
I like both, to be honest.
Clearly, some new definition of the word "respectfully" than I was previously aware of.
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Amaris
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I tend to go by the dictionary definition. "Respectfully" works quite well, according to the dictionary version.
Me too. Someone at work lent me their DVD copy of the film and urged me to give it another chance. This time I made a point of taking written notes...
I got only halfway through it then turned it, off partly because of a headache which I can't remember whether it began before or after I started watching the film. This evening I'll watch the rest of it.
I will say that there are one or two things I'll give a nod to, but they're small and mostly inconsequential, and the rest of it is just as dumb as I recall from the first time around.
I watched the special feature segment on the film makers' "vision" and approach to the film. They said all the things I suspected as to how they approached this thing. Basically they thought it should be more like Star Wars. Ah, so jazz it up, crank it and dumb it way down. Yep, they're bang on because that's exactly what I saw in the first half I watched as well as what I recall the first time I saw this last year.
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Amaris
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That's fine and well, but that doesn't mean they weren't respectful of the material.
Precisely. The film doesn't have to be good or even something you like tbe respectful to its source material, and given the degree of reverential gestures, in-jokes, and the entire film constructed around various iconic moments, ideas and characters, I'd say it treated the Star Trek series with a degree of respect.
I can't figure out how shoehorning in a reference to Delta Vega, that everyone and their hound dog knew was completely and utterly incorrect and out of place, is "showing respect."
And the list grows exponentially from there.
And the list grows exponentially from there.
You over estimate what most people know or care about. An injoke really shouldn't be taken with that much seriousness. Those without axes to grind will smile at the reference and rationalise its a different Delta Vega
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Amaris
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Most people don't care about minutiae that they will never use. They love the show for their own reasons. You seem to like the show because of a ubiquitous amount of trivia knowledge. That is your prerogative. It doesn't mean they didn't treat the show with respect.
It was hardly an isolated item. The film is riddled with pointless references like that.
That's not being respectful of the source material, it's pandering to the gullible.
That's not being respectful of the source material, it's pandering to the gullible.
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Amaris
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No, they were respectful of the source material. You simply do not like the movie and will not budge. That's your prerogative, again, but it doesn't mean you're at all correct in regard to the level of respect given to the movie.
It's called having a little fun with the audience.
I will say in watching this I was mindful of a couple of things. Firstly, most of the general audience will not have an encyclopedic knowledge of TOS and the Trek universe. Also keep in mind this is a reboot and an alternate continuity and so they can move things around as whatever they wish and it has no bearing whatsoever on TOS. In that way they can inject post TOS references as well as other things and not be contradicting TOS because they're two totally separate animals.
In the first ten minutes:
- there's an admittedly poignant moment when George Kirk hears the voice of his crying newborn son just before the Kelvin collides with Nero's ship. The uniforms of the Kelvin's crew have something of a retro look to them that I thought was okay. I have to wonder, though, why Nero let the escaping shuttlecraft get away when he could so easily have destroyed them and kept his presence secret. Of course the whole idea of this insanely massive ship that dwarfs anything else is just a mining ship is absurd in the extreme. Ah, but they want it to be Star Wars like so there ya go.
- I didn't hate Sarek's portrayal, but he certainly lacked Mark Lenard's nuanced acting. Lenard, like Nimoy and a few other folks who portrayed Vulcans in TOS, had a wonderful ability to act with subtle facial expressions, subtle tonal inflections in his voice and telegraph with his eyes. That seems to be a lost art among many of the Vulcans in this film save Nimoy.
- They follow ENT's approach of showing Vulcan's as bigots. Actually I thought performances of many Vulcans in ENT to be generally better than what we get in Abrams' film.
- Allow me to be specific. Pine's performance is okay, he gets it done reasonably well. That said I really resented Kirk being portrayed as a smarmy jackass. So it isn't Pine's performance that I dislike, but what he was portraying.
- Seeing the starship being assembled on the ground looks interesting, but it still strikes me as ludicrous. And in the middle of Iowa fields.
- McCoy's portrayal wasn't bad, but at times I think he overdid it like he was really trying to channel Deforest Kelley's performance. Pine does a better job because he doesn't try to overtly imitate Shatner. Indeed in a better film overall Pine could serve decently as a young Kirk provided he was portraying Kirk as something other than a jackass.
- Uhura is shown as an ambitious slut and with none of the presence or class of Nichelle Nichols.
- I'm repeating myself, but the nu E is disgustingly ugly with no grace or majesty to it whatsoever. And the interior design is a mix of XBox and a brewery. It's a fucking joke. I can't help but think of TMP's refit E and how successful that was. I hate the bridge design, a thorough botch of one of the very best set design's in science fiction film and television. They gave us a totally sterile room with no character or warmth of previous versions, most particularly the original.
- Zachary Quinto may look passably like a younger Nimoy, but every time he opened his mouth we get a parody of Nimoy's Spock. And I couldn't stand the higher pitch of Quinto's voice. Throw in that he has zero nuance in depicting Spock. Again Pine does a better job by far than Quinto.
- I know, I know the lead characters in TOS always went on landing parties, but only the three of them to destroy Nero's drill rather than backed up by a security contingent? TOS mightn't have had the budget for lots of extras, but as a feature film this surely did.
- I actually didn't mind the portrayal of Checkov, but his accent was even more overdone than Koenig's.
- Scotty's portrayal was fine accepting that this is a younger and more exuberant version of the original.
- I must say I rather disliked seeing Kirk brutalized. They always seemed to be looking for a chance for Kirk have the shit kicked out of him.
This film really does have a Star Wars like feel to it. It's a lot of things thrown in to veil the fact that it's a wagon load of logic flaws, poor conceptual thinking and a stupid story. The notion that they had to ramp it up for a modern audience is bullshit. A better and more credible story with better writing overall would have gone a long way to making this feel more authentic and more in spirit with TOS while still managing to reboot the materiel and delivering a good ride.
Nero's ship was focused on the Kelvin and afterwards its disabled because the Kelvin rammed into it. Its big. because it is a mining ship.
A fair opinion.
The bigotry has been part of the Vulcan character since TOS. Spock himself has engaged in human bashing from time to time.
I can Kirk see being that. Though more so in the films than in TOS. I like to think of it as being cocky.
Whats wrong with there being fields in the area? And in society were gravity is meaningless, it being assembled on the ground makes little difference.- Seeing the starship being assembled on the ground looks interesting, but it still strikes me as ludicrous. And in the middle of Iowa fields.
I can see that.
Missed those scenes. Can you specify?
Not a fan of the exterior of the new either. I did like the interiors though.
I agree about Quinto's voice, but otherwise he did a good job.
Tradition. Its about respect remember?-
Did you just spell Chekov's name wrong????
Funny thing is Yelchin is a Russian, but decided to keep Koenigs bad Russian accent out of respect for the character.-
One of the best parts of the film.
Another Trek tradition they kept. Kirk was always getting beat up in TOS. What was wrong is Pine's shirt didn't get ripped off.
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