Elaan is a good episode. I like it when the Elaan complains that she does not like it when nobody likes her. Well, Duh. If you treat people like inferiors; and act like a spoiled child, what do you expect? Also, it is good to see all of the regulars appear in this episode. The big three, along with Scotty, Sulu, Uhura, Chekov and Chapel all appear in this episode. Very rare indeed.
50th Anniversary Rewatch Thread
- Thread starter dahj
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"Elaan" is one of the best third season episodes, and easily the sexiest.
- France Nuyen has some really good costumes and she is smoking hot.
- Then you have Fred Steiner's stupendous music score. The love theme, the Klingon battle... gorgeous music. So glad it's out on CD.
- The Klingon miniature debuts and it's an instant classic, just like the music!
- With all of that going on, Star Trek's first interracial kiss is practically an afterthought. What a show!
- France Nuyen has some really good costumes and she is smoking hot.
- Then you have Fred Steiner's stupendous music score. The love theme, the Klingon battle... gorgeous music. So glad it's out on CD.
- The Klingon miniature debuts and it's an instant classic, just like the music!
- With all of that going on, Star Trek's first interracial kiss is practically an afterthought. What a show!
I'm not so convinced that we should apply human sensibilities to Elaan. I think she knows what she's doing. She knows exactly how to get people to like her - her tears. She even tries to manipulate Kirk into doing her bidding later in the episode. She's thinking on her feet to avoid her fate.
And this is again one of the many reasons I cannot get my kids to like TOS. My 22 year old son says to me he doesn't want to watch it because all the women are pathetic and have to be saved by men all the time. While this is a way over exaggeration this episode just proves his point.
The objectifying of Elaan by the slow pan of her body at the beginning is just the start. Its just wonderful that Kirk is just the man to show this upstart woman her place in life.
In Season One Kirk tells Charlie there's no right way to hit a woman. Maybe he's suddenly realised there is a right way to hit a woman if she "forces" you to do it. Or maybe its just the way Kirk deals with all spoiled brats. He slaps Trelane too,
And just because Shakespeare did it that doesn't mean its OK. Its no the sort of episode I'd use to encourage women to watch TOS. Also "Taming of the Shrew" has very little relevance in cultures where women are not "forced" to get married and obey their husbands
Still I like Elaan. At least she tries to escape her manipulation by the men in her life by trying a bit of manipulation herself. At least she has a spark. Not like that girl in TNG Picard was delivering in a forced marriage like thing and she and Picard just accepted it docilely..
Arranged marriages have been a part of human history a lot longer than they haven't. Ignoring history doesn't make it go away.
Your son has a point and it seemed like the writers went out of their way to make some women even worse than in the early drafts. Grace Lee Whitney described all the Yeomen , including Rand as cute and not very bright and that broad brush can be used a lot.
But not all the women in TOS are so lame. Vina and Number One, there are a few rebel leaders, Edith, Losira , Helen Noel redeems herself, Miranda Jones rejects male advances, and Uhura has her moments.
Harlan Ellison's City on the Edge of Forever early draft has the kind of women we should have seen.
And I'm guessing that in most cases of arranged marriages both parties have agreed (even if it were reluctantly) to the arrangement.
And shouldn't we support women (and its mostly women) who want out.
In GRs optimistic version of the future should Starfleet's finest (Captain Kirk) force a reluctant bride into a marriage?
Prime Directive. Other worlds have their own customs.
When Kirk saw that something was wrong he didn't hide behind the Prime Directive otherwise he would have let them kill the pregnant woman in Friday's child.
He's acting like Archer here,
One man's best line is another woman's cringiest line.
And it's not that it's "politically incorrect" that I object too, it's that that sort of statement can be made for the entire species, and that women of the species get singled out on account of "bitches be crazy, amirite guys!" is just the lowest of low hanging fruits of humour. It's an offense against humour first, then women.
Not one that aged well for sure.
If being annoyed about being forced to marry some green git, stabbing people who barge into your room uninvited, eating romulan chicken with your hands and chugging saurian brandy from the bottle is considered spoiled, uncivilized, unladylike and wrong then I sure as heck don't want to be right...
There's a nice episode in there somewhere, the Klingon conspiracy being afoot, the culture clash, nice costumes and spaceships, and even Elaan herself is quite an interesting character right up until she gets "tamed" by Kirk's dick and decides to do whatever he wants like a nice civilized lady...
Another weird thing that sticks out is that Kirk casually suggests forcing a mind-meld to extract information from his prisoner, which surely goes against several prisoner treatment conventions.
The battle bits were nicely done, one minor niggle is Sulu's suggestion he can't turn the ship fast enough without warp, that just makes no sense, if someone just got out an pushed it a ship should still be able to spin in place much quicker than a ship doing circles around it thousands of kilometers away.
I think it was just a volley in what we used to call "the Battle of the Sexes," from a time when we were able to acknowledge that such a thing existed.One man's best line is another woman's cringiest line.
And it's not that it's "politically incorrect" that I object too, it's that that sort of statement can be made for the entire species, and that women of the species get singled out on account of "bitches be crazy, amirite guys!" is just the lowest of low hanging fruits of humour. It's an offense against humour first, then women.
It wasn't "the Battle" that was the problem, it was the taking for granted that the one side is being "right."
One man's best line is another woman's cringiest line.
And it's not that it's "politically incorrect" that I object too, it's that that sort of statement can be made for the entire species, and that women of the species get singled out on account of "bitches be crazy, amirite guys!" is just the lowest of low hanging fruits of humour. It's an offense against humour first, then women.
Not one that aged well for sure.
If being annoyed about being forced to marry some green git, stabbing people who barge into your room uninvited, eating romulan chicken with your hands and chugging saurian brandy from the bottle is considered spoiled, uncivilized, unladylike and wrong then I sure as heck don't want to be right...
There's a nice episode in there somewhere, the Klingon conspiracy being afoot, the culture clash, nice costumes and spaceships, and even Elaan herself is quite an interesting character right up until she gets "tamed" by Kirk's dick and decides to do whatever he wants like a nice civilized lady...
Another weird thing that sticks out is that Kirk casually suggests forcing a mind-meld to extract information from his prisoner, which surely goes against several prisoner treatment conventions.
The battle bits were nicely done, one minor niggle is Sulu's suggestion he can't turn the ship fast enough without warp, that just makes no sense, if someone just got out an pushed it a ship should still be able to spin in place much quicker than a ship doing circles around it thousands of kilometers away.
See, you think Elaan is 'tamed' by Kirk. I think she's adjusting her strategy.
Who's saying they are? It was a male character expressing a male view on a show made by a bunch of men. And all the line was saying was basically that the behavior of women can mystify men. Not that women are "wrong".
The episode sure is trying to.
The whole thing seem to be framed to say that she is wrong, spoiled, petulant, arrogant, irrational and whatever else they actually call her out loud in the script...
Maybe had women had the chance to write more stuff, you guys wouldn't be so mystified.
And considering for how long the cultural landscape was predominantly male characters expressing a male view on films and shows made by a bunch of men you'll forgive me if I don't feel as nostalgic as you do for the times when "the Battle" was rather one-sided...
Deela and Odona were smart, clever and crafty as well.
It's true that Odona only seemed like she was brainless; she was playing Kirk all along.
Maybe had women had the chance to write more stuff, you guys wouldn't be so mystified.
And considering for how long the cultural landscape was predominantly male characters expressing a male view on films and shows made by a bunch of men you'll forgive me if I don't feel as nostalgic as you do for the times when "the Battle" was rather one-sided...
Some of the female guest stars fare better than the female crew who are often portrayed as unprofessional and mentally deficient. I can understand why the show needed everyman characters to explain stuff to the casual audience by asking dumb questions but it's a shame that the role fell so often to the women.
There were a lot of decent female characters in the movies of the forties and fifties but perhaps those characters were allowed to be smart because they weren't competing with the men (the heroine in the Thing from Another World basically instructs the soldiers how to take out the alien. I can't imagine that in Star Trek TOS).
I don't find DC Fontana's stories to be especially empowering for women, although I'm not sure how much was tweaked by the men in script revisions. It does seem that TOS women were only allowed to excel in female roles (telephonist, nursing, administration, psychology, therapy, biology). Rayna has an intellect that exceeds Spock but she acts like an imbecile. I think Charlene Masters might be the one exception as a competent physicist but she lucked out as she would have been a biologist who fell in love with a villain and betrayed the crew if Marla hadn't already stolen that plot.
My friend Scunner who is a sci-fi fan but not really up on his Trek, especially TOS, although he loves VOY, loves the scene where Elaan materialises on the Enterprise and keeps telling me as well, not sure why?
The music for this episode becomes the standard Klingon music which is a shame because the only other time we hear it in relation to the natives of Qu'Onos is in Day of The Dove! The theme turns up in other various episodes like For The World is Hollow and others and that Klingon ship is fantastic! As a kid I never realized that the ship made it's debut here and not in any of the earlier Klingon episodes like Errand of Mercy and A Private Little War! Although the new effects have changed that but messing with the effects of Elaan is criminal! The new scenes aren't a patch on the original classic!
JB
Overdeveloped head knowledge, underdeveloped social skills. With only a smitten guardian/creator for company, she doesn't have much practice with meeting new people and interacting with somebody who's had a different life than hers.
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