Another Voyager 1st-time watch thread

Discussion in 'Star Trek: Voyager' started by Shatnertage, Aug 11, 2010.

  1. T.D. Possum

    T.D. Possum Commodore Commodore

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    While I appreciated the rest of your review, really, you could have stopped right there. A very accurate summary.
     
  2. Shatnertage

    Shatnertage Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The thing that I love about it is Chakotay talks about how important it is not to be detected by the natives, then beds down for a nap within earshot of them.

    Earlier in Trek, it's been established that Starfleeters would commit suicide rather than come into contact with pre-warp cultures (well, except when they were using them to fight proxy wars against the Klingons, but that's another story). Picard even risked his own life by taking an arrow to the chest to try to undo the damage caused by a violation of the PD. Yet Chakotay goes to sleep right next to the settlement, where he's sure to be discovered?

    Looking forward to two more good episodes of Voyager.
     
  3. T.D. Possum

    T.D. Possum Commodore Commodore

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    Well, "Renaissance Man" is a treat, and you might like either "Homestead" or "Endgame". Maybe even both.

    Do not despair!
     
  4. Shatnertage

    Shatnertage Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    After a lot of traveling, it's time for...

    "Homestead"

    Neelix gets written off the show two episodes early and you know what? Good for him. I can honestly say that, after seven seasons, I get where they were going with the character and I liked Ethan Phillips' performance. So there.

    The episode itself bugged me a little, mostly because even though we see aliens who are warp-capable and presumably have learned how to cooperate with each other, everyone's got a stone age mentality. I want the minerals in your asteroid, so I'll blow it up, instead of figuring out a way to trade you for them. I know that peaceful co-existence wouldn't make for very exciting TV, but the conflict just seems so absolute.

    That's the big picture, though. This episode was about Neelix, and it was pretty good from that respect. In the beginning he's his usual self, throwing a party and antagonizing Tuvok. Tuvok gave him a hell of a testimonial later on, and even admitted that he more than tolerated him despite his quirks.

    And, of course, his final goodbye. Just wonderful.

    It makes sense that Neelix would want to be with his people, I guess. It would have worked a little better if they'd dropped hints earlier in the season, but I'll take whatever I can get.

    And those aliens looked like Skeletor.
     
  5. JanewayRulz!

    JanewayRulz! Vice Admiral Admiral

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    I loved the end Neelix-Janeway chat in the mess hall, late at night. It confirmed for me, once again, that he was just a little bit in love with his Captain, and needed her reassurance that it was okay to leave.





    [yt]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6DeFgHFf10E[/yt]



    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6DeFgHFf10E


    I also loved how it was Janeway, Tuvok and Paris in the Delta Flyer that "helped" a fellow traveler in distress. "Helped" being the operative word, since they didn't steal his thunder as being the hero of the day.

    As for foreshadowing.

    Everyone was searching for home. The only one who couldn't claim that was Neelix and Icheb, and at least with Icheb he had a home with his foster Mother. (Seven)

    I loved the fact that he found a Talaxian home and a Talaxian family who would think of him as the space hero and not the space ragamuffin that he was when we first met him 7 years ago.
     
  6. Shatnertage

    Shatnertage Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    As a dad, the most touching part for me was the Neelix/NaomiWildman scene at the end. When he realizes she doesn't need him anymore, he feels like it's OK to leave.

    It would have been more powerful if she didn't have her mom living on the same ship as her, but I still like it.
     
  7. Shatnertage

    Shatnertage Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Well, after writing a one-act play, designing a new treehouse, preparing a five-course dinner, and finishing first-place in a triathlon, I decided to watch...

    "Renaissance Man"

    Well, I actually didn't do any of that stuff, but I did get a little work on my book done today so I'm feeling pretty good.

    This was a great episode. It was obvious pretty early on that something was up when Janeway returned to Voyager, but it kept us guessing as to just what the problem was.

    It doesn't feel self-referential at all, though there is a call-out to Douglas Adams when the Hierarchy aliens say they'll put Janeway on a planet where the inhabitants are "mostly harmless," and the Hierarchy aliens look a lot like Sontarans.

    It was interesting to see other actors get to play the Doctor. Including "Body and Soul," now we've see Jeri Ryan, Roxann Dawson, Robert Beltran, and Kate Mulgrew all play the Doctor. Funny. I particularly enjoyed the scene where, after seven years of dealing with his tardiness and generally slack work ethic, the Doctor has to kiss Tom Paris.

    What I liked about this episode was that it kept me guessing. For a while when the EMH was on the run in the ship, I was sure he was actually still in the holodeck. Of course, he wasn't.

    The penultimate scene, with the EMH's "dying" confessions, absolutely took the cake. So he was keeping tabs on Janeway, didn't like Kim's saxophone playing, and is madly in love with Seven? The line about him averting his eyes during her "routine maintenance" was delivered so straight that I couldn't help but guffaw. Great, great, great.

    I also liked the two Hierarchy aliens--another Adamsish touch, with the evil alien underling who's actually not so evil--he just wants to open up a used parts store, and he's really a sensitive guy. They almost reminded me of a Robert Holmes double act from Doctor Who, now that I think about it. I LOLed when the "subordinate" said, "It really was useful, after all.

    So after a few misfires, it's nice to see the show go out on a high note.

    Oh, there's another episode to watch?
     
  8. Jetfire

    Jetfire Guest

    I think this is a great ep but what really sealed the deal was his "dying" confessions. :guffaw:

    After all that I wouldn't be able to face the crew. :sigh:
     
  9. Shatnertage

    Shatnertage Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    The next scene where Janeway talks to his shadow for a minute was interesting, too. I didn't know where that was going, but it was a different way of shooting it.
     
  10. HoneyBLilly

    HoneyBLilly Commodore Commodore

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    I always liked "Homestead" it was a nice reminder that the show was ending. I still cry/laugh when Tuvok does his "dance" before he leaves, I guess smiling would have been too much.

    I loved the Doctors confessions at the end of "Renaissance Man" that's actually one of the only things I remember since I haven't seen this episode in a while.
     
  11. T.D. Possum

    T.D. Possum Commodore Commodore

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    This is one of the funniest episodes in Trek, to my mind. How can anyone not love half the cast playing Robert Picardo's EMH?

    Also:

    [​IMG]
     
  12. JanewayRulz!

    JanewayRulz! Vice Admiral Admiral

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    ;)

    I thought what sealed the deal was B'Elanna's response to Janeway.

    :rolleyes:

    EMH: Goodbye, my friends. Speak well of me. (disappears)
    JANEWAY: Is he?
    TORRES: No, I've got him.

    :guffaw:

    Oh, and the "no opera" rule on the holodeck. THAT was priceless!

    :bolian:
     
  13. T.D. Possum

    T.D. Possum Commodore Commodore

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    ^ Oh, you know what else? Torres' attitude toward the EMH's melodramatics = hilarious!
     
  14. JanewayRulz!

    JanewayRulz! Vice Admiral Admiral

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    Did she do an eyeroll?

    :klingon:

    Shatnerage, maybe you can answer that one.

    :rommie:
     
  15. Athena28

    Athena28 Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Neelix grew on me over the years so I didn't clap as much as I would have when he left. It was a decent sendoff for him. Probably better than just going to the Alpha Q. with the rest of the crew.
     
  16. Shatnertage

    Shatnertage Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    I actually felt bad to see him go.

    I wouldn't have believed you if you'd told me that a few months ago.

    Not sure if she physically did an eyeroll, but it's totally in her body language. She's just absolutely disinterested, and methodically saves his program while totally ignoring him.
     
  17. HoneyBLilly

    HoneyBLilly Commodore Commodore

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    I always thought B'Elanna was just thinking that the Doctor was going to get it when he came back.
     
  18. Shatnertage

    Shatnertage Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    Yeah--her attitude is basically that of a skilled physician treating a hypochondriac who starts his deathbed confessions after he stubs his toe.

    And, depending on how smoothly dinner goes tonight (mother-in-law is coming over), I may be watching "Endgame" later this evening.
     
  19. exodus

    exodus Fleet Admiral Admiral

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    I think one ofthe best things about Voyager is, the writers didn't feel they needed to kill off main characters like Kes & Neelix to say good-bye to them. They simply allowed the characters to leave and continue life beyond Voyager. They didn't fall back on the cliche of if the actor leaves, kill off the character. Not that I'm against character death but I'm glad they went a more creative route this time.
     
  20. Shatnertage

    Shatnertage Rear Admiral Rear Admiral

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    At long last my voyage has taken me to the...

    "Endgame"

    The show starts with Voyager doing some stunt-flying by the Golden Gate bridge, with a voiceover letting us know that the ship's been home for 10 years, and it took them 23 to get there.

    "Wow," I say to my wife. "That's the shortest finale ever. Glad everything worked out. Now we'll just get two hours of Janeway standing with her hands on her hips."

    But naturally nothing is that easy.

    The main story is, of course, Admiral Janeway's time-traveling. That, as others have mentioned, seems to be a re-use of the plot for "Timeless," and I've got to agree. Clearly, they couldn't just have them find some random anomaly and go home without incident. There had to be a conflict, and logically speaking the only baddie big enough to qualify is the Borg. Are you going to have Janeway face down the Hierarchy or Tak Tak to get home? Probably not. So I can see exactly why the writers made the choices they made.

    That being said, they also put two other stories in here: the suddenly-blossoming romance between Chakotay and Seven, and the birth of Miral Paris. Miral's birth, of course, you knew was coming. There was no way Torres wasn't going to go into labor in the climax of the finale. The other one...well, I believe there's been enough said about that relationship already.

    I loved Tom's scene as the nervous dad-to-be, being woken up by B'Elanna and totally nervous/frazzled. That happened to me not too long ago, so I can relate. Some nice domestic comedy.

    In general, I was underwhelmed by "Endgame." It's not that it was badly made, it's just that it doesn't feel that fresh. The unexpected things (C/7) aren't necessarily good, and a lot of it feels like we've seen it before. We've already seen Janeway go toe to toe with the Borg Queen. We've already seen the future version of an officer haunted by the death of his beloved (Worf/Riker in "All Good Things"). And we've already seen this kind of time travel episode.

    I liked how the characters developed--the Doctor ("Joe") is married, suggesting that holograms do indeed have "human" rights. What this does for the characters that Paris uses in his best-selling holo-novels, I have no idea. Janeway's an admiral, and Barclay is a confident instructor at Starfleet Academy. Torres is some kind of ambassador to the Klingon Empire, and Vaughan Armstrong gets yet another Voyager role.

    Things don't turn out so well for Seven, Chakotay, and Tuvok, though.

    And Kim becomes a captain, but it's a ship called the Rhode Island. I haven't spent much time there, but that's just not a name that inspires a lot of respect.

    So Admiral Janeway tries to undo the idealistic mistake Captain Janeway made in "Caretaker," but Captain Janeway won't let her. Again, it bookends the series, with Janeway making major decisions to stay in the Delta Quadrant and then to get home, but it also feels like we're going places we've already been.

    The final confrontation between Janeway and the Borg Queen was as expected. I'm not sure whether all the Borg were killed, all their transwarp conduits were destroyed, or what happened. And I really don't understand how Voyager got inside that Borg sphere, either.

    And, wow, that end just...happens. Janeway says, "We did it," and that's it.

    I'll be posting some more thoughts about the show when I have time.