I never really liked it, but I accepted it as useful for new viewers. However, they are no longer new viewers, so I don't see the point.
6.5x08 Let's Kill Hitler (Grading/Discussion) (SPOILERS!!)
- Thread starter Samurai8472
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The Amy intro is lacking on the iTunes download. I can't say that I missed it.
Thankfully, the Amy intro was dropped on the DVDs of the first half of the season. One would assume they'll do the same with the second half.
For the record I never liked it. Doctor Who has never needed an intro at the beginning, and adding one is really pointless.
For the record I never liked it. Doctor Who has never needed an intro at the beginning, and adding one is really pointless.
Actually, the Amy intro makes it sound like the show is about AMY and her travels/adventures with the doctor and not about the Doctor and his travels with a companion (or two or three).
Well, frankly, these days, it is.
Just like Series One and Two were about Rose and her adventures with the Doctor. And Series Three was about Martha and her adventures with the Doctor.
Really, Series Four and the Specials were the first Doctor Who seasons not to be told from the point of view of the companion. There's a reason that "Rose," "Smith and Jones," and "The Eleventh Hour" all began with the companion meeting the Doctor rather than beginning with the Doctor meeting the companion. The Doctor wasn't the POV character.
How did she know it was her last kiss with him? She could just try grab him and snog him again. But seems to imply reverse order if his first is her last. I don't buy that though.
Moffat's said that River was describing broad patterns, not every individual encounter. People need to stop being so literal.
I've just realised that there's either a huge plot hole, or that there's a big piece of this story yet to be told.
In "The Impossible Astronaut," River told Rory about how the Doctor first appeared to her when she was a little girl, and how he knew everything about her despite her never having met him before, and how it started her fascination with him.
That does not match IN ANY WAY with what we saw in this episode. Here River was an adult when she first met the Doctor, and she already knew all about him, both from Amy's stories and because she'd been raised to believe her mission was to kill him. If this was the first time she met him, then she couldn't have met him as a little girl, whatever the incarnation (Melody, Mels, River). Likewise, the Doctor didn't know who the girl in the spacesuit was, he didn't recognise Mels, had never seen her before in fact, so he couldn't have visited her as a little girl, and the River we know never even was a little girl.
So unless River was lying to Rory (which she had no reason to do), or Moffat made a massive mistake (and as a rule he doesn't make that kind of mistake), then there's a lot more to this story than has yet been revealed.
Also, if River (aka Melody) actually was the girl in the space suit, why did Adult River act like she didn't remember being that girl when she was investigating alongside the Doctor in TIA? Just because she didn't want to expose him to "spoilers" ?
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In "The Impossible Astronaut," River told Rory about how the Doctor first appeared to her when she was a little girl, and how he knew everything about her despite her never having met him before, and how it started her fascination with him.
That does not match IN ANY WAY with what we saw in this episode. Here River was an adult when she first met the Doctor, and she already knew all about him, both from Amy's stories and because she'd been raised to believe her mission was to kill him. If this was the first time she met him, then she couldn't have met him as a little girl, whatever the incarnation (Melody, Mels, River). Likewise, the Doctor didn't know who the girl in the spacesuit was, he didn't recognise Mels, had never seen her before in fact, so he couldn't have visited her as a little girl, and the River we know never even was a little girl.
So unless River was lying to Rory (which she had no reason to do), or Moffat made a massive mistake (and as a rule he doesn't make that kind of mistake), then there's a lot more to this story than has yet been revealed.
Also, if River (aka Melody) actually was the girl in the space suit, why did Adult River act like she didn't remember being that girl when she was investigating alongside the Doctor in TIA? Just because she didn't want to expose him to "spoilers" ?
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I wasn't taking it just in a literal way. River did look genuinely shocked at the fact it was his first.
I agree something else is going on here (i hope). But Mels said something to the effect that it was her first time to meet him. But if it's young Melody preregeneration in the Space suit this might explain River's words. We don't know what the Doctor and the Spacesuit person talked about.
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Actually, River didn't tell Rory she was a "little girl" when she first met the Doctor, she says she was a "young girl" which could be interpreted as her bieng as old as in her 20s.
Most likely.
^ I'm half-expecting something to happen to the assassin's memory before she becomes Mels - maybe as a consequence of regenerating at such a young age. River did say that her memory was fuzzy. Perhaps she's partially recovered it by the time of her conversation with Rory.
The Doctor and River's first meeting from River's perspective:
Granted, the above is via a ganger, but it should've been indistinguishable from reality for baby Melody.
I think there is more significance to his reaction to the kiss than we might have figured. River seemed troubled that she and the doctor did not have a 'relationship' involving kissing before that kiss. Almost as though she worries that something has gone amiss in the timeline, that time has been rewritten for him but not for her. :confusing much??:
But no, they are not meeting in reverse order that much is clear. The matching diaries and synching them up, and the already mixed up order of their meetings.
Overall, a thoroughly thrilling episode. While I wish we had seen more of Hitler and the era, I do like how they, as someone already noted in this thread, just punch Hitler and shove him into a cupboard and that was it. The point of the episode was to compound on the whole River Song/Silence/Everything Else arc and I loved what we go, but at the same time, leaving us longing for more answers.
That being said, I do find myself agreeing with some people in regards the show getting a bit too complicated/convoluted for its own good. I still trust Moffat to have this all worked out by the end of the season.
Which leads me to something I realized while reading this thread. A lot of people in this forum are reminding me of the Lost fans back in the day in the Lost forum in regards to "too many questions," "not enough answers," "too complicated/convoluted," "stop leading us on," etc.
That being said, I do find myself agreeing with some people in regards the show getting a bit too complicated/convoluted for its own good. I still trust Moffat to have this all worked out by the end of the season.
Which leads me to something I realized while reading this thread. A lot of people in this forum are reminding me of the Lost fans back in the day in the Lost forum in regards to "too many questions," "not enough answers," "too complicated/convoluted," "stop leading us on," etc.
That was my first thought when they started talking about said question.
That would certainly be an interesting twist on the old joke and show title. But does that mean The Doctor's name is 42?
That line had me in stitches. If we see the antibodies again in the future, will it become the new "Exterminate" and "Resistance is futile?"
I completely agree on this point, unfortunately, although it should be noted that it's not just Moffat's fault. RTD started the ball rolling but Moffat kept it going. With each regeneration (either full-on/proper or false/fake-out) I finding myself wishing they would tone it down. I really don't like the whole standing up regeneration with super gold glowing energy pouring all over the place out of the head and sleeves. I much preferred the quieter, somber, reflective regenerations of old instead of the spastic, hyperactive regenerations (although I realize that mode is reflective of the current show).
It just seemed that River was hugely disappointed that it was apparently her only kiss with him.
I'm sure she hoped/imagined/expected that there would be more than that.
Honestly, every time I think of a timeline without Hitler, it ends up looking worse. Can you imagine how much longer & more devastating WWII would have been had Germany been led by someone competant and sane and more interested in winning the war than in exterminating the Jews?
When Eccleston regenerated in a frenzy of yellow light particles in "The Parting of the Ways," I assumed that that was his body expelling the energy from the time vortex that he absorbed from Rose. Imagine my surprise when that continued to be how all regenerations look.
