A Niner Watches Babylon 5 (NO spoilers, please)

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Re: A Niner Watches Babylon 5

OTOH, anything that actually spent twenty-two episodes "setting the scene" instead of putting the absolute best work they could right up front would be an automatic and pretty thorough FAIL. Even if your best at the time is halting or inconsistent - ie, TNG - you have to go for it. No "plan" justifies any less.

The idea was that if they spent the time to show what "normal" was, then it would be more effective when they turned everything on its head.

It doesn't matter what the idea was - to do it that way would be a thorough waste of time and resources. Every episode should be the very best on its own that it can be.

In fact it's not my impression that the series comes together that way at all - the first year is some of the best stuff IMAO - so it's a moot point to me.

As much as I love the entirety of season three when all that "triggers get pulled," I prefer the first two seasons because of the variety and creativity...

Yep. Seasons one and two are the most interesting. Overall, though, the series is a great mediocrity and an example of failed potential. This is why despite a dedicated core fan base that keeps the memory of the show alive the audience for it has never grown substantially - there's not a lot of "there," there.

 

[Neroon]

Re: A Niner Watches Babylon 5

I couldn't disagree more about the reasons for the series' success. Certainly B5 hasn't had the notoriety of BSG, but then it never had the corporate backing that show or TNG as another example ever did. Personally, I felt the series accomplished its goals for the most and did so well. Along with that there were certainly shortcomings and missed marks; that can't be denied.

Your opinion is certainly valid and I respect your qualifications, but I see it as being in the minority as to which seasons are the best. At least based upon my encounters at various conventions and computer bulletin boards. To call the series a mediocrity depends much upon subjective material. In the end the series is not so widely know, but that hardly means it is mediocre.

 

[Orac Zen]

Re: A Niner Watches Babylon 5

...people are constantly calling it the greatest sci-fi show of all time...

They are wrong.

Your opinion being so much more authoritative and correct than theirs, presumably?




This could be amusing. Sometimes these types of threads devolve into idiotic "I know better than you" / "you're wrong" / "if you (dis)like this you're an imbecile" gibberish (as we've already seen), and I end up avoiding them. Here's hoping this one won't go down that track.

 

[stonester1]

Re: A Niner Watches Babylon 5

I couldn't disagree more about the reasons for the series' success. Certainly B5 hasn't had the notoriety of BSG, but then it never had the corporate backing that show or TNG as another example ever did. Personally, I felt the series accomplished its goals for the most and did so well. Along with that there were certainly shortcomings and missed marks; that can't be denied.

Your opinion is certainly valid and I respect your qualifications, but I see it as being in the minority as to which seasons are the best. At least based upon my encounters at various conventions and computer bulletin boards. To call the series a mediocrity depends much upon subjective material. In the end the series is not so widely know, but that hardly means it is mediocre.

Indeed. IMO, it's a landmark in science fiction, especially TV science fiction, and it's one of the shows that pioneered it's use of the "arc" or "novel" form.

A new Babbler! Aww...cute...looking forward to his exploration!

Jealous, too. B5 is one of those shows that, if it's your kind of show, AMAZES the first time through.

And that media centric ep you mentioned, B5 had two of them. Both were favs of mine.

 

[Gepard]

Re: A Niner Watches Babylon 5

As someone who also has never watched B5, I'll be following this thread intently as well, so I'll finally know what the hell everybody is talking about.

 

[TheGodBen]

Re: A Niner Watches Babylon 5

Although I've rarely found B5 dull even at its worst, those first four episodes contain what I consider two of the worst episodes the show ever did (Soul Hunter and Infection) and though I personally enjoyed the other two, I know that many fans aren't crazy about them.

Oh gods, I remember hating those two episodes. I felt that Midnight on the Firing Line was okay, but Soul Hunter made me want to give up. I gave the show another shot with Born to the Purple only to be disappointed, so after that I waited a week or two before moving on to Infection, and that episode successfully killed my interest in the show. One of the reasons why I'm doing this thread is that I hope it will give me a motivation to continue past the rough first season, just like the Voyager thread helped me get through that show's third season.

This could be amusing. Sometimes these types of threads devolve into idiotic "I know better than you" / "you're wrong" / "if you (dis)like this you're an imbecile" gibberish

Hmm, sounds almost exactly like my M.O.

 

[Hyperspace05]

Re: A Niner Watches Babylon 5

So if you saw those episodes, where did you post the reviews? Or are you just going to post them when you finish the season?

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Re: A Niner Watches Babylon 5

...Soul Hunter made me want to give up.

Well, the dialogue on the show rarely got as bad as it was in Soul Hunter.

 

[Forbin]

Re: A Niner Watches Babylon 5

A four page thread on B5 just since I last logged on this morning!?!?

I'm never gonna get a chance to read the whole thread.

 

[RoJoHen]

Re: A Niner Watches Babylon 5

As someone who also has never watched B5, I'll be following this thread intently as well, so I'll finally know what the hell everybody is talking about.

Maybe you should start watching it, too!

The last time there was a big thread like this, it motivated me to re-watch it from the beginning, and it was even more awesome than the first time.

 

[Harvey]

Re: A Niner Watches Babylon 5

...Soul Hunter made me want to give up.

Well, the dialogue on the show rarely got as bad as it was in Soul Hunter.

And that was the heavily re-written version of the script, too. But I'm not big on the first season, which basically comes down to six episodes that really matter and a lot of mediocre universe-building (which, in retrospect, has a little more value, but not a lot more). IMO.

 

[Orac Zen]

Re: A Niner Watches Babylon 5

This could be amusing. Sometimes these types of threads devolve into idiotic "I know better than you" / "you're wrong" / "if you (dis)like this you're an imbecile" gibberish

Hmm, sounds almost exactly like my M.O.

I was being polite for a change, but if you want to own up that's okay, too.

 

[StarshipDefiant]

Re: A Niner Watches Babylon 5

I personally thought the first six episodes of season one (Especially "Soul Hunter" and "Infection") were kind of "meh" even worst that I ended up seeing them about a half a dozen times before I was able to get going on the series and fully watch it. Aside from some set ups and character establishment, this episode (or even some characters) don't really mean much in the long run.

Give it another ago, and get past the first six, and you'll be glad (maybe) you did, I know I was. I sat though them, finally fell in love with the show and kept with it to the end.

 

[tomalak301]

Re: A Niner Watches Babylon 5

Of the first 6, Soul Hunter and Infection were the ones I didn't really like. I really liked Born to the Purple, and people didn't like Bester's first episode, Mind War? I thought that was one of the season's best?

 

[StarshipDefiant]

Re: A Niner Watches Babylon 5

Of the first 6, Soul Hunter and Infection were the ones I didn't really like. I really liked Born to the Purple, and people didn't like Bester's first episode, Mind War? I thought that was one of the season's best?

"Mind War" was pretty good, and reminded me of why Sinclair just reeks of bad assery.

 

[Kegg]

Re: A Niner Watches Babylon 5

As far as appeal goes, I think B5 is basically a cult show because you simply have to be willing to overlook a lot of problems, like acting, SFX, music and occasionally writing - be someone willing and inclined to appreciate the show for its broader scope and all that. Something like nuBSG isn't as good when it comes to the big picture and the answers to the big questions, but it's also rather superior in all of those other fiddly little details (which are far more important for any show on a day-to-day basis).

Basically, you've just got to be a geek. We're more than patient for all of this if we just get our little bit of space opera world building on the side; and B5 is one of the best concieved space opera universes on TV, full of epic sweeping political stuff and character arcs, so naturally some go gaga.

It's always so silly to me how people proclaim these sorts of things so matter-of-factly.

Well, they are wrong. Farscape is the greatest sci-fi show of all time.

I will concede this point.

This is factually true.

Oh gods, I remember hating those two episodes. I felt that Midnight on the Firing Line was okay, but Soul Hunter made me want to give up. I gave the show another shot with Born to the Purple only to be disappointed, so after that I waited a week or two before moving on to Infection, and that episode successfully killed my interest in the show.

Hence the great wisdom of that guy who made me watch In the Beginning first. I would never have stuck with season one without it ringing in my ears, to be perfectly honest, and even if it's a too spoilerific opening it's still one of the better outings of the franchise.

 

[Sykonee]

Re: A Niner Watches Babylon 5

By the way, a website you may want to check out as you're watching the series is the Lurker's Guide, where a bunch of info regarding episodes and discussion from JMS is included. Most of it was done as the episodes aired, so there isn't anything that'll heavily spoil subsequent episodes so long as you only read its contents after you've watched an episode.

It's very... enlightening.

 

[Admiral Buzzkill]

Re: A Niner Watches Babylon 5

Of the first 6, Soul Hunter and Infection were the ones I didn't really like. I really liked Born to the Purple, and people didn't like Bester's first episode, Mind War? I thought that was one of the season's best?

"Mind War" was pretty good, and reminded me of why Sinclair just reeks of bad assery.

"Mind War" was pretty damned cool.

And that was the heavily re-written version of the script, too. But I'm not big on the first season, which basically comes down to six episodes that really matter and a lot of mediocre universe-building (which, in retrospect, has a little more value, but not a lot more). IMO.

Oh, there were seven or eight good episodes - stories only "matter" if they're good, not because they fit into and advance some kind of "arc." It doesn't help that the metastory in B5 was mediocre, derivative and ended in a sham climax ("Get out of our galaxy!").

 

[Lindley]

Re: A Niner Watches Babylon 5

Spoiler: Into the Fire

Everyone always focuses on that line, which entirely misses the point of the ending. I wish JMS hadn't put it in there.

 

[zakkrusz]

Re: A Niner Watches Babylon 5

It's definitely possible to enjoy both DS9 and Babylon 5.

<---Living Proof right here.

It was certainly a much better show after season 1 though.